Block plane advice

[Kevin Wolfe]

I'm starting on a strip built kayak. Hopefully I'll be getting the wood and cutting the strips this coming weekend. It won't be cedar (too expensive and far away). but probably poplar or white pine.

There are two ways you can do a strip kayak or canoe:
1) bead and cove the edges of the strips (lots of loud, dusty router time)
2) use a rolling bevel win which you hand plane the strips edge to match the existing edge

This brings me to my question. If you were going to bevel and hand trim over 80 strips, what kind of block plane would you use?

Some folks recommend an apron plane (LN 102 or LV apron plane). They look really nice because of the reduced weight and nice fit in the hand. I will be holding the strip and planing with the other hand, so no table to support it.

On the other hand, once I'm done with this kayak (yes, I may want to build another one....who knows) but I would like to have a block plane that will be useful for other things, like a low angle block plane.

Any thoughts (hopefully not opening a can of worms)?

[Jim Koepke]

My suggestion was going to be check with the Boat Building forum. Looks like you have already done that.



So, here is my 311522...

Though my Stanley #102 is loved and used often, it isn't as versatile as any of my low angle block planes.

Not knowing your location, it is difficult to judge how easy or difficult it would be for you to test drive the various options available to you. For your use it would seem the comfort in use issue may be even more important than it is to many others here.

My LN #60 is a fine plane, but the fit in my hand is a bit off. Mostly due to an old injury. The LV NX 60 looks more ergonomic, but some find it a bit slick to hold. My old Stanley later day #60s work great for me as do my earlier #65 (type) models.

My guess is you do not live in my area. You would be welcome to come fill your hands with my planes. If you lived around here you would be stumbling over all the cedar scraps and planks.

jtk

[john zulu]

If you are sure with one hand on the strip and the other planing. The LV apron plane is good enough and light enough. As Jim said it is not that versatile as other block planes. But if you want trimming and chamfering then apron is the plane. Else block plane. LV DX or NX block planes are recommended.

I have a std. block plane and apron plane. Both have it's uses. But if you want one. Then low angle block plane is the plane to start with.

[Bruce Haugen]

My favorite block plane is my vintage 60-1/2, but my NX60 is a much better plane, more like a small smoother, better control. It's just a little harder to hold. I've been using that 60-1/2 for 50+ years, so maybe it's a familiarity thing.

BUT, based on my experience building a strip canoe, I'd go with the cove and bead method. It produces a much better joint and will be a lot faster in both the short and long run.

[Curt Putnam]

Note that the LN 102 is a low angle plane; the 103 is a standard angle plane. I have the 102 and it seems to come out for every project. I also have quite an array of other blocks - mostly LV low angles. Note that these blocks are bevel up which means that all you have to is to hone a higher angle if you want one.

[Chuck Hart]

I think you may want to look at a skewed rabbet block plane. You can go LN or LV but both come with a fence that will help you with planing the strips but both can be used as a rabbet or block plane. The skewed blade will make cuts where other block planes will have trouble because of the nature of the blade. I know I am not going to be the popular choice but if you can get a chance to use one you will see the difference in capabilities

Chuck.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

Advice from a boatbuilding instructor: The Lie Nielsen 103 is light, nimble, and easy to care for (bronze doesn't rust). The Veritas apron plane is also a great choice. Either one is perfect for making rolling bevels.

If if money is no object, the Veritas skewed rabbeting block planes are the most versatile block plane you will likely find. They are comfortable and easy to get in tight spots as well.

All li of the above are used in my class, as well as the standard angle 9 1/2 Lie Nielsen adjustable mouth- also a fine choice but unnecessarily heavy for 1/4" strips. Certainly good if you are going to continue woodworking.

You can easily miter 1/4" strips with a standard angle plane and it is better for the edge grain, which you will be doing more of. The low angle is better for end grain, but as I said, with 3/4 x 1/4 strips the standard angle is fine and will still do end miters.

[Kent A Bathurst]

I have 4 block planes. LN 60 Rabbet Block, LN 140 skew block, LN 9-1/2 Std Angle Block, and Keen Kutter K220.

If someone forced me to have just one, it would be the LN #60. No question. I have never built a boat, but you indicate you also want a plane to use beyond that. I am answering the "beyond that" question.

The only sad thing is I got my #60 before it had nickers.............Oh, well.................

[Mike Henderson]

I have 4 block planes. LN 60 Rabbet Block, LN 140 skew block, LN 9-1/2 Std Angle Block, and Keen Kutter K220.

If someone forced me to have just one, it would be the LN #60. No question. I have never built a boat, but you indicate you also want a plane to use beyond that. I am answering the "beyond that" question.

The only sad thing is I got my #60 before it had nickers.............Oh, well.................
Contact LN. They used to add nickers to the rabbet plane for $25. That was several years ago, however - but ask them. I had them added to my rabbet plane.

Mike

[Oh, to stay on topic, my favorite plane is an older Stanley 65 knuckle block plane with a LV PM-V11 blade. I have a bunch of block planes, both old and new. The performance of a block plane is 99% due to the blade. The rest of the plane is usually fine no matter how old it is. But some of those Stanley OEM blades can be dogs, especially the ones made in England in the later years.]

[bridger berdel]

I find that for most uses, a standard angle, fixed toe block plane is just fine. The basic designs are lighter with less fiddly bits to distract yourself with. Depth and lateral adjusters are nice and all, but once you have the plane set you probably won't be using them again until next time you sharpen.

Don't get me wrong, I like the knuckle block low angle planes a lot, but in use by far the most important thing is that the blade is sharp. Everything else comes in a distant second.

[Hilton Ralphs]

If if money is no object...

In that case, why not splurge and get this for a mere $3k including the fancy Walnut box.

311563

Apologies to the OP as this is of no help whatsoever.

[Andrew Nemeth]

Honestly, if I were doing it again I would mill the cove and beads on all the strips at once (get it over with) the. Do all of your tapering with a block plane easing the corners into a bead. This process will get you a tighter hull in less time then trying to chamfer the entire length of each strip to fit. As for the block plane, just make sure it a light one becuase you will be holding it a lot during this project. I'm no expert in this field, but I have built several kayak hulls and a few other projects using this teqnique. Good luck to you and post some pics along the way.

[lowell holmes]

I have 4 block planes. LN 60 Rabbet Block, LN 140 skew block, LN 9-1/2 Std Angle Block, and Keen Kutter K220.

If someone forced me to have just one, it would be the LN #60. No question. I have never built a boat, but you indicate you also want a plane to use beyond that. I am answering the "beyond that" question.

The only sad thing is I got my #60 before it had nickers.............Oh, well.................
LN will add nickers at a nominal cost.

[Prashun Patel]

I think a block plane is a personal decision. Some people like the adjustable mouth and swear by a 60 1/2 size plane. I prefer the smaller size and comfort of the Veritas Apron or LN102 planes.

For breaking an edge on a large amount of lineal board feet, I vote for a smaller block plane. Less fatigue. But that's a matter of personal taste.

I also vote for a low angle vs a skew or standard angle block plane. I just find my LA more versatile and reliable (less chattery and tearouty) in most situations for me (YMMV).

A skew plane is a little more specialized and I don't think as versatile as what you're hoping for after this project.

[Kevin Wolfe]

Thanks for all of the responses guys.

I took a lot of time to think about bead and cove vs rolling bevel. From what a lot of folks say, the majority of the strips will need minimal beveling anyway. Plus, by the time I'm done buying the bits and possibly a second router, setting up a router table that's up to the task (don't have one now) and actually routing the strips, I could have already hand beveled all of the strips I need.

I mentioned the apron plane because they seem lighter and an easier fit in one hand. For some reason, I do like the idea of a rebate block because it means that I can do some beveling to the strips while they are on the forms (watch Nick Schade video). I guess I just need to decide how much I really want to spend. Most block planes should be able to handle a 1/4 thick strip going with grain. However, I just might look around for a used LN. Yeah they are more expensive but I guess I could resell it afterwards if I didn't need it and loose close to nothing.

AAHHHH! All the choices!

[Kent A Bathurst]

Contact LN. They used to add nickers to the rabbet plane for $25. That was several years ago, however - but ask them. I had them added to my rabbet plane. Mike


LN will add nickers at a nominal cost.


:eek: :eek: :eek:

I am on that right now. Thanks, guys............

[Jim Koepke]

LN will add nickers at a nominal cost.

Who knows... in the future the ones without the nickers may be at a premium.

jtk

[Robert Engel]

https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/block-planes/small-block-planes?node=4072

[Kent A Bathurst]

FYI - LN #60 LA Block Plane - nickers

Yes, indeed, they will put nickers on the older model.

$35 per nicker.

I'll be a sonuvagun. Thanks, guys.

Now I just gotta decide how many. Since I am right-handed, one on the left side makes sense, but I'm wondering if I would ever wish I had both done while it is up there?

Thoughts/comments?

[Mike Henderson]

FYI - LN #60 LA Block Plane - nickers

Yes, indeed, they will put nickers on the older model.

$35 per nicker.

I'll be a sonuvagun. Thanks, guys.

Now I just gotta decide how many. Since I am right-handed, one on the left side makes sense, but I'm wondering if I would ever wish I had both done while it is up there?

Thoughts/comments?
They really increased the cost. Way back when I did it, they charged me $25 to do both sides. I thought that was very cheap but I was glad to get that price.

Whether it was worth it or not - I don't use them. I don't use that plane very much either.

Mike

[Malcolm Schweizer]

FYI - LN #60 LA Block Plane - nickers

Yes, indeed, they will put nickers on the older model.

$35 per nicker.

I'll be a sonuvagun. Thanks, guys.

Now I just gotta decide how many. Since I am right-handed, one on the left side makes sense, but I'm wondering if I would ever wish I had both done while it is up there?

Thoughts/comments?

Both. The plane cuts left and right so you can go with the grain. You will want to keep that ability.

[Kent A Bathurst]

I don't use them. I don't use that plane very much either.

Mike - If you wanna go all stone-age, we could just swap, ya know? ;)