Any recommendation for a veneer press (vacuum pump, bag, etc.)

[Fidel Fernandez]

I am going to buy a veneer press for a project that I am working on.

Could you recommend some providers? I have some providers that I won't work with them, personal reasons and I won't make business with Veneer supplies. Please don't ask why.

So I need a reputable business that can sell to individuals and not pros.

I was looking vac-u-clamp. Any recommendations?

[Jamie Buxton]

www.joewoodworker.com

[Dave Bonde]

I agree, joewoodworker I build one from Joe's plans and parts and it has served me well for several years.

[Bill Orbine]

https://www.vacupress.com/products.htm

[Dan Clark]

I've been pondering a veneer press press kit for a couple of years. www.joewoodworker.com (http://www.joewoodworker.com) is definitely my first choice. They are an excellent source for kits, components, and veneer. This is their PDF comparing the kits: http://www.joewoodworker.com/docs/vacuumpresschart.pdf

Details on their kits:
http://www.veneersupplies.com/categories/Vacuum__Press__Items/Vacuum__Press__Kits

Plans for building a press:
http://www.joewoodworker.com/veneering/downloads.htm

General tips and tricks:
http://www.joewoodworker.com/veneering/welcome.htm

Who's Joe?
http://www.veneersupplies.com/pages/About__Us.html

Cruise the site for awhile. Lots of good info there.

Regards,

Dan.

[Jason Beam]

Since you refuse to do business with a very reliable and reputable vendor like Veneer Supplies, without telling us why, all I can suggest is vacupress ... but they're my 2nd choice.

[Mike Henderson]

I have two vacuum pumps built with Joe's kit. They work well.

When buying a bag you have a decision to make. One choice is to buy a big bag (4x8) so that you can do large work as well as small work - you can always put small things into a big bag.

But a big bag is expensive and if you don't have any plans to make something large, it's a waste.

The other approach is to buy a small bag (2x4) for small work. That bag will be a lot less expensive and when you have a large project, you can spring for a big bag. I use my 2x4 bag a lot more than my 4x8 bag. Also note that the bag size is the size of what you can put into it, not the size of the bag.

Then you have to decide between vinyl and polyurethane bags. Vinyl bags are usually thicker than poly bags. People say that poly bags last longer. I only have poly bags so I can't compare them to vinyl bags.

Whatever bag you buy, it's nice to have breather mesh in the bag (or a platen with grooves cut into it). You can buy breather mesh from Joe, but you can also use plain old screen (the stuff you have on your windows). The disadvantage of screen is that it can bunch up when you're putting stuff into the bag (or taking stuff out). The commercial breather mesh is stiffer and doesn't do that very easily.

Mike

[Fidel Fernandez]

I always believe that any problem between two parties should be managed between them.
Yes, I had some problems with Joe woodworker and Veneer supplies. It is something we are handling it between us.
I hope you guys will understand my way to not place more strain to a dire business relationship
I will check Vacupress, thanks for the advise.

Fidel

[David Ragan]

Joe Woodworker been responsive and good to me.

I have a vacuum pump and the poly bags that have lasted for years.

[Jim Becker]

Joe Woodworker for sure...

[Susumu Mori]

Hi Mike,

How important to have the auto-cycle capability? It seems some of the pump is only 45db and if clamping time is 1-2 hours, continuous pumping sounds enough for average hobbyist?

[Bill Adamsen]

Timely question ... I was looking at JW and about to start a build. Some of the units leverage small (3 to 5 gallon) air tanks instead of the schedule 40/80 pvc. Has anyone tried that, and are there opinions one way or another?

The other question was about just how well the Venturi models work. I'm impressed that it can generate 27.5" of Hg ... but how many cubic feet of air are required? I have a reasonable sized (80 gallon Champion) compressor, but how long will it need to run ... what is the ratio of air pressure to vacuum?

[Brian Holcombe]

I put together the Kit from Joewoodworker (veneer supplies) and use his bags/veneers and I've been using them for 3-4 years with success. Joe has been fantastic....

[John TenEyck]

I would buy a Gast or equivalent vacuum pump. You don't need many CFM, a smaller one just takes longer to evacuate the bag. Once the bag is collapsed it doesn't take but a fraction of CFM to keep it at whatever vacuum you want. You don't need 27" of Hg either. Anything over 20" is plenty. My pump only pulls about 22". I let it cycle down to 18" or so before coming back on. I've never had a failure. You can buy vacuum pumps from lots of places. I got mine from McMaster Carr 15 or more years ago.

Build your own bag. You can make it any size you want, it's easy to do, and it's cheap. I use 20 or 30 mil vinyl that I buy from a local boat window and awning place. You can glue vinyl with PVC pipe cement; it's stupid simple. Buy a bag penetration and you are in business. To seal it just roll the end over a large dowel or piece of wood; it will seal to itself. I've been using the same bag for over 10 years, and had just a couple of small leaks that I patched with a scrap of vinyl.

People make vacuum laminating/veneering out to be more complicated and expensive than it has to be. Keep it simple, keep it cheap. It works just as well.

John

[Max Neu]

I have dealt with veneer systems and vacu press quite a bit.They are geared towards the professional side, as opposed to veneer supplies that is more of a hobby level type products.I think they are all good at what they do, they are just better suited for different crowds.

[Fidel Fernandez]

What about this one?

http://vac-u-clamp.com/index.php?pageControl=productdetails&prodid=2

[Tony Joyce]

Timely question ... I was looking at JW and about to start a build. Some of the units leverage small (3 to 5 gallon) air tanks instead of the schedule 40/80 pvc. Has anyone tried that, and are there opinions one way or another?

The other question was about just how well the Venturi models work. I'm impressed that it can generate 27.5" of Hg ... but how many cubic feet of air are required? I have a reasonable sized (80 gallon Champion) compressor, but how long will it need to run ... what is the ratio of air pressure to vacuum?

I built one for a friend and it works better than I thought it would.

307079

[Mike Henderson]

Hi Mike,

How important to have the auto-cycle capability? It seems some of the pump is only 45db and if clamping time is 1-2 hours, continuous pumping sounds enough for average hobbyist?
Sure, if the noise doesn't bother you, you can use a continuous pump. You can always start with a continuous pump and then add stuff around the pump to make it intermittent. The system makes it intermittent, not the pump itself.

Someone asked about venturi systems. They work well, to the best of my knowledge, but you're running a fairly big compressor to create the vacuum. If you have the compressor, and you plan to always do your work where you have access to your compressor, they're a decent solution. Venturi systems work similar to pumps. All bags and systems leak so you generally have to run it continuously or have some system to turn things back on when the vacuum falls below some limit. This is especially true if you're working with UF glues that can require hours (or overnight) to cure. It's be pretty miserable to come back and find that the bag had leaked and your work was ruined.

Mike

[Jason Beam]

Sure, if the noise doesn't bother you, you can use a continuous pump. You can always start with a continuous pump and then add stuff around the pump to make it intermittent. The system makes it intermittent, not the pump itself.

Someone asked about venturi systems. They work well, to the best of my knowledge, but you're running a fairly big compressor to create the vacuum. If you have the compressor, and you plan to always do your work where you have access to your compressor, they're a decent solution. Venturi systems work similar to pumps. All bags and systems leak so you generally have to run it continuously or have some system to turn things back on when the vacuum falls below some limit. This is especially true if you're working with UF glues that can require hours (or overnight) to cure. It's be pretty miserable to come back and find that the bag had leaked and your work was ruined.

Mike

Valid concerns all. I have a venuri system - and yes, I do have a good sized compressor (60gal) but you don't need anything close to that size to use the pump. Evacuating the bag after just putting something in is always the biggest load - and even then it's only 20-30 seconds if you're doing flat stuff without a ton of air in the bag. Then, every 10 minutes or so, my pump kicks back on for maybe 5-7 seconds of air (at 90psi).

And - I've found that yes, the systems can leak - but if I pull a good 23" of vacuum and close the valve to the pump and turn the pump off, it'll hold VERY well for several hours.

I have done a few videos recently that happen to include the pump in them which shows how little air it really takes if anyone is interested.

[Susumu Mori]

I see.
Thank Mike.

Maybe I'll start with a small diaphragm pump like this one (http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Excel-1-Continuous-Run-Vacuum-Press-System.html) and later, if necessary, add the auto-cycling kit from JoeWoodWorker.
Or maybe this one (https://www.vacupress.com/pricing.htm#compact150) looks good with auto-cycling with a similar price.

I only occasionally do veneer work for drawer fronts and doors. All small stuff.

[Mike Henderson]

I see.
Thank Mike.

Maybe I'll start with a small diaphragm pump like this one (http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Excel-1-Continuous-Run-Vacuum-Press-System.html) and later, if necessary, add the auto-cycling kit from JoeWoodWorker.
Or maybe this one (https://www.vacupress.com/pricing.htm#compact150) looks good with auto-cycling with a similar price.

I only occasionally do veneer work for drawer fronts and doors. All small stuff.
You could probably get a less expensive pump from Joe Woodworker. Email him and see what he recommends before you make a decision.

Mike

[Tony Joyce]

Valid concerns all. I have a venuri system - and yes, I do have a good sized compressor (60gal) but you don't need anything close to that size to use the pump. Evacuating the bag after just putting something in is always the biggest load - and even then it's only 20-30 seconds if you're doing flat stuff without a ton of air in the bag. Then, every 10 minutes or so, my pump kicks back on for maybe 5-7 seconds of air (at 90psi).

And - I've found that yes, the systems can leak - but if I pull a good 23" of vacuum and close the valve to the pump and turn the pump off, it'll hold VERY well for several hours.

I have done a few videos recently that happen to include the pump in them which shows how little air it really takes if anyone is interested.

I was very surprised at how little air the venturi system took. I agree about the compressor size. I think one smaller would work. I have one I may give a try to see. My times are probably about the same as yours. Maybe I'm lucky, but mine only cycles on about every couple hours. I'm using a 2" X 4" bag. It will hold a vacuum overnight(not complete, but most of it), with no power on.

Tony

[Jason Beam]

I was very surprised at how little air the venturi system took. I agree about the compressor size. I think one smaller would work. I have one I may give a try to see. My times are probably about the same as yours. Maybe I'm lucky, but mine only cycles on about every couple hours. I'm using a 2" X 4" bag. It will hold a vacuum overnight(not complete, but most of it), with no power on.

Tony

Mine cycles fast because i am a bad plumber, basically. The network of fittings that make up the pump have a leak somewhere. One day I will lather on some pipe dope or something while it's in suction to address that. Once every ten minutes felt pretty good anyway! :P

[Frank Drew]

I went John TenEyck's d.i.y.route, although I lucked into a high-quality used vacuum pump for $75. Gluing up your own bags is easy; I bought a roll of vinyl and glue from somewhere. Short lengths of hosing, a piece of sheet good to groove for a platen, etc. are usually the kinds of things most of us have laying around or can find for very little money.

I can't say enough good things about vacuum veneering when compared to the old types of veneer presses.

[Fidel Fernandez]

Customer service should be grade when there is a problem. My previous experience with the other company showed me they don't know what customer service is.
If it doesn't go his way he over reacts and goes down hill from there.

I just ordered from Vacupress the "COMPACT 150 SYSTEM" and it was so nice to talk with the owner. How different the way I was treated.

I expect this system from Vacupress to be a good one and how I see it is an step up from the one I ordered before from Veneer Supplies and it is relatively the same price.

I didn't go DIY route, because I know myself and it will give me frustrations. I wish I could do it, but it is better for me to buy the whole system ready to go.