Advice sought for recessing a piano hinge into a blanket chest

[Wakahisa Shinta]

I goofed and neglected to cut out a recess in a rail of a frame-and-panel blanket chest for a piano hinge (Lee Valley pressed brass 1.5" x 36") before assembly. I realize it this evening when I turned my attention to the top and sanded the chest a final time before finishing. With the chest glued up, it is not as simple a process when the parts were free. It's heavy! The width of the chest is 48". The hinge is 36". My options:

1. Use my router. This conjures up instance of router tipping on a 3/4" edge. Although I would have to make some kind of jig to support the router.
2. Use my table saw and plunge the rail down on a spinning blade. Not a very safe option either.
3. Hand tools, but I only have a block plane that needs some serious sharpening.
4. Mortise the top. I would prefer not to do this.

I am seeking advice. How would you approach this?

Thanks!

[Jamie Buxton]

If you do option 1, the fix for a tippy router is very simple. Find a convenient piece of scrap wood, joint it straight, and clamp it on to the workpiece. Effectively you make the workpiece wider by the width of the clamped-on piece. Make it wide enough that you are no longer worried about tipping.

Here's a tip about working with piano hinge... The hinge is thinner than the height of the head of the #4 flathead screws included with the hinge. If you just drill a pilot hole for the screw, the head will hit wood before it hits the hinge. At that point, the screwdriver tip starts to booger up the head of the screw, before you get the hinge tightened down. The fix is to slightly countersink the pilot hole before you put the hinge in place.

[Mike Schuch]

If you do option 1, the fix for a tippy router is very simple. Find a convenient piece of scrap wood, joint it straight, and clamp it on to the workpiece. Effectively you make the workpiece wider by the width of the clamped-on piece. Make it wide enough that you are no longer worried about tipping.

Here's a tip about working with piano hinge... The hinge is thinner than the height of the head of the #4 flathead screws included with the hinge. If you just drill a pilot hole for the screw, the head will hit wood before it hits the hinge. At that point, the screwdriver tip starts to booger up the head of the screw, before you get the hinge tightened down. The fix is to slightly countersink the pilot hole before you put the hinge in place.

I would screw two 2 x 4's together in an "L" so you have a really wide working surface to clamp to the chest. Should be wide enough that you could add a straight edge as a fence to route a nice straight line on the chest.

[Mike Cutler]

Gotta agree with the others here, the router is probably the easiest and tastes method. You will need a chisel to clean up the corners for the hinge to set properly.

2nd option is to purchase some mortiseless hinges and save the piano hinge for later. (Is mortiseless really a word?)

[glenn bradley]

Another router vote. Add width to the edge in a way that you prefer. I use the same corner squaring jigs I made long ago, clamp them to the body and clamp a piece of plywood to them to make a wide extension of the edge to be routed. I can then clamp a guide to this extension. I use a variation of this method to hold the lid while I screw on the hinge.

304378

[michael nicholson]

Not sure if this will help you. I built a tractor trailer toy box and edged the top with 1/8" (I think, thickness of the hinge) maple except where the hinge was.
304381

[Wakahisa Shinta]

Thanks everyone. I learned a few things from your posts. Good tip about countersinking the pilot holes for the screws. I will keep that in mind.

I was leaning toward the router, but did not think to use my square jig as support for the temporary router platform.

Michael, thanks for the idea and picture. I would take your advice, but I am partial to the mortise-and-tenon joinery detail at the corners of the chest. It just looks nice, so I want to keep it exposed. :D

Can two non-mortise hinges support a solid maple top, 25" x 50" x 3/4" thick? Like these (http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=40233&cat=3,41241). The top is made from gluing six 1x6 boards together, then cut to final dimension. It's heavy. This chest is going to be used quite a bit, so I wanted the piano hinge (http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=40216&cat=3,41241) for strength.

[David Ragan]

How about using torsion hinges that will support the weight of the lid (stays open on its own)?

[roger wiegand]

A heavy lid able to fall freely is a hazard to small kids that should be avoided (it can even be a hazard to adults-- I once got clocked by a free falling heavy door on a dry ice chest in the lab, fortunately I fell outside the chest rather than into the CO2 in the box). Both deaths and series injuries have occurred. Some kind of slow-close device is probably a good idea. Here's the CSPC warning http://www.cpsc.gov//PageFiles/113408/5099.pdf

[David Ragan]

In addition, the chest im building for my niece will have a small gap b/t the torsion hinges running the length of the chest so it is not airtight

[julian abram]

A heavy lid able to fall freely is a hazard to small kids that should be avoided (it can even be a hazard to adults-- I once got clocked by a free falling heavy door on a dry ice chest in the lab, fortunately I fell outside the chest rather than into the CO2 in the box). Both deaths and series injuries have occurred. Some kind of slow-close device is probably a good idea. Here's the CSPC warning http://www.cpsc.gov//PageFiles/113408/5099.pdf

Yes, take heed to this warning with heavy chest lids. I know a couple whose young son was killed by a heavy lid on a toy chest, happened several years ago but still very sad when I see the couple.

[Wakahisa Shinta]

Which is preferred? Top flush with the chest's top edge OR leaving a small gap in between?

I am still looking for a lid support that doesn't take up too much room inside the chest.

[Jerry Miner]

Can two non-mortise hinges support a solid maple top, 25" x 50" x 3/4" thick? Like these (http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=40233&cat=3,41241). The top is made from gluing six 1x6 boards together, then cut to final dimension. It's heavy. This chest is going to be used quite a bit, so I wanted the piano hinge (http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=40216&cat=3,41241) for strength.

I think those no-mortise hinges might be a little on the light-duty side for your top.

But a standard chest hinge (like the pic) would do it---and only needs a small mortise.

304458

I am still looking for a lid support that doesn't take up too much room inside the chest.

I guess you've seen these lid supports. They are pretty common and don't take up much space:


Lid Support (http://woodworker.com/lh-lsup-grey-20-to-35-mssu-905-669.asp)

[David Ragan]

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(http://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=CyvzdyWC6VKWUHabIsQeTk4HQDrCWn9gBkMn5gRig5bz5WA gGEAEoBWDJlr2H4KO0EKABiMbB_wPIAQeqBCZP0FH1T8jm3hkC Oi9IqXNS4DS18ArKQu1I_jtNmznO7qbm75KresAFBYgGAaAGJo AH4Lk-kAcDqAemvhvgEqz1lOHxlPjQ7wE&ohost=www.google.com&cid=5GjkBRdw348gVzYJIibSzB8Szu_pte4w6RFOPD2WEmVmo0 HX&sig=AOD64_0awNuY38X9HONkrWAr94eJ41_62A&ctype=5&rct=j&frm=1&q=&ved=0CJIBEPMO&adurl=http://www.rockler.com/lid-stay-torsion-hinge-lid-support-rustic-bronze%3Futm_source%3Dgoogle%26utm_medium%3Dcpc%26 utm_term%3D%26utm_content%3Dpla%26utm_campaign%3DP L%26sid%3DV9146)
Lid‑Stay Torsion Hinge Lid Suppor...Lid‑Stay Torsion Hinge Lid Sup...Lid‑Stay Torsion Hinge Lid Support... (http://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=CyvzdyWC6VKWUHabIsQeTk4HQDrCWn9gBkMn5gRig5bz5WA gGEAEoBWDJlr2H4KO0EKABiMbB_wPIAQeqBCZP0FH1T8jm3hkC Oi9IqXNS4DS18ArKQu1I_jtNmznO7qbm75KresAFBYgGAaAGJo AH4Lk-kAcDqAemvhvgEqz1lOHxlPjQ7wE&ohost=www.google.com&cid=5GjkBRdw348gVzYJIibSzB8Szu_pte4w6RFOPD2WEmVmo0 HX&sig=AOD64_0awNuY38X9HONkrWAr94eJ41_62A&ctype=5&rct=j&frm=1&q=&ved=0CJMBEPQO&adurl=http://www.rockler.com/lid-stay-torsion-hinge-lid-support-rustic-bronze%3Futm_source%3Dgoogle%26utm_medium%3Dcpc%26 utm_term%3D%26utm_content%3Dpla%26utm_campaign%3DP L%26sid%3DV9146)
$27.99

The above is from Rockler. They have different weight ratings.

[Chris Hachet]

Yet another vote for the router here.

[Jim Becker]

Router would be my choice, but I'd make up a jig to provide a stable and controlled environment to use it for this purpose.

[Brian Tymchak]

I guess you've seen these lid supports. They are pretty common and don't take up much space:

Lid Support (http://woodworker.com/lh-lsup-grey-20-to-35-mssu-905-669.asp)

Those are very reasonable prices. Thanks for the link Jerry!