Soundproofing small yet noisy workshop

[Giovanni Rinaldi]

Hello everyone!

I'm in the process of converting a very tiny room into a workshop, the problem is... Neighbours! They're quite easily irated by any noise and will not hesitate to call the police if I even turn my drill on.

I live in a condominium with some very thin walling and flooring, so it's nearly impossible to avoid issues with (and annoyance to) them, and they are some very bad troublemakers. Current laws prevent them from taking any action against me and me from taking any against them, but one day things will get ugly for me, I'm sure.

Now, the room is very tiny, just 5x10x10 ft, I was suggested to just put some rockwool and drywall everywhere, but I'd like to avoid mineral wool and fibres, with that said, is there any other sound (pun not intended) alternative?

Please bear in mind that most of the noise is produced by my circular saw, on its manual I read: "The A-rated noise level of the power tool is typically as follows: Sound pressure level 96 dB(A); Sound power level 107 dB(A). Uncertainty K= 3 dB.". I'd like that to be lower, I would be very happy with 20 dB less noise, and some less vibration. My workbench vibrates a lot too, it's a B+D Workmate 301.

Thanks in advance for reading this far and eventually giving me any answer.


EDIT: I'm sorry, for some reason it did not format the post, it's fixed now!

[eric burns]

I would say use the search feature for sound proofing or sound deadening. There are lots of threads on the topic. Another option is search on some home theater forums. There's lots of information about how to sound proof or deaden sound. Hope that helps.

[Mel Fulks]

I bought some commercial carpet squares from a Habitat for Humanity "Restore" . Suspended them around an attic fan that was noisy,worked well. There are good "real" soundproofing things ,but this is obviously not something you want to
spend a lot of money on. Thrift store blankets hung on 2x2 material several inches away from wall might work.

[Giovanni Rinaldi]

I would say use the search feature for sound proofing or sound deadening. There are lots of threads on the topic. Another option is search on some home theater forums. There's lots of information about how to sound proof or deaden sound. Hope that helps.Sure, there are, but those may or may not apply to my situation, so I thought that, while being potentially annoying to the forum's users, a new thread with my own situation and details would be much better.
I bought some commercial carpet squares from a Habitat for Humanity "Restore" . Suspended them around an attic fan that was noisy,worked well. There are good "real" soundproofing things ,but this is obviously not something you want to spend a lot of money on. Thrift store blankets hung on 2x2 material several inches away from wall might work.What do you mean by 2x2? Pardon my ignorance, I have no clue.

[Mel Fulks]

2x2 is just construction Borg material that is 1 and 1/2 inches square,real cheap stuff. The carpet squares I mentioned are
the one backed with thick rubber. They were new and 25 cents each.

[Anthony Whitesell]

Basically it sounds like Mel built a "sub-wall" within his shop the sound dampening material attached.

As you work through this, remember the sound your neighbor's are hearing is sound that is being re-transmitted through the walls. Te key will be to dampen or absorb the sound before it vibrates their side of the wall. The two biggest factors will be weight and absorption. Roxul insulation and drywall are dense and heavy, the carpet squares and blankets are absorbent.

[Rick Potter]

Perhaps you could line the walls with 1" foam insulation sheets, available at many home improvement places. They could be held in place with small squares of double stick tape if you are renting. A carpet on the floor would help also.

The circular saw is another story. You may need to come up with an alternative, like a small band saw, or a hand saw.

Of course, you should limit the noise to working hours if possible.

[Ray Newman]

From what you wrote, I have the feeling that whatever you do, your neighbors will find fault.

I wish you good luck and success.

[Jerrimy Snook]

My coworker has hot glued egg carton bottoms to panels and hung the panels from the walls of his drum room. His wife is able to watch her shows in the next room and his neighbors have asked him if he still plays his drum set. You would have to research the db level reduction to see if it is a viable solution for you. Maybe the posters from this thread http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?227738-Eggs! could donate some egg cartons?

[James Nugnes]

That is really a tough one I think. I do like the suggestion about the bandsaw. My bandsaw is by far the most efficient, versatile power cutting tool I have or have ever seen when weighing noise vs performance. If you could convert your work to a bandsaw, you might end up starting with something akin to a hum to deaden which might really give you a chance to get far enough ahead of the game to get it done. Unless there is some resonance in the walls that matches that of the bandsaw you could be much farther ahead of the game than you are going to be with the circular saw. Don't know what you would do if there is a resonance point in the wall that matches too closely the circular saw. At least I think the bandsaw would give you a shot at this even beyond the question of wall component resonances.

[Peter Aeschliman]

The first thing is to think about noise in two categories:

1) airborne (music, voices, power tool motors, etc)
2) impact (hand tool work with a mallet, moving material around, bumping into walls, vibration from tools affixed to the wall, etc)

Airborne noise is solved with soft/absorbent materials such as roxul batting in the walls, carpet, those foam egg crate things on the wall and ceiling surfaces, etc. It's also mitigated by using less noisy tools of course.

Impact noise is much harder- it's vibrations passing through the structure. So the key is to isolate the surfaces you impact from the structure. This can be hard because drywall screws go into studs drywall and baseboard trim touches the floor and ceiling, etc. All of those physical connections transfer vibrations through your structure, which is what your neighbors hear.

So from my research, here are some things to consider:



to strip your walls, floor, and ceiling down to the framing,
install roxul between the studs and joists,
re-sheeth the floor with plywood but apply sound deadening adhesive to the floor joists before laying down the ply,
install two layers of accoustic drywall to the walls and ceilings using special sound deadening adhesive between them and making sure not to allow the walls to touch the floor or the ceiling (leave a gap), and using a clip and channel system called resilient channel, which physically isolates the drywall fasteners from the framing structure, caulk the gaps between the walls and ceilings with acoustic caulk to close the gaps.
do not use hard surface flooring- install a nice thick carpet pad and carpet in the room. Will be a pain to clean, but probably better than dealing with angry neighbors or your HOA
You could also leave the current framing in place and build a room within a room... although that room is already pretty small


I did this research when I lived in condo. I hated the disputes with my neighbors, and I didn't do any woodworking or partying in my condo. I decided proper sound proofing was too expensive, so we didn't do it and saved our money to buy a house. ;)

Sorry for your troubles. I hate not feeling like i can do what I want at home without angering others... Also, there's tons of info on the internet about sound proofing. It might make you feel better to know that your troubles aren't quite as unique as you seem to think. :)

[Giovanni Rinaldi]

Thanks everyone for the responses so far, I really appreciate it. And also for your support and jokes.
The first thing is to think about noise in two categories:1) airborne (music, voices, power tool motors, etc)2) impact (hand tool work with a mallet, moving material around, bumping into walls, vibration from tools affixed to the wall, etc)Airborne noise is solved with soft/absorbent materials such as roxul batting in the walls, carpet, those foam egg crate things on the wall and ceiling surfaces, etc. It's also mitigated by using less noisy tools of course.Impact noise is much harder- it's vibrations passing through the structure. So the key is to isolate the surfaces you impact from the structure. This can be hard because drywall screws go into studs drywall and baseboard trim touches the floor and ceiling, etc. All of those physical connections transfer vibrations through your structure, which is what your neighbors hear.So from my research, here are some things to consider:

to strip your walls, floor, and ceiling down to the framing,
install roxul between the studs and joists,
re-sheeth the floor with plywood but apply sound deadening adhesive to the floor joists before laying down the ply,
install two layers of accoustic drywall to the walls and ceilings using special sound deadening adhesive between them and making sure not to allow the walls to touch the floor or the ceiling (leave a gap), and using a clip and channel system called resilient channel, which physically isolates the drywall fasteners from the framing structure, caulk the gaps between the walls and ceilings with acoustic caulk to close the gaps.
do not use hard surface flooring- install a nice thick carpet pad and carpet in the room. Will be a pain to clean, but probably better than dealing with angry neighbors or your HOA
You could also leave the current framing in place and build a room within a room... although that room is already pretty small

I did this research when I lived in condo. I hated the disputes with my neighbors, and I didn't do any woodworking or partying in my condo. I decided proper sound proofing was too expensive, so we didn't do it and saved our money to buy a house. ;)Sorry for your troubles. I hate not feeling like i can do what I want at home without angering others... Also, there's tons of info on the internet about sound proofing. It might make you feel better to know that your troubles aren't quite as unique as you seem to think. :)Thanks for your reply. :)I can't touch the walls, I should have pointed it out, pardon me; however I could use plywood and adhesive on the already existing floor (which I could even remove, if really necessary) and could even put carpets and anti-vibration mats (under my benches, because I doubt those mats would be useful on the floor). I can place drywall on the ceiling (up to 4 inches) and walls (up to 1/2 inch), but as of now I don't have access to acoustic drywall nor caulk, could you tell me what they are made of? Maybe the shops that carry them just don't know what they are, which is common where I live.Thanks again.

[Bradley Gray]

I built a sound control booth at a local high school 10 years ago. The walls had a sandwich of 2pieces of 5/8" drywall with 1/2" soundboard between on both sides of 2 x 6 stud walls filled with sound barrier fiberglass insulation, same on ceiling. We also built a "bass trap" on one wall - angled wall panels to break up sound bouncing between walls. All very effective but takes up a lot of room volume. I like the band saw idea and also a Hegner jig saw is nearly silent. Any chance you could rent a garage or something nearby?

[Jamie Buxton]

Really? Your shop floor is only 5 feet by 10 feet?! Wow. How do you get a table saw in there, and still have room for whatever you're building?
I'd get rid of the table saw, or else move my shop to some larger space.

[Giovanni Rinaldi]

Any chance you could rent a garage or something nearby? None, it's "that or get the hell out", I wish I could rent a garage, it'd make things much easier for me, but sadly I don't have this option.

[Rick Potter]

What is it you are trying to build? Is this for a hobby, or are you trying to do something in particular.

If this is a hobby, or creative outlet, perhaps you could realign it a bit to something like scroll sawing.

You mention some things are not available where you live. If so, adjustment will have to be made.

[Giovanni Rinaldi]

What is it you are trying to build? Is this for a hobby, or are you trying to do something in particular.

If this is a hobby, or creative outlet, perhaps you could realign it a bit to something like scroll sawing.

You mention some things are not available where you live. If so, adjustment will have to be made.

Hi, I'm sorry for replying late. Some things are not available as you name them, meaning that I may not have soundproofing carpets in the store, but they will be called polyurethane carpets without any mention of soundproofing, so I need to know what I'm looking for.

[Robert Engel]

Mattias Wandel has a video on YouTube about this.
I recently put alot of those interlocking cushion mats on the floor around my workbench machines.
Seemed to make a diff.
My ceiling has exposed rafters so I think that helps, too.
Basically anything to break up the sound waves.
I had a terrible problem in the waiting room at my office we put carpet on the walls help immensely (bad choice for shop, tho).
I think the carpet squares are worth the try.

[Lornie McCullough]

Another option is to change the way they feel about your woodworking, and in that way modify their tolerance for your work.

If you make cutting boards, (for example) make an extra one, and give it as a gift.

Lornie

[Matt McCoy]

Is there a makerspace nearby you could join?

Unfortunately, you typically need mass and decoupling (i.e., a room within a room) to help stop the transmission of sound. Carpets, etc. will only treat reflected echos in your room. Mechanical vibrations will be a lot more difficult to tame.

[Mike Gabbay]

Roxul makes rockwool sound insulation batts (Sound and Safe) that I have installed in half of my basement shop ceiling. They seem to control a fair amount of noise. Once I get the rest of the ceiling done I think it will make a significant difference upstairs. Home Depot sells them at about $45 for 12 4' batts IIRC. It also acts as a fire retardant for the rest of the home.