Sharpening/Tuning a Vintage Western Crosscut Saw – lots of Pics

[Mike Allen1010]

For a change of pace between woodworking projects, I have been restoring and tuning up some Golden era, vintage saws (Disston and Simonds). For me saw tuning is a fungible skill, little like shooting – if I haven’t done it for a while, it takes a little bitto get back into the swing.

A few weeks back I posted a thread on restoring/sharpening a Western rip saw. I believe this is a link that will take you there:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?227083-Saw-Restoration-and-Sharpening-Pics

It seemed like ther ewas some interest on another post focused on crosscut saws so here goes.
Disclaimer: I have a bad hand saw problem. At this stage it’s probably terminal. This is just the way I sharpen/tune saws. Certainly there other ways that work just as well if not better. This is just what works for me.

I apologize upfront if it seems I am talking down to any my fellow neanders who know more about the subject than me. I find the recent conversation about “experts versus newbies” here on the creek unsettling. I recently had the pleasure of helping a fellow creeker serving his country as a member of USN sharpen his first saw. My intent here is to cover the things he found helpful (thank you Steve for your service!). There is a fair amount of “saw geekery” here that you don’t need to achieve the first time around. Just getting the teeth in rough shape will make a huge difference in performance.

The initial steps of sharpening a crosscut saw are identical to those for a rip saw. I won’t rehash these here. A couple friendly reminders: check the tooth line and current set to see how much of the original tooth line you need to remove to get a straight/breasted tooth line and your target set.
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After initial jointing, work from one side of the saw to get uniform profiling, spacing and tooth height. Here are some before-and-after pics:
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At this stage, you’re gonna be removing a lot of steel so remember to keep your file clean. It’s also helpful to slope the first tooth, to reduce the risk it “catches”, which can tweak the saw plate
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[Mike Allen1010]

When initially profiling the teeth, you don’t have to remove all the steel to fully erase the flat spots, (which you can see in the red circles). You will get those on the next step – better at this stage to remove less steel than too much.
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Once the teeth have been profiled, it should look like this. Now you want to begin establishing the fleam angle on the teeth that are set away from you.
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Start by registering the tip of the file, with the apex of the cutting edge ecurely in the gullet. Start the stroke of the file with it oriented 90° to the tooth line. It’s helpful to tilt the handle down. As you push the file forward, shift the handle towards the heel of the plate to begin establishing the fleam angle.
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In this picture the teeth indicated by the arrows have the initial fleam angle established. Now the saw is reversed in the vice and you’re ready to start filing the fleam angle on the second set of teeth set away from you.
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[Mike Allen1010]

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After this is done,teeth will look like this: fleam angle for both sets of teeth established, but the apex of the cutting-edge of little ragged.

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Now the time to set the teeth. After using the set , joint lightly one more time. You want to leave very small flat spots as indicated in the red circles. These will be removed in the final finish sharpening step. The red arrow shows the leading edge of a tooth that hasn’t been fully filed all the way across. Again this will be corrected in the final “sharpening” step.
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For final sharpening, you can disregard the rake angle guide block as the rake angle and spacing has already been established. Use the fingers of your off hand to make sure the tip of the file is firmly seated in the gullet, consistent with the slope angle of the gullets (optional - handle lower than the tip).
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[Mike Allen1010]

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Don’t be afraid to try sharpening your saws. If your saws are like most of those I see, you’ll get an 80% improvement in performance even if all the details aren’t perfect. With a little practice, you’ll squeeze out the last 20% performance that comes from getting all the elements; geometry, set, smooth cutting surfaces etc. to all come together.

All the best, Mike

[Jeff Wittrock]

Thanks for posting this Mike.
I am definitely still in the newbie category when it comes to saw sharpening, but I enjoy trying, and your post is very helpful.

[Roger Rettenmeier]

You started with a saw with some ugly tooth geometry, and made it look pretty. Also, those were some nice, clear close up pics of the operation.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

Well done. I am about to teach my Saturday class how to sharpen and will borrow your idea of drawing lubber lines to guide you.

[Stewie Simpson]

Hi Mike. Nice work with the saw sharpening tutorial.

regards Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

Hi Mike. Apologies for hijacking your thread. If I could add an extra bit of advise to what you have already outlined within your tutorial.

During the final run of shaping the teeth, you are likely to come across the odd tooth that has a flat spot which greatly exceeds that of the tooth before and after it.

To deal with this, increase the file entry angle slightly so that file only makes contact with the back of that tooth.

The goal is a to end up with a full length of tooth line, with every tooth at the same exact front rake angle, and every gullet to a repeatable depth.

Ongoing practice will determine how well you can meet both criteria.

regards Stewie;

[Mike Allen1010]

Hi Mike. Apologies for hijacking your thread. If I could add an extra bit of advise to what you have already outlined within your tutorial.

During the final run of shaping the teeth, you are likely to come across the odd tooth that has a flat spot which greatly exceeds that of the tooth before and after it.

To deal with this, increase the file entry angle slightly so that file only makes contact with the back of that tooth.

The goal is a to end up with a full length of tooth line, with every tooth at the same exact front rake angle, and every gullet to a repeatable depth.

Ongoing practice will determine how well you can meet both criteria.

regards Stewie;


Hi Stewie,

ASOLUTELY no apology necessary! I always enjoy your threads and really value your knowledge, insights and many collegial contributions to the creek.

Case in point, IMHO your advice above is right on target. Thanks for sharing your helpful tip.

All the best, Mike

[Mike Cherry]

Thank you for posting this and your rip saw entry! I will be referencing these soon as I found an awesome Disston panel saw of the crosscut variety recently and it needs sharpened.

[Thomas Schneider]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for taking the time to photograph and write this up. It never ceases to amaze me when people take time out of their day to help someone they have never met and probably never will!

Tom.

[Walter Barbier]

Mike,

Thanks for putting up this thread. I've been lurking in this site and a few others and have probably read and viewed more than a dozen saw sharpening tutorials and videos. In this thread you added a few details that really help clarify some points in the process. I appreciate the time and effort that you and others in the creek have put into educating "newbies" like me.

Walt

[Don Kingston]

Holy Cow this is good. Thank You.
And thanks to the sailor

[Don Slaughter]

Hey Mike.....gotta thank you personally....publicly! THANK YOU! The visit to your shop was so very enlightening. I appreciate your friendliness, your knowledge and your generosity. The crosscut saw you blessed me with is a star in my shop! Making a small table and had to cut the legs from 8/4 sapele 10"wide....this saw made that task pure joy!
Hoping to see you next Wednesday for the SDFWWA meeting and also hoping to discuss the upcoming 'Old Tool Swap Meet' coming up the second Sunday in April. It's always a lot of fun to go and, after your tutorials, I have about six saws ready to present. I know you have a few too.
BTW I strolled through the Qualcom Swapmeet on Wednesday and found a nice KeenKutter 8tpi rip worth restoring and an intheboxneverused Stanley 432 HandyMan Saw Set. First time I ever held one and it really looks like a good find for me. Also found a teensy pad saw....I'll post pics soon.
Looking forward,
Don