Tips to reduce sanding time

[Jeremy Killingbeck]

Does anyone have any good tips / advice on how to reduce sanding time. I love building projects, but I always seems to loose some motivation once I get to the sanding phase. I have always used a 5" dewalt ROS to do all of my sanding. The wood is usually a nice planed surface before I start standing, so I will start with 120 & then sand it with 220. Does anyone have some advice on how I can reduce the sanding time. Is there a better sander / method that works well? Would a different sander, maybe a 6", be faster & worth the money? Would a mini drum sander with 220 grit do a good job finish sanding?

Thanks for the help,
Jeremy

[Prashun Patel]

Hand planes have helped me tremendously on flat work. I still finish off with 220 and higher to remove errant track marks, but its much faster work than starting with 120. The big benefit is that you get a truly flat surface, so glossy finishes look great on a surface that has been planed.

[Keith Hankins]

I know what you mean. A lot of us like the build but hate the finish. I did too till I learned finishing from Charles Neil. He always says build to finish and since then, I've not had too many problems.

If you wish an alternative to sanding, then a hand plane or scrapers will give you that finish, but it will not reduce time!

220 is a finish point for most items, but it depends on the wood and then surface. If it's a top say to a table that will be the focal point of the piece then I go much higher 400 or even 600. Also endgrain should go 1 grit higher than long grain and that will help solve the problem of end-grain getting darker with finish.

If it's early in the process, and I want to take down material quick, I'll do 80 or 100, then follow with 120,220, etc.

Something else you may be over sanding. Here's a good trick when you get ready to sand those pieces. Do a trace coat of dye (not stain) cut the water base dye 50 percent with water and wipe on a lite coat. Sand till it's gone, and you are done! It will also help point out the uglies to fix prior to showing up in that final finish and making you want to put a fist through the wall.

The current piece I am working on a wine cabinet, had one. I put that dye on and sanded it down and spotted a divot that only became visible after the other dye was sanded off. I went and got a wet washcloth and rested the wife's iron on it for a second and lifted it right up! The nice thing about dye is it just sits on the surface, so it comes right off. Where as, dye goes in deep and has binders and seals the wood and if used will not come out easily.

I discovered after using this method I was sanding way to much and you may be too.

Finally sand the parts as you go along, so much easier to finish.

Once you take a little time and learn to build to finish, its not that bad. I don't hate it anymore.

https://flic.kr/s/aHsjvaxHi6

[Stan Calow]

Jeremy. What I do is use 4-5 sanders (garage & estate sales for cheap) and set up each one with a different grit of paper, then just switch sanders up through the grits. That way I don't have to stop and switch paper back and forth.
I do have one 6" RO that I use mostly to do big surfaces and leveling with 80 grit or so. It makes a difference in time, but too big and heavy for most smaller projects.

[Clay Crocker]

If you are skipping from 120 to 220 (which your post seems to indicate) that may be a big part of your problem. I normally start with 80 and then go 100, 120, 150, 180, 220. You don't have to sand for very long at each grit, but it is important to remove all of the "scratches" from the pervious grit before moving on. Using 220 grit paper to remove the relatively deep scratch marks left behind by 120 grit paper can take a long time. Another factor is the quality of paper you use. Cheap sandpaper will wear out fast and then you are just expending time and energy while getting nowhere. Good quality sand paper will wear out too, so make sure you are changing out sanding disks with new when necessary. Dust collection is important also, if your sander does not move the sanding dust away, it can cause the sandpaper to "load up" and dramatically diminish the effectiveness of the sandpaper. I don't think you would be satisfied with the finish produced by a "mini" drum sander. I have a floor model drum sander which is great for flattening and thicknessing panels, but it does not make for a finish ready surface. Too many linear sanding marks are left behind. I think you would need a wide belt sander to come close to what you are hoping for.

[Grant Wilkinson]

+1 on Clay's comments. Going from 120 to 220 is too big a jump. You will be forever at 220.

[glenn bradley]

There's a few issue at play here. First, as mentioned, work through the grits. If I were moving from 120 toward a 220 surface I would go to 150, 180 and then 220. Second, it sounds like the irregular surface yielded by a ROS is OK for what you are doing so, you are not after a flatter surface, just a faster one. Third, a drum sander will not give you the surface that a ROS does in that it is not random; there are lines.

All that being said, few parts in my pieces go from a machine to the build without some hand work; plane, scraper and/or abrasives. I have and use hand tools, a ROS, a drum sander, edge sander, etc. I do not know that a drum sander is any faster than a ROS. The main strength of the drum sander is consistent thickness. Even when going up to 320 and 400 grit on the drum when required, there are still lines to be hand removed.

The grit you stop at will vary with the look desired, the finish to be used and the material. At this point my first (and cheapest) recommendation would be to get some quality abrasives (not the stuff at the BORG) in a series of grits. Try a test piece with 120 jumping to 220 and time how long it takes you to get to your desired surface condition. Then do the same while moving through 120, 150, 180 and 220. I think you will find the overall sanding time to be shorter and you will use less abrasives as you are not asking your poor little 220 grit disc to do the work of the 150 and 180 grits before he can start making his own scratch-pattern.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Like Prashun said, planes. This is the reason I figured out how to use one, and have never looked back.

[lowell holmes]

I have reduced the sanding effort with the card scraper after viewing this video. I still sand, but only about 1/4 what was required before setting up my LN card scrapers like shown in this video.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/tool-guide/video/how-to-sharpen-a-card-scraper.aspx

[Ellen Benkin]

Get an ipod and listen to your music.

Always sand through all the grits. There are lots of technical reasons why but in the end you'll get a better finish. Clean off the wood between grits.

Just suck it up. It is tedious and boring but necessary. Remember that what people see when they look at your project is the finish.

OR

Hire a pro to finish it for you -- this is my favorite solution.

[Jeremy Killingbeck]

What type of hand plane do you suggest trying? I have s couple old Stanley planes (NO 4 & 5). Will either of those work?

[Steve Rozmiarek]

What type of hand plane do you suggest trying? I have s couple old Stanley planes (NO 4 & 5). Will either of those work?

Most likely yes they will. Can you post a pic of them? The 4 is good for most smoothing work (sander replacement), the 5 being a little longer can also be used to to flatten boards more easily. Don't be intimidated, sharpen the blade well, set the chipbreaker nearly on the bevel, set the depth light, and start experimenting. Very quickly you'll understand how they work.

[Jeremy Killingbeck]

310323

Here is a pic of my planes.

[Jeff Duncan]

Depending on the types of projects your doing, the single biggest help may be to just not sand so much. Going to 220 grit is pretty high, good for jewelry boxes and such I suppose, but totally overkill for say general tables, chairs, shelves, etc.. It's pretty rare that I go any higher than 150 grit on any project so I generally just use 2 grits 120/150.

good luck,
JeffD

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Those ought to work fine Jeremy. I'd start with the 4. Don't worry about having it perfect to start, just get a piece of scrap, sharpen and go!

[Kent A Bathurst]

Depending on the types of projects your doing, the single biggest help may be to just not sand so much. Going to 220 grit is pretty high, good for jewelry boxes and such I suppose, but totally overkill for say general tables, chairs, shelves, etc.. It's pretty rare that I go any higher than 150 grit on any project so I generally just use 2 grits 120/150.

good luck,
JeffD


Ditto. Mebbe 180 sometimes, but usually 150 is plenty.

[fRED mCnEILL]

I recently built a maloof style rocking chair. LOTS OF SANDING. What worked well for me was a Festool RO 150 sander. In rotary mode it can take off a LOT or wood and in RO mode gives a nice finish. Off the bandsaw and planer I used 180 grit then 220, 320,400, 500 and a wool polishing pad to burnish the wood. Prior to adding the finish the wood is shiny. It has a super finish finish. Unfortunately I can only afford one of these sanders(it is the 6") but will eventually get the 5" and 3". The 6" works well enough, just a little more difficult to use in tight spaces. I recently made quite a number of cutting boards/serving trays and used this sander almost exclusively. Piece of cake. To tell you the truth, with the proper tools sanding CAN be enjoyable.

regards

Fred

[John TenEyck]

For me the purchase of a drum sander was a game changer. You don't know flat and smooth until you see what comes out of a drum sander. Now, pretty much every piece of stock goes through my drum sander before building. The other revelation for me was getting a ROS. Never had one all these years; now that I do I can't imagine every going back. Hand planes for finishing the surface? I'm not that good. I always get tear out and or scallops or some other defect. For what you pay for one high end hand plane you could buy a Festool sander, or buy the Bosch and have money left over. Scraper? Sure, for a small area. Plus you have to sharpen both of them. For covering ground fast with consistent, excellent results I'll stick with my Bosch 6" ROS. A 6" sander has 44% more surface area than a 5" one. I've used several different brands of discs. Klingspore cuts great and lasts a long time, Mirca is OK but short lived, Abranet mesh seems great but I haven't used much yet, and Diablo from the BORG works surprisingly well IMHO. In any case, sandpaper doesn't need sharpening; when it gets dull you just put on a new disc and move on.

120 grit through the drum sander, start with the ROS at 100 grit (yes, to get rid of the linear scratches), 150 to finish for oak, ash, and similar coarse grained woods. 180 grit for woods like cherry, maple, and walnut. Finer than that makes no sense with a film finish.

John

[Mike Schuch]

I have 2 Porter cable 6" random orbit sanders and 1 AEG 6" random orbit sander. The 6" right angle random orbit sanders are considerably more powerful and considerably faster than the 5" random orbit I used. I keep a different grit on each sander so I can hit one side of a project with 3 different grits before I have to rotate the project. The 6" random orbits use peel and stick sand paper which is a lot cheaper than the hook and loop paper. Having multiple random orbit sanders makes peel and stick much more practical. I only bought one of the 6" sanders new, the other 2 I picked up used for a good price.

I also have 3 Rockwell/Porter Cable half sheet sanders that I use for large flat areas. These are not as aggressive as the 6" random orbit sanders but the large sanding surface of a half sheet make them productive on large surfaces and I am much less likely to gouge the wood with them.