Cordless Drill/Drivers...what's hot?

[John Coloccia]

Time for the weekly cordless drill and impact driver thread. What's hot these days? I'm generally happy with my Makita (BDF452 and matching impact driver), but one of the batteries is completely dead, and I can't imagine spending $70 each on new batteries....seems crazy when the entire kit was about $200 new. Anyhow, the drill chuck always had a bit of runout anyway, and so many people have had battery issues over the years, I'm thinking it's time to cut my losses.

I'm checking out some Milwaukee stuff. What do we think? Any other suggestions or comments? I don't want my drills to turn into disposable products, like everything else these days.

[michael langman]

Hi John, I have a 12 V Makita drill that I bought reconditioned from CPO and I had a weak battery from the start 3-4 years ago.
Now that both batteries, 2.6 Ah, are bad, I am going to cut them open with my little air grinder and cut off wheel and replace the bad cells inside.
Can,t get much cheaper then that if you have the time and patience to do it.

[John Coloccia]

As I understand it, part of the problem is once the Makita pack is detected as bad, there's circuitry in there that kills the pack and prevents it from working again. I'm not sure these new Lithium ion packs are repairable...not the Makita ones, anyhow, and that's part of why I want the Makita's gone. It was a great little kit for the price, but between a mediocre chuck, questionable battery life (mine did OK but a lot of others have had horrible complaints) and things like that, it's time to retire it for a more grownup kit.

My old Porter-Cable lasted forever. My Hitachi lasted forever (still going, actually). What's out there that's going to give me some good life and is maintainable. I'm not into Festool, BTW. Their drills are about the only thing I can't stand from them.

[Bill Richardson]

I've been running the 12 volt Milwaukees hard for over a year now with no complaints.

[John Lanciani]

Brushless motors are the big thing. More torque and longer run times per charge.

[Mike Henderson]

I've been using DeWalt, mostly 12V for small drill and driver, and have been happy with them. I also have DeWalt 20V tools and those have been working fine, also. I hear good things about Milwaukee tools but no experience with them.

The thing I like about the DeWalt 12V tools is that they're light while still having sufficient power. Previously I had the DeWalt 18V tools and the weight of those was starting to get to me. The DeWalt 20V tools are lighter than the 18V tools but the 12V are even better.

Mike

[Tim Cooper Louisiana]

Milwaukee 18v FUEL 1/4 Brushless Impact Driver #2653-20. I love this thing. It is perfect. I went the Makita route and had an issue with all of the batteries. Switched over to Milwaukee for my cordless tools, and I've been very satisfied. I've had a good assortment of their tools, for a little over two years, and I've never had a battery fail. I bought a milwaukee chuck adapter for my impact driver, and now I never reach for my drill/driver or hammer drill.

It has the electronic gears, and they work well. In the past I kept a little 12v drill/driver for lighter duty stuff. I should sell it.

I promise that I don't work for Milwaukee :P. If you do go the Milwaukee route, I'd also check out the 1 handed reciprocating saw. It's pretty handy.

[Andrew Hughes]

I like my Panasonic cordless, Its been a good user for about 8or 9 years battery's have been redone once by MTo battery's.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Time for the weekly cordless drill and impact driver thread. What's hot these days? I'm generally happy with my Makita (BDF452 and matching impact driver), but one of the batteries is completely dead, and I can't imagine spending $70 each on new batteries....seems crazy when the entire kit was about $200 new. Anyhow, the drill chuck always had a bit of runout anyway, and so many people have had battery issues over the years, I'm thinking it's time to cut my losses.

I'm checking out some Milwaukee stuff. What do we think? Any other suggestions or comments? I don't want my drills to turn into disposable products, like everything else these days.


John - I have the black driver, a bigger 1/2" green driver, and the green impact. I got 2 of the small batteries, and 3 of the large ones. One of the small batteries is dead and gone, but the big ones are still fine. Maybe it is the small batteries that are the weak link?

I remember talking with you about your thoughts right after you bought your Makita stuff, and the influenced my decision. SO - [a] my stuff is the same age as yours, and [b] if it fails - that's on you.

[Rich Riddle]

My current favorites are the brushless Makita models. Backup are the Bosch lines.

[Erik Loza]

Funny: I just went through this about 3 weeks ago with my old 14.4V DeWalt gun. Bought the 20V DeWalt brushless "max" version at HD and been really impressed with it so far. Lighweight, battery life is good, chuck is much nicer than the old one. But I would have kept the old 14.4V one if I could have found batteries at a reasonable price.

Erik

[Kent A Bathurst]

But I would have kept the old 14.4V one if I could have found batteries at a reasonable price.

Erik

You summed the game in a nutshell, Erik.

The manufacturers move on, the old gear in their rearview. The consumer is boxed in, in terms of discarding the main gear, in favor of new gear that is supported.

Oh - wait......are we talking about cordless drills/drivers, or PCs? :p :p

[mreza Salav]

I have had a pair of Makita and won't buy again. I've had Ridgid and the life-time-service (or whatever it is) is good for batteries. So far the price of the new batteries I've got has paid for them already. I've a pair of Milwaukee as well and so far have been happy with them.

[John Coloccia]

John - I have the black driver, a bigger 1/2" green driver, and the green impact. I got 2 of the small batteries, and 3 of the large ones. One of the small batteries is dead and gone, but the big ones are still fine. Maybe it is the small batteries that are the weak link?

I remember talking with you about your thoughts right after you bought your Makita stuff, and the influenced my decision. SO - [a] my stuff is the same age as yours, and [b] if it fails - that's on you.

Really, I don't regret it. I definitely got my money's worth out of them, no question, and I still have one battery that's working OK. The ones I have are absolutely perfectly sized for shop use. I think Milwaukee makes similarly sized ones too now, though their batteries are no better in the pricing department. I think it will generally be a little higher quality, though, so it's OK. I'll probably hang on to these and see if any of the aftermarket, no-name batteries work OK. They're only $35 each, so I don't mind trying one out just to see. You may be right about the small batteries being the weak link, but I have to say that I didn't really do anything particularly special to take care of them, and I got quite a good bit of use out of them. I'm more concerned about buying new batteries because SO many people have complained about them. I'm worried I'll get a dud and end up just throwing away $70. If it wasn't for their terrible reputation, I'd even consider just buying another battery, but it's too risky when I can just jump ship for just a bit more $$$.

[Chris Padilla]

There are outfits that will refurbish your dead batteries with fresh cells a la Mr. Langman. Some cells are easier to open than others. I had some outfit from PA (name escapes me and I can't locate 'em online right now) refresh my Festool batteries. They are often cheaper than new batteries and can further often upgrade the cells with longer life batteries so you can go longer between charges. Some can upgrade from NiCd to LiNi to give even better performance.

[Pat Barry]

Time for the weekly cordless drill and impact driver thread. What's hot these days? I'm generally happy with my Makita (BDF452 and matching impact driver), but one of the batteries is completely dead, and I can't imagine spending $70 each on new batteries....seems crazy when the entire kit was about $200 new. Anyhow, the drill chuck always had a bit of runout anyway, and so many people have had battery issues over the years, I'm thinking it's time to cut my losses.

I'm checking out some Milwaukee stuff. What do we think? Any other suggestions or comments? I don't want my drills to turn into disposable products, like everything else these days.
Check Amazon. You can get replacement batteries 1/2 the price you stated.

[Paul Incognito]

I had the 18v Makita impact and hammer drill. When they got stolen I replaced them with Milwaukee 18v Fuel and consider it to be a big step up. That's what lives in the truck.
For the shop I still have the Makita 18v black and white drill and impact. One battery is next to useless. When I get tired enough of it I'll replace them with Milwaukee as well.
My 2 cents.
Paul

[John Coloccia]

There are outfits that will refurbish your dead batteries with fresh cells a la Mr. Langman. Some cells are easier to open than others. I had some outfit from PA (name escapes me and I can't locate 'em online right now) refresh my Festool batteries. They are often cheaper than new batteries and can further often upgrade the cells with longer life batteries so you can go longer between charges. Some can upgrade from NiCd to LiNi to give even better performance.

Here's the problem with these packs:

http://www.recellyourbattery.com/makita-18v

It's the disabling of the battery that is the real problem. As far as I know, it's impossible to fix once the battery is flagged as bad. I've been out of the shop a while because of the twins and a change in my business, and now I have a dead pack. It's kind of dumb, so given that I don't have a lot into it at the moment, there's no reason for me to really do anything other than change brands to something that doesn't have this sort of pathological problem. When I was in the shop everyday, these batteries performed pretty flawlessly everyday for a good long while, and the drill and driver itself are really nice, other than a very slight wobble from the chuck. My old Hitachi was much better, but the Makita's is no worse than any other ones I've seen lately. I'm not sure if anyone really makes anything as nice as my old Hitachi anymore. Unfortunately, it has a bad gear box and is stuck in high all the time (slips out of low) or else I'd simply refurbish those cells and go back to using that.

[David Davies]

Hard to beat the lifetime warranty on Ridgid drills at Home Depot - as long as you register the tool in time.
Dave

[Matt Krusen]

The Milwaukee Fuel line is pretty beastly. Regardless of brand, brushless is the way to go. And if you're looking for a 12v and don't mind the cost then the Festool CXS really is great.

[Mark Blatter]

"I'll probably hang on to these and see if any of the aftermarket, no-name batteries work OK. They're only $35 each, so I don't mind trying one out just to see. You may be right about the small batteries being the weak link, but I have to say that I didn't really do anything particularly special to take care of them, and I got quite a good bit of use out of them. I'm more concerned about buying new batteries because SO many people have complained about them. I'm worried I'll get a dud and end up just throwing away $70. If it wasn't for their terrible reputation, I'd even consider just buying another battery, but it's too risky when I can just jump ship for just a bit more $$$"

I have an old Dewalt 12V that I have just loved. Light yet can do just about anything I ask of it. The battery pack died on my so I recently ordered one off Amazon for $26. Seems OK, though I haven't used it in the drill yet. My daughter has it at her aptment but I will get it back some day.

I did buy a new Millwaukie about five months ago and have been using it some. It is the M18v though I have no idea if it is the Fuel others mentioned. I got it Big Orange for $200 along with two batteries, the hammer, plus a third battery. It such a good deal I couldn't pass it up.

What I don't like about it is the positioning of the LED light. It sets just perfectly so that the area around the screw is lit, but the screw head is in the shadow of the driver bit. In same ways it is actually worse then no light at all.

I still have, and use every once in a while, a Makita I bought in 1992. Batteries are weak, but I plan on opening up the packs some day and putting in new batteries. It is rated as a 9.6V and while a bit heavy, still runs great.

[Greg R Bradley]

My experience with Makita LXT batteries is excellent. Some of them date back to the time when several companies didn't even have Lithium cordless tools at all. I've had one fail very early, one at a year or so, and one fail at 5 years or so. The other 25 or so batteries are still in use. Some of them are used and recharged more than 100 times per year.

We did have two light duty drills with plastic chucks that wobbled, replaced at no charge. Never a problem with the metal chucks.

I don't care for Makitas 12v max stuff but their AVT rotary & demo hammers are fabulous.

I think Milwaukee cordless has finally caught up with Makita depending on which tools you need. I've always liked their corded drills and recently bought another of their 4000rpm 1/4" drills to have at home in addition to the two at work.

We don't buy batteries, just buy more kits when on sale or when they have their third battery free with a kit promos.

[Edward Oleen]

I've been using DeWalt, mostly 12V for small drill and driver, and have been happy with them. I also have DeWalt 20V tools and those have been working fine, also. I hear good things about Milwaukee tools but no experience with them.

The thing I like about the DeWalt 12V tools is that they're light while still having sufficient power. Previously I had the DeWalt 18V tools and the weight of those was starting to get to me. The DeWalt 20V tools are lighter than the 18V tools but the 12V are even better.

Mike

I strongly second the motion. I've tried tools from various manufacturers over the years, and I've settled on the colors Yellow and Black.

My big stuff is PowerMatic. The "small stuff" - actually the "not-so-big" stuff is DeWalt.

My latest purchase is the DeWalt '611 router - should have bought one when it first came out. I have the 12v drill/driver and impact driver kit and it goes everywhere with me in it's little kit bag.

[Joe Jensen]

I have a bit of an addiction drills and drivers. I have owned many. I currently have a Festool T15, Festool CSX, Bosch 12V drill, Bosch 12V driver, Bosch 12V Impact Driver, Panasonic 14V Nicad Impact Driver, a Bosch corded 1/2" impact drill/driver, a Milwaukee corded drill, an "old iron" Black and Decker corded drill, and I just got a great deal on a Hilti impact driver.

I always reach for the smallest and lightest drill that will get the job done. That means I reach for the Bosch 12 tools most often. If I'm drilling larger than 3/8" or into something other than wood I reach for the bigger Festool T15. If I need to drill a lot of holes in metal I reach for a corded drill.

If starting from scratch I'd start with either the Milwaukee or Bosch 12V stuff. Not super expensive, the batteries last forever, and they are compact and light. I'd add a bigger heavier drill for the times when you need more. If money is tight I'd go with a corded larger drill as the next one.

[Chris Harry]

I recently "consolidated" to one set of cordless tools.

I had a set of 18V Ridgid NiCD tools which worked fine....the battery packs were starting to go so I had them replaced under warranty with no questions asked. But the tools were still heavy, as were the packs. Really wanted to change to lithium ion for the weight savings and the addition of newer features (my Ridgid stuff was 8 years old...X2 in their line, which is now up to X5). I also had a few first generation Bosch 10.8/12V lithion tools........they were showing their age as well, just pretty underpowered and to upgrade to the new versions would be pretty expensive.

Home Depot had the 50/100/150 off promo.....I used it to stock up on Milwaukee 12V and 18V tools. Surprisingly, after all is said and done, I use the 12V stuff the most. I bought all Fuel (brushless) because the sale allowed me to get them down to decent prices. The 12V drill (1/2" Fuel hammer drill, 3/8" non-Fuel drill) and impact driver are excellent. The 18V drill and impact are still sitting in the case, unused. I might consider selling them, but I have a feeling the extra power would come in handy someday. Another nice thing about Milwaukee is that the charger in their 18V kits also charges the 12V batteries, so now I have one charger to do everything.

[John Coloccia]

My experience with Makita LXT batteries is excellent. Some of them date back to the time when several companies didn't even have Lithium cordless tools at all. I've had one fail very early, one at a year or so, and one fail at 5 years or so. The other 25 or so batteries are still in use. Some of them are used and recharged more than 100 times per year.

We did have two light duty drills with plastic chucks that wobbled, replaced at no charge. Never a problem with the metal chucks.

I don't care for Makitas 12v max stuff but their AVT rotary & demo hammers are fabulous.

I think Milwaukee cordless has finally caught up with Makita depending on which tools you need. I've always liked their corded drills and recently bought another of their 4000rpm 1/4" drills to have at home in addition to the two at work.

We don't buy batteries, just buy more kits when on sale or when they have their third battery free with a kit promos.

That's actually what I have too...this set, except an older version of it, and I bought it new.

http://www.tylertool.com/factory-reconditioned-makita-lct306w-r-18v-cordless-compact-lxt-lithium-ion-3-piece-combo-kit/mktrlct306w-r,default,pd.html?ref=pla&zmam=31282435&zmas=47&zmac=723&zmap=mktrlct306w-r&kpid=mktrlct306w-r&gclid=CLDov8Sii8UCFQpk7AoduScARw

I think the real key with these batteries is you just can't let them sit, like I have the last year because I've only sporadically been in the wood shop. Before that, they were great. Since this is how things will be for the next year or so, it doesn't really bode well sticking with this particular set. I do really wish they would just make reasonably priced batteries. There's nothing at all special about the batteries to make them that expensive, and nuking the entire pack at the firmware level is really overkill.

[Bruce Wrenn]

I've been running Ridgid 12V LI stuff since 2007. Signed everything up for LSA, even though it was a PITA! Only took three years for Ridgid to do what they should have done in first place. Had copies of receipt, UPC, and certificate of mailing, so they couldn't say I didn't do my part. Some of mine are old enough not to have a serial number, so they automatically register replacement batteries. Newer ones have to be registered within 90 days of replacement. Never a hassle about getting batteries replaced. Now HD about ten miles away does replacement.

[Michael W. Clark]

I have the Milwaukee M18 drill/driver and Impact set. It is great for about 90% of DIY and woodworking. I also have a small Bosch 10.8V drill and impact set that I use for mounting drawer slides or impacting 1-1/4" smaller wood screws. Both sets have been great and no complaints. The 18V drills are smaller now but still a bit large for some tasks. Maybe 12V is a good compromise if buying one?

[Jason Roehl]

I got the Bosch 18V impact/drill set a little over a year ago. It has replaced my 14.4V P-C stable (though I still have them). My go-to P-C driver was a hammer drill, and the 18V Bosch is probably 1/2 or less the weight. I couldn't see myself getting worn out using the Bosch, while I did come close on occasion with heavy use of the P-C.

My only regret is that I pulled the trigger on the Bosch before they were deeply discounted with the arrival of the brushless models (which is what I probably would have gotten, had they been widely available).

[Steve Rozmiarek]

My .02, having compared the milwaukee, bosch, makita, and dewalt, I still much prefer the dewalt. I like the 18 volt best so the same battery works for everything, and the tools and batteries really hold up well. My impressions of the others vs the dewalt, milwaukee is lower quality construction, and the batteries are weaker, bosch has decent quality, but much less powerful than the dewalt of the same volt, and the makita had a battery give up.

These threads always make me think that the current crop of cordless tools must all be pretty good, as everyone sticks up for their own brand, and no clear winner emerges.

[Robert Payne]

I bought a Makita (white) LCT306W 18 Volt Li/Ion combination set with a VS Drill with 1/2" chuck, Impact Driver and an LED light with 2 batteries and a charger for $229 from CPO Makita. It is a great set and very potent. Batteries recharge very quickly.

[Jim Andrew]

I have 3 old Makitas, the batteries are bad, bought replacements on ebay, but they don't have the power of the originals, and now I am still buying Dewalt 18v nicads, Ace Hardware is still selling the drill with 2 batteries for 90$ on their promotions. They have another one this weekend, and I plan to pick up another for the batteries. I have numerous drills, and a set with sawzall and skilsaw, so don't want to give up their batteries. Maybe I should get 2 sets. The tools are durable,the batteries last a long time, still not a bad way to go.

[Ole Anderson]

For the benefit of others with the same question, but not wanting to drop $200 on each tool, the new PC 20 volt combo pack is real nice, got one for my son. About $161 on Amazon for the set including 2 smaller Lion batteries and a charger.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/512u8Tb0RHL._SX425_.jpg

[Prashun Patel]

I've used a few different brands. I've settled on the Ridgid 12v. They're just so darn cheap. The batteries go on sale every now and then too. This winter I found a couple sets of the 4aH battery 2-packs for $50/ea.

The drill kit goes on sales several times a year for $99 (the cost of new batteries for any other brand) and for marginally higher you can even get an impact driver thrown in.

It's just hard to compete with that.

[mreza Salav]

I've used a few different brands. I've settled on the Ridgid 12v. They're just so darn cheap. The batteries go on sale every now and then too. This winter I found a couple sets of the 4aH battery 2-packs for $50/ea.

The drill kit goes on sales several times a year for $99 (the cost of new batteries for any other brand) and for marginally higher you can even get an impact driver thrown in.

It's just hard to compete with that.

Why do you buy batteries? if you register your tool within 90 days for LSA, you can get new batteries for life-time. It works (I've swapped 3 batteries so far).

[Erik Loza]

You summed the game in a nutshell, Erik.

The manufacturers move on, the old gear in their rearview. The consumer is boxed in, in terms of discarding the main gear, in favor of new gear that is supported.

Oh - wait......are we talking about cordless drills/drivers, or PCs? :p :p


You know, I can somewhat understand it with computers: OS's get updated, new features, etc. Just like desktop printers, where the ink costs as much as the printer but maybe you get better wifi printing or faster, whatever. Those, I can somewhat justify.

It was a lot harder for me to swallow the cordless drill-thing because I found myself in the position of having to get rid of a perfectly good (for my needs, at least...) tool not because it would not do the job but because the consumables were prohibitively expensive.

Erik

[Martin Wasner]

I'm a big fan of Panasonic. They're a little bit more money, but I think they are a great value. When all of my old Nimh powered Panasonic drills were dying, I went and bought three drill and driver kits with brushless motors, and Li-Ion batteries also from Panasonic. They've held up very well in the shop. I haven't had a problem yet, the batteries hold a charge well, and the mechanicals are still very good. They are all about three or four years old at this point.

My first impact was a Makita. Nice unit, low profile. I had to replace the case on it once. Where the battery connects to the body, it cracked when it fell off of a bench one day. I also went through a few batteries in a couple of years. I don't know if Makita still does it, but they used to have a fifteen minute charger. That's just too hard on the batteries. The faster you charge a battery pack, the shorter the lifespan of it will be. Nice in a pinch, but thinking ahead is cheaper.

[Prashun Patel]

I am talking about the 4ah batteries not the stock 1ahs that come with it.

[Larry Edgerton]

I changed my mind........

[Tom Deutsch]

I bought the Bosch 18v LI kit 6 or 7 years ago, used it semi-professionally for a couple years and fairly often for around the house and helping friends since then. The 2 original batteries have held up really well and I like the compactness and balance of both units. Driver is a bit down on power from when it was new, but it has paid for itself.
I have sworn off modern DeWalt since a recip saw and a corded hammer drill both machined themselves to death. Lots of people seem to like the cordless yellow and black stuff though.

[Prashun Patel]

Totally disagree. I find the ridgid's very well balanced. And (broken record alert) with the replacement 4aH batteries, they stand up on their own, unlike most other 12v models.

[Chris Harry]

Totally disagree. I find the ridgid's very well balanced. And (broken record alert) with the replacement 4aH batteries, they stand up on their own, unlike most other 12v models.

My only problem with Ridgid 12V is the lack of more tools. The Milwaukee M12 line is huge, Bosch has more tools than Ridgid but not as many as Milwaukee (at least here in the US), etc.

My brother in law picked up the 2 piece Ridgid 12V kit becase it was a good deal and eventually got a 2 pack of the batteries on clearance from Home Depot....but his question after that was "what do I use the extra batteries for? there are no other tools"

[John Sanford]

18v Compact Brushless - best combination of power, weight, size, flexibility, etc.

DeWalt is in that space, and Milwaukee has just announced they're moving into it as well. My DeWalt 20Max XR drill/driver is a bit smaller, definitely lighter, more powerful, and has better run time than my old 12v DeWalt 972 nicad. Of course it has more power, but did I mention it is both smaller and lighter? I don't rec

For truly small and light, the action is in the 12v brushless space, which is almost completely owned by Milwaukee, although Bosch is slowly making moves. AFAIK, no other manufacturer even has any 12v (actually 10.8) brushless tools other than those two. I've yet to hear any complaints about the Milwaukee 12v Fuel tools, other than how buying them can be addictive.

Head over to Garage Journal, there are a LOT of discussions on this topic.

Oh, and over there you can also find out about private label Panasonic tools going cheap, cheap.

[John Sanford]

Totally disagree. I find the ridgid's very well balanced. And (broken record alert) with the replacement 4aH batteries, they stand up on their own, unlike most other 12v models.

The DeWalts stand on their own. Milwaukee and Bosch both make 4ah packs that allow the tools to stand on their own. And I agree with you that it is a good thing. :D

[Prashun Patel]

I have not tried the Milwaukee Fuel, but if money were no object I would seriously consider this. FWW did a review and concluded this and the impact driver were in a league of their own. brushless motors; and metal, locking chucks. You should get that article; it's available at FWW online.

I will challenge you to this though: show me a person who hates their cordless drill. I submit that most people are extremely happy with their choice of drill/driver from one of the respected brands - more even than random orbit sanders, which is an area similarly crowded with really happy users. So, I think it's harder to make a mistake in choosing than it is to make the right choice.

Last, I will also submit that battery technology changes quickly enough that your tool will likely obsolesce before it dies. I would therefore not count on keeping this tool for 10 or 15 years. You heard it here first that within that time we'll have smaller, lighter, longer lasting, faster charging drills that make the ones we all use now feel like brontosauruses from Pluto. Just sayin'.

[Tom M King]

I have the white and black Makita combo that I bought whenever it was that they first came out with them. They have the "half sized" 18v batteries. I'm thinking they are 6 or 7 years old, but don't really remember. 3 or 4 years ago, I bought the LXT combo, which has the full sized 18v battery. That was before they came out with the brushless ones. Both of the impact drivers have driven in several hundred pounds of screws, and the LXT some tens of pounds of the good sized star drive lags.

Just a couple of months ago I realized that I hadn't used the lightweight white ones in a long time, so I tried charging the batteries fully expecting that they had been sitting too long, and were old enough not to take a charge. Sure enough, the charger gave the blinking light drill for defective batteries. I had laid them in a window sill of a South facing window in an old house we were working on. Big Mike saw them sitting there, and put them back in the charger without me noticing him doing it. Both charged back up. Mike said that they were really warm when he charged them. They've been working like new ones for the several months since then.

I don't know which part, or parts, of the process worked, but there's no question that it worked. The LXT's are still working fine, and we use them most days.

[John Coloccia]

I have the white and black Makita combo that I bought whenever it was that they first came out with them. They have the "half sized" 18v batteries. I'm thinking they are 6 or 7 years old, but don't really remember. 3 or 4 years ago, I bought the LXT combo, which has the full sized 18v battery. That was before they came out with the brushless ones. Both of the impact drivers have driven in several hundred pounds of screws, and the LXT some tens of pounds of the good sized star drive lags.

Just a couple of months ago I realized that I hadn't used the lightweight white ones in a long time, so I tried charging the batteries fully expecting that they had been sitting too long, and were old enough not to take a charge. Sure enough, the charger gave the blinking light drill for defective batteries. I had laid them in a window sill of a South facing window in an old house we were working on. Big Mike saw them sitting there, and put them back in the charger without me noticing him doing it. Both charged back up. Mike said that they were really warm when he charged them. They've been working like new ones for the several months since then.

I don't know which part, or parts, of the process worked, but there's no question that it worked. The LXT's are still working fine, and we use them most days.

If it detects a problem 3 times, it nukes the pack. I suspect what happens is it tries to charge, detects a problem and stops...but it's given enough charge for it to work the next time.

In my case, what I've found is if you leave them in the charger, sometimes you'll go back and find that they're completely dead. That shouldn't happen with these batteries, and really shouldn't happen with ANY smart charger, even for NiCads/NiMH. For Lithium, it suffices to simply stop charging them, and for NiCd/NiMh, it should switch to a trickle charge. That technology's been consumer level for 30 years, and no other cordless drill charger has ever done that...but my Makita one does. Again, I rarely leave them in the charger, so it's never really a problem and it's not something I ever worry about, but it has happened to me and it's irritating.

[Jesse Busenitz]

I'm a big Milwaukee fan.... Have a reg M18 tool set, and then about a year ago bought a M18 Fuel impact driver, which is now my go to tool. It's definitely lighter than my drill, and I use the compact batteries that seem to last forever with the Fuel. I use these tool everyday, and they have held up great!

[Greg R Bradley]

I know that Makita is one of the heaviest counterfeited brands but most of these guys have to be using the counterfeit tools/batteries instead of the real thing.

At home I always have two Makita LXT changers with batteries on them. I also have a Bosch 10.8v(12v) charger with a battery in it at all times. I also have 3 companies with at least one Makita LXT charger with batteries in them continuously. One works 24x7x365. None of them are having the issues described.

As far as that article explaining the Makita problem, it is complete nonsense. I can't see it as anything other than a complete fabrication. I had a vacation house where I left Makita LXT and Bosch 10.8v tools unused from April-December every year for 3-4 years with none of the issues explained in the article that says the chip kills one battery cell in weeks. It always amazed me that the Makita and Bosch LI tools worked after being unused for 8+ months as I used NiCad tools before that.

I bought a 3 speed Makita Impact Kit a year ago and shortly after that put an unused BTD141 impact, 2 batteries, and charger in the case with the intention to sell it on craigslist or something. It has been at least 10 months and I just opened it. The tool worked normally with both batteries. When put on my charger, the 80% charged lights came on within 2 minutes and the 100% light came on in within 10 minutes. That article says they are dead in a few weeks but mine are close to 80% charged after 10+ months. What complete garbage!

I'm certainly no Makita fanatic and my personal drills are Festool CXS and T-15. If they start selling the Protool DRC (now called Festool DRC) in the US, I will be standing in line to buy it. I'm also a vendor to one of the companies mentioned which isn't Makita. Personally, I'm a heavy user of Makita LXT but mostly in Chainsaw, Impacts, and Fan. In business, I have lots of Makita Impacts in heavy use in maintenance by people that make construction people look easy on tools.

Interesting that Makita had a big problem with their NiMh batteries and the LXT seem to work great but the nonsense on the internet seems to indicate problems. Or is it that the Li batteries have problems in extreme cold that I don't see, or that Makita basically were the originators of Lithium battery power tools and are the first ones to find the disadvantages of Lithium batteries compared to other technologies.

[Jason Roehl]

My first impact was a Makita. Nice unit, low profile. I had to replace the case on it once. Where the battery connects to the body, it cracked when it fell off of a bench one day. I also went through a few batteries in a couple of years. I don't know if Makita still does it, but they used to have a fifteen minute charger. That's just too hard on the batteries. The faster you charge a battery pack, the shorter the lifespan of it will be. Nice in a pinch, but thinking ahead is cheaper.

This is a pet peeve of mine. I NEVER stand my drills up on their battery packs--too easily knocked over and damaged, or they'll fall off of something and damage a surface below when the bit spears it.

Back to your regularly scheduled thread...

[Matthew Hills]

I've yet to hear any complaints about the Milwaukee 12v Fuel tools, other than how buying them can be addictive.

I really liked the milwaukee 12V fuel tools on paper, but thought that they felt *very* heavy when I saw them on display at HD. Much heavier than my old makita 12V (NiCd) drill, and much-much heavier than my little hitachi 10.8V impact driver.

Is this a characteristic of brushless, or just putting in metal-by-the-pound?

Matt

[Mike Henderson]

... or they'll fall [over] and damage a surface ... when the bit spears it.

Back to your regularly scheduled thread...
I learned that the hard way. When working with a driver, I now lay it down.

Mike

[Andrew Joiner]

I will challenge you to this though: show me a person who hates their cordless drill. I submit that most people are extremely happy with their choice of drill/driver from one of the respected brands - more even than random orbit sanders, which is an area similarly crowded with really happy users. So, I think it's harder to make a mistake in choosing than it is to make the right choice.



I agree. I love every new cordless drill I get. Then when it needs batteries that cost nearly as much as a new drill with batteries, I hate it. For now I love the Ridgid LSA.

[Andrew Joiner]

I will challenge you to this though: show me a person who hates their cordless drill. I submit that most people are extremely happy with their choice of drill/driver from one of the respected brands - more even than random orbit sanders, which is an area similarly crowded with really happy users. So, I think it's harder to make a mistake in choosing than it is to make the right choice.



I agree. I love every new cordless drill I get. Then when it needs batteries that cost nearly as much as a new drill with batteries, the love is gone. For now I love the Ridgid LSA and the little 12V drill.

[Dan Rude]

I have both fuels m12 & m18. The m18 fuel I think is pretty good with 3 impact settings and the m 12 fuel has 2. I keep the older non fuels in my trunk for my scavage finds. I still may buy the fuel m18 hammer drill just to get one with a handle. The regular one doesn't have one, and I'm always getting the wrong end of getting flung by it. I have an older regular drill one that has no torque. The new ones can do anything. If you have big stuff to drill, check out their new Hole Hawg. It out performs the corded version. They also have 4 & 5 Ahr batteries. My oldest batteries are compact and only charge to 3 bars. I just use them on lights. They are about 9 years old. So have done their job. Dan

[Jim Dwight]

One of the things I like about the Ryobi 18V line is when they upgraded to lithium ion they made the batteries compatible with the older Ni Cd tools. Most of my tools are the old blue with only my brad nailer and drills the new bright yellowish color. The new batteries made the old saws, circular and reciprocating, a lot more useful.

[Jim Becker]

Honestly...I gave up on my older DeWalt cordless drill/drivers as my Festool keeps on kicking and kicking and kicking... I've owned it for about "many" years now and only replaced the original batteries once with Li batteries a few years ago. Holds a charge forever and despite being the older 12v system, has power to spare. And useful accessories. Yea, it wasn't inexpensive to buy originally, but I'm getting my money's worth for sure...it may outlast me!

[Larry Edgerton]

Bought two Milwaukee M18 Fuel cordless impacts with two batteries each today. Paid $225 apiece out the door at the local hardware store.

Time will tell......

[Curt Harms]

I learned that the hard way. When working with a driver, I now lay it down.

Mike

When working, yup. For storage though it's kinda handy if they sit up, they take less room and are easy to grab.

[Mike Henderson]

When working, yup. For storage though it's kinda handy if they sit up, they take less room and are easy to grab.
Yes, I absolutely agree and that's the way I have them in storage. But out of the way of any work.

Mike