Air vs. Manual Floor Nailers

[BOB OLINGER]

I need to put down 4-500 sq. ft. of 3/4" oak flooring. The supplier doesn't loan floor nailers anymore. Options look like purchasing a new or used nailer. I've only used manual
(hammer activated) in the past. Do the air activated nailers get the flooring as tight as the manual hammer activated ones? I'm a little old school, only used hammer variety, but sounds like air activated are fairly widely used. Does anyone have any comments on moving to air? Thanks in advance for comments.

[Jason Roehl]

I've installed several thousand s.f. of flooring over the years. I've never used a manual nailer, and I can't imagine using one. You still have to give the pneumatic nailers a solid whack to get them to set the nail, otherwise the striker will just push the nailer off the nail and leave it sticking out. And I've definitely "coaxed" many a bowed piece of flooring into place, sometimes with John Henry-esque swings.

[Martin Wasner]

I've installed several thousand s.f. of flooring over the years. I've never used a manual nailer, and I can't imagine using one. You still have to give the pneumatic nailers a solid whack to get them to set the nail, otherwise the striker will just push the nailer off the nail and leave it sticking out. And I've definitely "coaxed" many a bowed piece of flooring into place, sometimes with John Henry-esque swings.


+1 I've only used the air nailers, specifically the Bostich nailers. I can't imagine doing it any other way. You typically have to nail your first few rows down pretty hard before you've got the room to get the flooring nailer in. I've face nailed where it's hidden, (under cabinets, or under base trim and shoe), and tossed some finish screws in to boot, and if you get over zealous you can still push them around with the air and hammer type if you're not careful.


I can turn a jack, I can lay track, I can pick and shovel too....

[daryl moses]

First flooring job I did I rented a manual nailer. Never again!! Bout wore me out slinging that heavy hammer, sure did pull the boards up tight though.
I purchased a pneumatic nailer for my next job, world of difference.

[Jim Dwight]

I've only done this on my house but I put down around 800 square feet of 3/4 Hickory in the last year with a pneumatic nailer from Harbor Freight. On the starting and ending rows where I had to face nail, I had trouble straightening out boards. I tried to keep shorter pieces and straighter pieces for those areas. Out in the middle of the room, I had very little difficulty using the pneumatic to straighten boards. I used only nails, although the HF is supposed to be able to use staples. I paid about $120 for the HF using a 20% off coupon but I've since seen it for sale around $100. Best place to buy the cleats I found was Lumber Liquidators.

[BOB OLINGER]

Thanks for all the comments. I think I'll buy the HF pneumatic nailer. On sale for about $145 - 20% off coupon. I've always used the nails.

[roger wiegand]

I've used both, you want the air nailer! No question. For a small job rent one, all the rental places have one, for a bigger, multi-day job buy one and then sell it afterwards. Resale value is excellent. The Bostich nailer can be bought for $350 and resold for $275-300 in "like new" condition. Don't know about HF, I'd be nervous. The job is hard enough without marginal tools.

[Tom M King]

I use a manual nailer, just because I've had it for 35 years or so. Before that, the supplier would lend one. I also have a pneumatic one, but only use it on large jobs. The manual one gives much more control with how hard you hit it. If you need to pull a bow up, you can do it. I guess you could do the same with an air nailer, but it's not made for it. We bring the manual nailer out even if we are putting a floor down mostly with the air nailer.

I replaced the handle on the manual nailer hammer with a longer one that has a smooth handle with a flared end. The longer handle means you don't have to bend over as far. The stock handles have big depressions that may give more grip, but also are a lot harder on your hand.

I like the manual one better than the air nailer also because I don't have to drag a hose around. It's funny that people who have never used one say they are so terrible. Handling the hammer is more of a swinging movement than a lifting one, and once you get in rhythm, it's not bad at all. The variation in hit strength is on the down swing.

This picture has my manual nailer in it. It was old when I bought it in the 70s. Especially for a small job like in this picture, it's much preferred over the air nailer. If you set it down like that, you don't have to bend over all the way to the floor to grab the nailer and hammer.

http://historic-house-restoration.com/images/novdec2012_008.JPG

That was before I changed the handle on the hammer. I had used it for many days over the years before I was smart enough to change it. If you set it down like that, you don't have to bend all the way to the floor to grab the nailer and the hammer.

[Jesse Busenitz]

Funny this comes up as today I just put down my first flooring... Did prep work for a hour or so and than set flooring the rest of the day, and I am dog tired... can't imagine a manual nailer would have been easier. I bought a Freeman nailer and so far it's worked great. The only problem is I'm only an 1/8 done if that.... Oh well, I'll call it the exercise program for the week.

[Jim Andrew]

I have done a few floors with a Portanailer, it is manual, with a ratchet style drive, so if you don't get the nail all the way in, you can hit again to finish. I was worn after laying flooring all day. Don't know if I could do it 2 days in a row now. Lately seems like if I hit it really hard for a day, need 2 days to recover.

[Tom M King]

You guys make it sound like that if I didn't do this for a living, I might actually be 64 years old. I didn't say that a manual nailer was easier, just that it gives better control. Fortunately, I do a lot of different things, so I might only nail down flooring a few days a year at most, and some years never. Having helpers to lay out the pieces is a big help. They lay out the pieces for the next row by setting one end down, dropping the other end on a foot, and kicking it into place. Eliminating so many ups and downs is the most important part about making it less work.

Regardless of the underlayment type, we always snap lines on the joists, and nail into the joist rather than the subfloor, but sometimes you need to. Make absolutely sure that the subfloor is fastened down tightly. Squeaks come from the subfloor moving up and down on a nail most of the time.

[Rich Riddle]

I have installed too much flooring to remember and used both types. Wouldn't even consider a manual nailer these days. No kidding, wouldn't even consider it. Most air nailers use staples these days. Staples seem to hold much better than the old cleats. I usually don't recommend them, but Harbor Freight has an air floor nailer they sell for $145 normally and on sale quite often for $100. It has excellent reviews. It might be the best solution and worth the half-hour drive each way to Des Moines.

[peter gagliardi]

I make and install flooring as part of my business. I only use the manual nailer! I have tried the air, didn't like it at all.
I must be one of the rare people that actually enjoys swinging a hammer, the workout it provides, and the skill involved in mastering the use of a tool. It's also a great stress reliever. Can't get that with the tappity tap tap of an air hammer, and you never have to drag around and fight with the hose, or listen to that irritating compressor every 3rd swing!!

[Jim Dwight]

Having a helper helps, especially with carrying flooring boxes. The hickory I put down came in boxes that were 70 lbs each. I carried each and every one of them, by myself, to the second story of our house. I didn't have help placing pieces. So it took awhile and I got tired. I did a much thinner oak floor in a house we were selling with a stapler made for thin flooring with help. It was a lot less tiring. One of my step daughters helped with that floor. She found it fun to try and find me pieces that fit without cutting. She was a teenager at the time. The other thing that helps is setting up a saw someplace other than the floor.

[bill tindall]

I have only used a manual nailer and never found any reason to upgrade. That said I have only done one room sized jobs. I like the control and once a rhythm is developed I don't find it tiring.

[Ole Anderson]

Most rental places will carry an air over hammer flooring hammer.

[Larry Edgerton]

I use this company's nailers.

http://primatech.ca/Home.shtml

I also use their nails. I tested all the common brands and these hold the best. They have teeth! I switched from a manual to a Bostich, and now the Prinatech air assist. I would not go back to a manual. If you have a piece you need to pull in you can hit a air assist as hard as you want, it won't hurt it, but when you don't need to you can just tap it with the weight of the mallet. They also are a lot easier when you are close to a wall, a lot less dents in the wall.

My 2 cents.....

[Rich Engelhardt]

I had a small job to do that was spread over a few days. Renting a pneumatic was about the same price as buying one from Harbor Freight on sale, so, I bought the Harbor Freight for about $100.

I used Bostitch fasteners in it and it worked flawlessly - not one single jam and the only driving problems were ones caused by me, not the tool.

Lumber Liquidators used to have the best deal going on fasteners, but they switched to their own house brand.

[Mark Wooden]

+1 with Tom on the manual nailer. I've always gotten a floor to lay up better with one and as he says-laying it all out, kicking it into place and swinging the hammer- becomes a rhythm
Putting down flooring is a tiring job and now that I'm 60, I try to always have a helper to spell me,although they're always amazed at how much more an experienced old man does than they do.;)
The Primatech nails look like the same nails a Powernail nailer uses. I wonder if they'd interchange.

[Larry Edgerton]

+1 with Tom on the manual nailer. I've always gotten a floor to lay up better with one and as he says-laying it all out, kicking it into place and swinging the hammer- becomes a rhythm
Putting down flooring is a tiring job and now that I'm 60, I try to always have a helper to spell me,although they're always amazed at how much more an experienced old man does than they do.;)
The Primatech nails look like the same nails a Powernail nailer uses. I wonder if they'd interchange.

I'm 58, so I can relate to how experience matters to speed, but at the end of the day the young guys go have a few beers and chase tail, and I go home and take a couple of Aleve with a scotch chaser.

The Powernails will fit in a Primatech nailer, so I assume the Primatech nails will fit in a PortaNailer. Once in a while I run out so I buy whatever, Bostich will fit as well. The teeth part of the Primatech nails is sharper and has a backwards angle where the Portanails and Bostich are rather vague waves.

If you do much flooring you owe it to yourself to try a Primatech, they are that good. Not cheap, but worth every penny and will easily do just as good a job as a manual with a lot less effort. I think the secret may be the large bore of the cylinder. its huge compared to the Bostich I had.

Larry

[David Spurr]

Rent an air nailer from home depot. About 50 bucks a day.

[Mark Wooden]

I'm 58, so I can relate to how experience matters to speed, but at the end of the day the young guys go have a few beers and chase tail, and I go home and take a couple of Aleve with a scotch chaser.

The Powernails will fit in a Primatech nailer, so I assume the Primatech nails will fit in a PortaNailer. Once in a while I run out so I buy whatever, Bostich will fit as well. The teeth part of the Primatech nails is sharper and has a backwards angle where the Portanails and Bostich are rather vague waves.

If you do much flooring you owe it to yourself to try a Primatech, they are that good. Not cheap, but worth every penny and will easily do just as good a job as a manual with a lot less effort. I think the secret may be the large bore of the cylinder. its huge compared to the Bostich I had.

Larry

Larry, I'm trying like hell to do so much less of it...............

[Jim Becker]

Even my GC rented a flooring nailer for installing the 2000 sq ft of wide pine that went into our addition in 2008. It wasn't something he ever wanted to buy, despite having relatively frequent need. All the tool rental places around here seem to have them available. I worked one room with him and I will say having the pneumatic assist was a very good thing...

[Jim Dwight]

I think many tasks are more tiring until you learn them. Moving plywood, for instance. If I can just pick it up and get it where it is going without messing around, it is not so bad. If my plan doesn't work, I start to struggle and get more tired. I assume manual flooring nailers are like this. Those that use them and don't find them over tiring have learned how to stand and swing the hammer and it isn't bad. I haven't used one but my son and his friend used a borrowed manual nailer on the friends house. Both are a lot younger than me and both are in good shape. The friend is a rock climber, for instance, and my son does hard physical work for a living. They found the manual nailer plenty tiring.

I am not bringing this up to argue but I think anybody who wants to try out the manual nailer should understand they may be more tired than experienced users at the end of the day. I find the hunched over position tiring as well as the up and down to cut and the carrying of flooring boxes tiring so even with a pneumatic I am plenty tired by the end of the day.

[Tom M King]

Jim you're right. When I first started building houses, I hired a carpenter who had the most experience, and did good work, that I could find. His name was Randolph Pierce, and he was 73 years old in 1973. I was 23. He noticed that I was working a lot harder than I needed to and one of the first things he told me was, "Building is not so much about knowing what goes where, but how to get the plywood into the house." He was right, and it's been a game of efficiency for me since then. I'm 64, and a manual nailer doesn't tire me out, or slow me down any more than an air nailer does, but since way back then, I don't get in a hurry to do anything, but haven't found a young guy yet that can get more done in a day than I can.