Dark stain for Red Oak shelves tips for keeping inside corners blended

[whit richardson]

Yes I'm staining Red Oak a dark, dark brown called Expresso a water based stain from GF. I'm applying by hand and find that the stain gets darker in the inside corners when doing one inside surface due to overlap while applying the stain. I'm going to do three complete coats after testing it in a few strips and this the effect I want. Super dark brown with lots if grain pattern in ambient light. Looking for tips on how not to get the inside corners overdone darker while putting down the stain. The outside top, sides and bottom look great, the flat shelve surfaces are great just the 90 degree connections get too much stain from doing one side or another.

I picked Oak because a) my lumber source didn't have decent Ash b) these are for a large number of old vinyl records so weight is an issue and c) I wanted really nice grain depth to contrast with the Expresso because they (building two identical units) will sit in a media room with no outside light and halogen accent lights or dimmed light on them most all the time.

Tips, hints (now called hacks) or help anyone?

thanks

[Bill Clifton]

Digitize the records?

[Kent A Bathurst]

Stain & finish the components before assembly.

[whit richardson]

Staining before glue up was going to end up with stain in the glue area I just know it would happen. Not a good choice. Next time I'll probably spray the stain instead.

[whit richardson]

Digitize the records?

Not helpful.

[whit richardson]

Okay onward one way or another.

[John TenEyck]

I see a couple of options. One option is to do the entire corner at once and move outward from there. That way you wipe off only once and aren't coming back later with fresh stain that will end up getting on another surface that was already stained. The other option would be to mask off two surfaces and stain the unmasked one, then rinse and repeat until all three surfaces of the corner have been stained.

I just did two little bedside cabinets that have inside 3-way corners where the toe kick meet the sides. I did them following Option 1 - they came out fine.

John

[whit richardson]

Thanks John that is what I sort of resorted to. I had laid down one coat which always looks like heck. So I sponge brushed the sides from the corner carefully then came out from the corner again onto the shelf. That seems to be much better. One thing I'll not repeat is using GF Water based stain on oak again. Can't seem to mash it enough to get into the really grainy pores completely. Looks fantastic though when the oak has three coats. I'm thinking spraying the stain next time and switch to ash.

[John TenEyck]

Glad to hear it worked out OK. If you want to try a stain that works very well try Sherwin Williams BAC Wiping Stain. Solvent based, very high pigment content yet it's really thin, goes on beautifully with a foam brush but can be sprayed, too, plenty of open time, and wipes off beautifully w/o blotching. Dries very quickly after wiping and can be coated with sealer in under an hour per the PDS. Best stain I've ever used. Also, the color can easily be customized by SW or you can do it yourself. It works great on oak, BTW; gets into every pore w/o problems.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Staining before glue up was going to end up with stain in the glue area I just know it would happen. Not a good choice.

Not a good choice for some, perhaps, but I do it all the time. You might be convinced it will happen to you, but it doesn't happen to me - for 12+ years Blue tape on the tenons, be careful around the mortises. Very easy to do successfully.

And - I don't have to worry about evenness of stain/dye/varnish in the corners.

Plus - extra added bonuses - with stain/dye on the parts before glue up, missed squeeze-out cannot inhibit even absorption of stain/dye. And - with varnish on the parts, squeeze-out is very simple to clean up with damp rags.

These "glue-management" benefits are particularly important with open-pored woods - like RO and WO. THe large majority of what I do is QSWO, and it is a real pain to manage glue squeeze-out in interior corners - it can get smeared into those pores, and yer screwed.

To each his own, of course - pursue whatever actions you feel comfortable with. We - obviously - disagree on "Not a good choice".

[John TenEyck]

Those are the plus points Kent. The negatives include all the things that can happen to your nicely finished parts during and after glue up. Dents from clamps or tools, parts that don't fit quite right and need to be brought flush - oops, can't do that. Each approach has it's pluses and minuses, and neither is right every time. Sometimes, I finish some parts like door panels and spindles, and then put the piece together before finishing the rest. Case by case basis for me.

John

[Kent A Bathurst]

J-10: All true.

But - my methods avoid those pitfalls, so it works perfectly for me. Also - I do not have spray capability, so that puts a different spin on it. My real point was a counterpoint to "Not a good choice". KInd of a yeah, but - like your comment is.

I do - often, not always - make one last pass with a wipe-on version of the varnish after assembly. Erases any inadvertent scratches, etc.

The big driver for me was glue getting into thoe ^(#)*&^$ open pores in the QSWO - that is the death knell for me. I have gotten very good at minimizing squeeze-out - not perfect, but 80%+, but any glue in those pores is a freaking nightmare. And I generally deal with big $$ lumber................

[whit richardson]

Kent you probably have a good point there. Like many things in life as in woodworking there are more than one way to get something done well. With these shelves they are 3' with only one center shelf. I cut a dado for the center shelf so I was concerned about getting stain in the dado and then on the glue sides of the shelf too. I cut rabbets for the top and glued the sides to the rabbets. It's very possible I'll start another project and stain the parts before assembly because it would be better.

[whit richardson]

Thanks John. Interesting about the Sherwin-Williams. I was just researching what spray lacquer to use. With all the talks about so-and-so brands here I found Mr. Wood Whisperer recommending Sherwin-Williams pre-Cat lacquer products. I switched to S-W for paints years back with way better results for home painting so why not?

[whit richardson]

Those are the plus points Kent. The negatives include all the things that can happen to your nicely finished parts during and after glue up. Dents from clamps or tools, parts that don't fit quite right and need to be brought flush - oops, can't do that. Each approach has it's pluses and minuses, and neither is right every time. Sometimes, I finish some parts like door panels and spindles, and then put the piece together before finishing the rest. Case by case basis for me.

John

Yes I did a decent bit of finishing sanding the edges and flat surfaces just after the glue was dried.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Kent you probably have a good point there. Like many things in life as in woodworking there are more than one way to get something done well. With these shelves they are 3' with only one center shelf. I cut a dado for the center shelf so I was concerned about getting stain in the dado and then on the glue sides of the shelf too. I cut rabbets for the top and glued the sides to the rabbets. It's very possible I'll start another project and stain the parts before assembly because it would be better.


Hey - yeah - give it a try. Maybe works for you, mebbe not.

It made a big change for me - I was able to avoid second and third-tier problems. In fact, I don't even need the blue tape any more - I don't slop it over that much. And, if it is an issue, a block of wood with adhesive-backed 100g sandpaper takes care of it in a few swipes. Don't have to be perfect - just need enough clear surface for adhesion.