Patina Or 30 Years Of Oil, Dirt, and Grease On Plane...And What To Do About It

[Matthew Hutchinson477]

I picked up this type 11 Stanley 5C from an old guy that had it sitting in his garage. He said he hadn't used it in at least 20 years and has basically left it soaked in oil in a plastic bag for at least that long. At first it looked like it was in great condition. No nicks or chips anywhere, the japanning looks great for its age, and no rust...or maybe not? The whole plane is blackened with what I assumed was 30 years of dirt, grease, oil, etc. that has been caked on and hardened but after examining it I'm not 100% sure and want to make sure it isn't just the thickest patina I've ever seen. I'm pretty sure it's just grease because the bottom and sides of the sole aren't nearly as dark and grimy-looking. But if it is just grease then I've never seen anything like it.

http://i61.tinypic.com/2m68k0m.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/2ev6wb4.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/snnrj4.jpg
http://i58.tinypic.com/212g7yb.jpg

I washed it with soap and water at first to get all the oil off then tried wiping it down with some concentrated degreaser. Nothing. Then some scotchbrite. Still hardly anything came off. If it's grease then I assume electrolysis or vinegar won't work so I used a small scotchbrite wheel and some WD40 on my dremel to see what it did to the lateral adjuster and top of the frog. This time the black stuff started coming off a little and here's where I get confused. Underneath the black stuff the metal is pitted pretty badly in some places, meaning that maybe it was rust after all, or when the old codger got the plane 20+ years ago it he de-rusted it and then proceeded to oil the hell out of it, or maybe he just oiled over the rust and somehow it turned into this concoction.

http://i62.tinypic.com/ezed5k.jpg
http://i61.tinypic.com/316rmsk.jpg

Any ideas on what I've got on my hands?

Thanks

[Jim Davis]

Looks like some areas have some serious pitting. I'm thinking the PO put it in the plastic bag with oil hoping to stop the rust, not prevent it. I'd go after it with a toothbrush and solvent. Grease will be washed away, Japanning will stay--if it isn't already loose and ready to fall off.

Jim

[Marc Seguin]

It's really hard to tell from pictures but it almost looks to me like someone attempted a 'restore' earlier and then spraybombed the thing black aftwards. Does lacquer thinner take the black off ?

[Karl Andersson]

if you live near a coast where there were boatyards, it may have been painted by a boatyard crew to slow down rusting. I live near Baltimore, which used to have major shipyards and still has smaller yards, and I often see tools that are either painted everywhere except cutting and sliding surfaces with tough old enamel or they have the most hideous rusting and pitting from salt water exposure. And I have seen ones that were painted after serious rusting, as yours may have been. Acetone or lacquer thinner might work to remove it, or even brake parts cleaner, but the older enamels are pretty hard to dissolve when they're set. Sanding may be the only resort, but you'll probably see more pitting as you remove it.
good luck,
Karl

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Looks to me like oiled rust. Try a scraper to remove the chunky stuff.

[Matthew Hutchinson477]

I have seen ones that were painted after serious rusting


I'm beginning to think this may be the case. So far the only thing that has removed it well has been a scotchbrite dremel wheel. I just soaked the blade and chipbreaker in vinegar for about 15 hours and not much came off. What did come off peeled more like paint though--it didn't dissolve or crumble like grease and dirt.

The unfortunate part about this is the japanning, which initially looked like it was in great shape, may just be a cover-up. Is there an effective way to figure that out? Like some solvent or method that will take off old paint but leave the original japanning?

[Matthew Hutchinson477]

Looks to me like oiled rust. Try a scraper to remove the chunky stuff.

That was what I thought initially but since I haven't really seen much oiled rust before I don't know how to tell. Is there a way to tell if it's that rather than some old, thick enamel?

[Matthew Hutchinson477]

Well, since scrubbing with a degreaser didn't do much I tried electrolysis for a short period. In my previous experiences original japanning on planes wasn't damaged or degraded by electrolysis unless I left the plane in it for at least 12 hours or more. So I figured a couple hours of electrolysis might be a good method of figuring out whether or not this is original japanning or something else. After about 2 hours or less the paint started bubbling and chipping off quite a bit, leading me to believe this either isn't the original japanning or if it is, then it's in pretty bad shape.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2chriic.jpg
http://i62.tinypic.com/i2ttep.jpg

When I got the plane it smelled like WD40 so I'm thinking that's what the old owner had it soaked in for 20 years or so. If that's the case then maybe this is the original japanning and 20+ years of WD40 just degraded it.

Now the question is do I leave it as is and be careful with it or totally remove the current paint and repaint the whole thing.

[Marc Seguin]

I'd vote for a full do over at this point. Unless a plane is a crazy rare one in great condition that should go to a museum, then there's no harm in prettying them up and getting them usable again.

[Bill White]

Get a small soda blasting gun from Harbor Freight. The soda won't harm the metal. Remember. SODA not sand.
I have used mine on router bits, metal parts of various tools, lawn equipment, etc. with no problems whatsoever.
Bill

[Don Jarvie]

Put a wire wheel on your grinder and it will clean up all of the gunk and polish the metal. If the blade is too pitted get a new one. Lee Valley has replacements.

[Matthew Hutchinson477]

I'd vote for a full do over at this point. Unless a plane is a crazy rare one in great condition that should go to a museum, then there's no harm in prettying them up and getting them usable again.


Yep, that's what is gonna happen. I figure if the japanning is that bad anyway I might as well take it off to make sure no rust is starting to form underneath the places where the japanning has bubbled. I think the blade and chipbreaker, despite the heavy pitting, will probably work. The edged end of the blade is still okay. The lateral adjustment may be a different story. I guess this may just end up becoming a Franken-plane.