Kind of weird Stanley #3

[Kees Heiden]

I got the itch to invest in some low knob Stanleys. I allready had a #7 for wuite some time and now I bought a 3, a 4 and a 6. This is absolutely no gloat because they were quite expensive. We don't have these old ones overhere in The Netherlands too often. It's usually all the post war UK made stuff.

I still have to do some work on the planes. I love the patina, so I will only clean them up and do the necessary technical work. The 4 and the 6 look like they aren't too bad. The 3 though is a bit weird.

I looked through all the Stanley type studies and came to the conclusion that this is either a franken plane or Stanley combed out all the storage bins to come up with this one.

The bottom has "No" and "3" on the nose in front of the knob, about 1"apart. That would indicate type 7 or type 8. There are no other marks or patent dates or whatever. It has the old frog receiver like in the type 6, 7 and 8.

The frog has no casting marks either. No frog adjusting screw but it does have the lateral lever with the round disc. It sais only Stanley on the lever, no patent dates. That lever would indicate at least a type 6, but it doesn't have the patent dates. The depth adjuster wheel is the real surprise. It is the small one, there are no patent dates again, but is has RIGHT HAND THREAD! The last ones with right hand thread were type 5, but those had the one piece lateral lever.

Makes it all kind of interesting. The two adjusters are contradicting each other and are both not from the same period as the bottom. It really doesn't matter of course. I like this small plane allready, just have to do some work on it.

314824

314825

[Jim Koepke]

The last ones with right hand thread were type 5

There in lies your confusion. All three of my type 6 planes have right hand threads.

My suspicion on the lateral lever is it could be a replacement. Another possibility is the patent dates were stamped in separately from the STANLEY logo and some levers might have been missed.

My #8 is one of those fall through the cracks of what may be a post type 6 yet pre type 7. It has no dates on the lateral lever. My recollection is one patent date remained through type 8. Some were even used on early type 9 planes.

One has to recall Stanley was in the tool making business. They had no compulsion to ensure the type studies of a century later would be accurate.

jtk

[Kees Heiden]

I see! But the original type study tells us the type 6 came with left hand thread: http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/type_study.php#Type 6
I don't think they replaced the lateral lever, the rivet looks very factory made.
That still leaves the bottom which would be a type 7 or 8. But it would be very possible that this frog and bottom lived together all that time.
Or maybe this is indeed a type 6 to type 7 interim model.

:cool:

[steven c newman]

Just picked up a Type 6 No.5 over the weekend. It has right hand threads on the 1" diameter wheel. However, inside the wheel is all them Bailey patent dates. Three patent date on the lateral lever.

Your base looks the same as the #5's base. Same with the frog. On mine, there is a slight, raised boss with a No. 5 cast on it. lever cap looks the same. May be a 6a-7 transitional plane?

[Mel Miller]

I see! But the original type study tells us the type 6 came with left hand thread: http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/type_study.php#Type 6
I don't think they replaced the lateral lever, the rivet looks very factory made.
That still leaves the bottom which would be a type 7 or 8. But it would be very possible that this frog and bottom lived together all that time.
Or maybe this is indeed a type 6 to type 7 interim model.

:cool:

Roger Smith's type study for the type 7 planes states: " Adj. nuts in most planes of this type have left hand threads". AFAIK, all the other type studies came later, and were based on Roger's work. I believe there's a mistake in the study you referenced.

[Kees Heiden]

So, there is a bit of uncertainty about the time when the right hand thread was introduced.

The bottom has all the type 7 features, the lateral lever has only Stanley which came from type 8 onwards (or they made some without patent dates earlier too). And it has right hand thread.

Well, I think I can say the plane is from the 1890's.

I will have a look tonight at the other two planes. I have allready forgotten what type they are (shows how important this really is...), but I think the #6 is a type 6, with left hand thread.

[Tom Vanzant]

Kees, even as Stanley phased in new versions, he did not throw out the older version parts. He used them, resulting in some factory-made Frankenplanes. Some prototype parts get into the production line too. I have a #3 with "Made in USA" along the right side the tote, and the sole not machined at all, but it made it out the door. A curious plane, but not a user.

[Jim Koepke]

So, there is a bit of uncertainty about the time when the right hand thread was introduced.

Do you mean left hand thread and the uncertainty?

Since right hand threads were on the originals made by Bailey himself it has often made me wonder if he might have been left handed.

Then again, he may have been utilizing parts that were easily available at the time.

jtk

[Kees Heiden]

It looks like my #3 is a type 6a. I found this chart which is very helpfull and indeed continues the right hand thread until the type 7.
http://primeshop.com/access/woodwork/stanleyplane/pftsynch.htm
After polishing the lateral lever a bit (it was painted) the three patent dates apear. So, everything matches the type 6a.

My "new" #6 is a type 8 (it has the B foundry marks) and my #4 is a type 7 (S foundry marks). The rest of the characteristics are matching too. Just the "No" and "6" marks are close together, while the type study wants them to be spaced 1" apart. But maybe they only did that on the smaller planes due to lack of space.

So, no Frankenplanes after all. Just a slight error on the hyperkitten webpage.

Now, onto cleaning and getting them to work.

[Jim Koepke]

My "new" #6 is a type 8 (it has the B foundry marks) and my #4 is a type 7 (S foundry marks).

I picked up a #8 type 7 (S foundry mark) with a broken frog for $5. A replacement frog cost me about $40 and is a type 8 (B foundry mark). It is my most expensive $5 plane. As for type, I call it a BS plane.

jtk

[Greg Wease]

Kees, don't forget that the Type studies were completed for #4 planes. Timing of changes made (types) in other models varied somewhat based on inventory of parts for that size plane.

[Kees Heiden]

That's for sure Greg.

Jim, nice story about the BS plane. You sure live in a better place then me to find such old Stanleys. It' a pitty that shipping over the ocean is so expensive. It would have been better if I had concentrated on vintage Nooitgedagt wooden planes.