Whitewood and planing questions

[Mike Cherry]

So I'm still very new to woodworking and although I am getting beautiful shavings and pleasurable results from every domestic I have yet to try, I can not get a good surface from this abomination of a wood from the BORG. Any tips for a cheapskate that needs to build his daughter a bookshelf?

[glenn bradley]

Sand it; I know, blasphemy. The super-soft material does not lend itself well to the hand plane in my experience. I am not a complete knuckle-dragger so our dyed-in-the-wool Neanders will probably have a method for dealing with such materials. Razor sharp cutters with frequent touch-ups comes to mind. The fibers tend to crush rather than shear unless things are incredibly sharp and kept that way.

[Mike Cherry]

Right Glenn,
I more or less was looking for confirmation that it is indeed difficult to plane. Being relatively new, it is sometimes a fine line between incorrect technique and unrealistic expectations. Being such a cheap wood, it is easy for someone new like me to be drawn to this "wood" only to feel that your edged tools are not up to the task. If I didn't have other species around, I very easily could be frustrated with my sharpening.

Thanks for for the reply.

[Daniel Rode]

I've done a fair bit of hand tool work with the soft pine from the BORG. I've had good success but pine requires very sharp planes and chisels. It's easy to work in the sense that it doesn't require much effort, but it's also fragile and will tear rather than cut unless the tools are sharp. Even with sharp tools, it often pays to take light cuts.

The white wood in my area is typically eastern white pine. Being in CA, your local BORG may carry a different species and it might work differently.

[Mike Cherry]

Thanks Daniel, I feel that my tools( or maybe my confidence) are not able to get a good surface on this wood. I do rather enjoy the joinery aspect, aside from the lesson I have learned about bruising the shoulders of joints rather easily. One of life's lessons, I suppose. Perhaps the day will come when I can tackle these softer woods with more confidence. I will, of course, keep trying but for now I will sand 😪

[Chris Hachet]

This is why I usually prefer to buy poplar rather than the rapid growth white pine from the Borg.

If I do buy pine from the Borg, i actually like the stuff better that has a few knots in it and is older growth-closer growth rings.

I buy pine from a local wholesale supplier and it is several orders of magnitude better than the BORG stuff.

YMMV.

Chris

[Jim Koepke]

Mike,

The difficulties one must endure with "West Coast White Wood" are well known.

Even with careful selection one can still get stuck with some troublesome wood to work.

The hardest parts for me is around knots on the face of a board. Even with the lightest of cuts the edges of the layers can tear out.

There is "the rule of the cathedrals" where one looks at the V layers formed by the growth rings. If the end grain rings look like a smile, plane in the direction of the Vs. If the end grain looks like a frown plane into the Vs or plane 'em down.

At times this may not work nor will a look at the side grain. Some of the trees that make up the "White Wood" species are grown in windy locations. Not sure if it is the case, but it seems maybe this has some effect on the structure of the wood and grain.

Sometimes along an edge will be a short patch of reversing grain. Sometimes it works to plane the edge down with as thin a shaving as possible with a sharp blade. Then take a few as light a shaving as is possible with the chip breaker set close to a sharp edge in the opposite direction only until the rough patch is smooth.

One of my habits from working this wood is to pick the best pieces possible. Also there are some that are almost always bought when seen even if buying wood wasn't on the list. These are the ones that have what looks to be tiger spots in the wood. My wife calls it "bird's eye pine." The surface will have a little texture even after sanding, but it looks great as an end piece for a book shelf.

Before committing to cutting, select the best surface to be on the outside. Smooth as best as possible to make sure. And as others suggest, scrape, sand and do what is needed.

Do you plan on making a back for these shelves?

Also do you plan on through dados to house the shelves?

My preference is for stopped dados and a radius at the corners like this:

308436

As compared to a through dado like this:

308435

BTW, both of the above shelf units are white wood from the borg.

Hope this helps. Show us some pictures of the build, just about everyone loves pictures.

jtk

[Jim Koepke]

I buy pine from a local wholesale supplier and it is several orders of magnitude better than the BORG stuff.

A building supply store in Southwest Washington has #3 pine at about half the price of the big box stores. Selecting the pieces is still finding the wood as good as what the BORGs call #2 grade. They have a premium grade that is still less then the big boys charge.

jtk

[Mike Cherry]

Yea Jim, I was going to do stopped dadoes, but after seeing how yours look with the radius I might add that as well :) The irony, is that this whitewood isnt that much cheaper than I can get poplar. As for the back of the bookshelf, I was toying with the idea of a back panel as I just got a fancy new plough plane from LV!

[Jim Koepke]

Yea Jim, I was going to do stopped dadoes, but after seeing how yours look with the radius I might add that as well :) The irony, is that this whitewood isnt that much cheaper than I can get poplar. As for the back of the bookshelf, I was toying with the idea of a back panel as I just got a fancy new plough plane from LV!

If you can't do stopped plowing, then a molding around the top can hide the plowed channel from showing. There are also other ways such as half blind and full blind joinery.

Sometimes lumber pricing seems to be a mystery. Demand and shipping costs can do a lot to dictate the price.

jtk

[steven c newman]

White wood 2x4 from Lowes? Ripped right down the middle for leg blanks. Had to joint the sawn edges
308440
Seemed to do ok. Made some nice shavings, too
308441
Have a three board panel glued up, and in the clamps. Might need a little plane work on the seams. Legs seem to turn ok, just I hate knots
308442

Trying to build a Shaker end table, with a drawer...just white wood..

[Tony Zaffuto]

Here in North East North Central Pennsyltucky, I can buy and have white pine shipped to me from Grof Lumber/Quarryville, PA for less than buying off the rack at the local borg. That is the first good thing! The second is there is no comparison between the lumber from Grof and the borg, it is that much better. The same applies to poplar and red oak (other lumber on the rack at the local borg).

The local borg (a blue big box) applies the term "white wood" to a variety of stuff for which there is really no accurate label, including stuff that might be pine, some plywood with something that looks similar as the top veneer and so forth.

To the OP, I would take the time to find a "mom & pop" source (non chain) to buy your supplies. Save your frustrations for mistakes you will make and not for something, such as the junk lumber, sold by the borgs.

[lowell holmes]

Try to get some soft maple. It's not terribly expensive and it also behaves well.

[Kent A Bathurst]

... there is no comparison between the lumber from Grof and the borg, it is that much better......

The local borg (a blue big box) applies the term "white wood" to a variety of stuff for which there is really no accurate label..........

Grof [don't know them] is not in the Sunday paper supplement race to the bottom of the price curve with the big boys, and their strategy is quality and service v price and volume. Just a guess, but a comfortable guess.

The accurate label of the white wood is that, regardless of the species du jour, it was the best value for the store's buy which meets the grade and structural rules: a #2 is a #2, a Stud is a Stud. They are gunning for Joe Home Improvement and small contractors.

In your region, it will usually be Eastern Spruce - meaning Eastern Canada. But - at times, market conditions and vendor inventory issues could mean that they bought a car load, or a train load, of western spruce, or pond pine, or Lord knows what - but it meets the grade and structural rules. So - just to keep the confusion level down with Joe Homeowner - they started calling the entire mishmash Whitewood.

Those products fit that target market well. We, in general, ain't it. But, I confess - when that is what I am after, I go there, because of the $$. But I sure as heck don't buy it to plane/mill it to make furniture.

[Jim Matthews]

If your resources are few, look for discarded
Ikea beds (bear with me now).

The majority of the material is particle board,
unsuitable to woodworking.

The slats are fine birch or beech and make excellent start
material. If you're starting out, I recommend White oak,
if you can find it.

It's very forgiving of handtool methods.

I strongly recommend that you contact your nearest
lumber seller, and lay out your skillset next to your ambitions.

They've seen us start up before, and are eager to earn
new customers.

http://www.tulepeaktimber.com/site/main?page=Home

[Chris Hachet]

Here in North East North Central Pennsyltucky, I can buy and have white pine shipped to me from Grof Lumber/Quarryville, PA for less than buying off the rack at the local borg. That is the first good thing! The second is there is no comparison between the lumber from Grof and the borg, it is that much better. The same applies to poplar and red oak (other lumber on the rack at the local borg).

The local borg (a blue big box) applies the term "white wood" to a variety of stuff for which there is really no accurate label, including stuff that might be pine, some plywood with something that looks similar as the top veneer and so forth.

To the OP, I would take the time to find a "mom & pop" source (non chain) to buy your supplies. Save your frustrations for mistakes you will make and not for something, such as the junk lumber, sold by the borgs.

I would strongly echo this sentiment.

[Chris Hachet]

If your resources are few, look for discarded
Ikea beds (bear with me now).

The majority of the material is particle board,
unsuitable to woodworking.

The slats are fine birch or beech and make excellent start
material. If you're starting out, I recommend White oak,
if you can find it.

It's very forgiving of handtool methods.

I strongly recommend that you contact your nearest
lumber seller, and lay out your skillset next to your ambitions.

They've seen us start up before, and are eager to earn
new customers.

http://www.tulepeaktimber.com/site/main?page=Home

White Oak is also an excellent idea. I have 5 kids (3 of them are grown and on their own now) and the stuff will definitely survive well in a busy hosuehold.

Working with hardwood will give you experience to build things other than furniture, be it a fine jewlery box or a guitar....that are really unsuited to pine.

[steven c newman]

Chris: You are welcome to come over this weekend and work with some "white wood from BORG" as I am building a Shaker Table out of the stuff.....

[Chris Hachet]

Chris: You are welcome to come over this weekend and work with some "white wood from BORG" as I am building a Shaker Table out of the stuff.....

I have a term paper due for an art class I am taking. But this is very tempting.....

Chris

[steven c newman]

Got some of the hard parts done
308472
Legs are turned
308473
And the top has a Bread Board ends done. Aprons and drawer still to be cobbled up....

Still on medical leave, too....

[Chris Hachet]

Got some of the hard parts done
308472
Legs are turned
308473
And the top has a Bread Board ends done. Aprons and drawer still to be cobbled up....

Still on medical leave, too....

I like the breadboard ends...

[Jim Matthews]

I think a lot of us are nudged toward pine for our 'first' projects,
because of the cost. What isn't mentioned is that it requires
tools that are sharper than most of us Newbies could manage.

Now that I can get a blade tight, I like planing pine.
In the first few go 'rounds, it was a mess.

It seems backwards, exactly that softer materials would be harder to handle.

[steven c newman]

Chopping Mortises: Strop the mortise chisel after each mortise is done
Wards #78 vs tenons: Mark the line with the spur, then cut a bit with the dovetail saw, otherwise, crossgrain tenons will still splinter out at the end.
Rip cuts: I use a plane to remove all the saw marks
308548
I Hate knots in this stuff, but, sometimes they do land right where a joint needs to be made
308549
Other that these things, not much trouble to work with.

[Reinis Kanders]

I agree with Steve, knots are the annoying part of this wood, otherwise my local whitewood is not so bad.

I do not have a time during day to go to the lumberyard so I am stuck with my local HD and their pine is not too bad, I am near Boston. My HD sells 1x12 No.2 pine for about $2 per board foot and usually in the pile there are some boards without knots. I ususally just cruise by and take those boards, does not even require any digging, just frequent visits.