Resaw ripples

[David Ragan]

When i resaw, i get ripples on the surface. MM-16, Resaw King blade 1.25".
If i take a scrap, saw a few inches, stop the blade, then adjyst the fence so yhe blade is exactly even/parLlel/straight in yhe kerf i get much hetter results.
i have to do this periodically. I take off tension on wkd
is my saw set up improperly?
I have read here "tracking adjustment". What js that?

[Rod Sheridan]

When i resaw, i get ripples on the surface. MM-16, Resaw King blade 1.25".
If i take a scrap, saw a few inches, stop the blade, then adjyst the fence so yhe blade is exactly even/parLlel/straight in yhe kerf i get much hetter results.
i have to do this periodically. I take off tension on wkd
is my saw set up improperly?
I have read here "tracking adjustment". What js that?

Is an MM16 capable of tensioning a tipped blade that large?

[David Ragan]

Yes. Triple beam column. That is why i bought MM

[Prashun Patel]

'tracking' refers to how the blade rides on the wheels. If it rides on the crown of the wheel without shifting left or right over time, it's 'tracking properly'.

What you've done is adjust your fence for 'blade drift'. It's common to have to do it even on good saws. You shouldn't have to do this for each and every cut, though.

[David Kumm]

Resaw King runs a thinner band so the saw will have no trouble tensioning. Once the fence is set it should never need changing with most blades. Assuming the teeth are off the front edge of the wheel. A carbide blade can magnify the ripple effect if one tooth is ground a little off but you need to determine if it is the position of the blade on the wheel that changes or if the fence has some slop in it. Usually you adjust the fence about once in a lifetime. Dave

[Mike Cutler]

How significant are these ripples?
The truer test is to take a vernier and measure the thickness of the resawn piece along the two edges and at each corner. The closer they all are to being "statistically" the same, the better your setup is. If that resawn piece is of a uniform thickness, the ripples indicate that your feed rate is inconsistent.
The second sentence of your original posts indicates to me that something is not quite right though?

[glenn bradley]

To me this sounds like your blade is not true to your feed path. I prefer to align the blade although many folks prefer to change the fence to match the blade. This is a great exaggeration and blade position can be more impactive if your tires are crowned but, you get the picture. Just something to check.

303815303816303817

[Erik Loza]

David, my first reaction is "inadequate blade tension", though I have not personally used that blade.

Second reaction is "bad blade". Is this a new blade or???

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Jerry Thompson]

Go to Youtube and search Alex Snodgrass. He shows how to properly adjust a band saw and eliminate drift.

[David Kumm]

Go to Youtube and search Alex Snodgrass. He shows how to properly adjust a band saw and eliminate drift.

Keep in mind that info about a smaller saw and a steel blade may not be relevant for a more stout saw and a carbide blade. Dave

[Erik Loza]

Obviously, I haven't seen David's machine firsthand but will say this: 99.9999% of the time I get a customer complaint about cut quality, it is either inadequare blade tension or simply a bad blade. Cannot tell you the number of times I have had an owner swear to me up one side and down the other that "they knew their blade was fine" and lo and behold... Italian saws are super-easy to set up and all this "drift" stuff does not apply to them. They have flat wheels and tires. On a new MM16, I set the fence once for parallel to the blade and that's it. You should never have to fuss with again. This why folks spend the big bucks for Italian saws: You get to spend your time cutting rather than tweaking them. Just my 2-cents,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[David Ragan]

that is a good YouTube by Alex Snodgrass.

He says to be sure the bottom of the gullet goes @ the center of the wheel. With my saw, that would mean the back of the blade would hang way off the wheel. (Dave above says all that may not apply to wider carbide blades....fair enough.)

Alex also says that if the teeth are supported correctly by the wheel, the alignment of the fence does not matter, it can be as much as 1/4" to either side, and you get a smooth resaw.

Who am I to question Alex? Certainly not, but-with the wide blade there is definitely a huge difference in a slight rippling effect before adjusting the back end of the fence maybe 1/8" as described in my original post. what he says about the teeth makes sense, though. I can say that I get super smooth veneer-ready cuts that need no sanding if I adjust for drift as described in the original post. I figured the variance in fence position from one session to another maybe several weeks apart in resawing was from different heights of the blade guide/post, and tension diffo.

And, if the teeth run on the wheel, as he says to do, don't the teeth chew up the wheel?

[David Kumm]

Many small saws ( and the old big cast iron ones ) ran with crowned tires. you keep the blade so it rides on the crown which puts the teeth on the rubber. Euro saws have flat tires so wide blades and carbide blades are run with the teeth hanging off the front edge and off the rubber. Different saws and different blades are set up differently but at the end of the day, drift is one of those things talked about in theory but in practice seldom comes into play. A slight fence adjustment once in a lifetime takes care of it. You should be running that blade at 25-30,000 lbs which is probably off the scale on the saw. Do as Erik suggests and increase tension and see if quality improves. It should take both hands to turn the tension wheel the last few turns. If still the same you may have a blade issue. Dave

[Jim Finn]

Sounds to me like you need a sharp blade. Sharp blades do not "drift". I use a carbide blade and a re-saw fence. Zero drift.

[Rod Sheridan]

Yes. Triple beam column. That is why i bought MM

Then

- dull blade

- tension too low

- inconsistent feed rate

Regards, Rod.

[Lee Reep]

Go to Youtube and search Alex Snodgrass. He shows how to properly adjust a band saw and eliminate drift.

I was just going to mention his video. My 14" Powermatic cuts amazingly true after following his advice on blade placement, tension, and adjustment of the bearings to make sure they do not touch the blade. I've got that video flagged as a favorite.

[David Ragan]

Thanks for your replies.
i hope my blade is not dull-
the tension has been gaged to 30k w meter
what you all say makes sense; probably operator error, as i am one to blame the equipment for my own inexpereience
maybe tomorrow i can go down and investigate-would be great to set up fence and thats it period

[Mike Cutler]

Dave

That MM16 is a fabulous saw. It's a beautiful machine for a small shop. It does sound though as if something is amiss, and the blade would be my first choice to check. It can't hurt to have an extra blade laying about if it proves to be something else. Have you ever considered the Lennox, 2/3 vari-pitch Trimaster?. You might even consider dropping down to a 1" blade. It may put you in a "sweeter spot" with respects to the MM16 tensioning. (1.25 is a beefy blade and the cross sectional thickness of that blade may be a small contributor to the issues you are having.)
The fence on your saw and the miter slot can, and should, be able to be adjusted to run parallel and perpendicular to that blade. It's a once and done setup. Square the work surface to the blade. You should not have to accommodate "drift" with your saw.
I haven't adjusted the fence on my band saw ( Rikon 10-340) for parallel, with no offset for "drift", in years, and you have a much nicer saw than mine.

[David Kumm]

This is about what you should see when everything is tuned up.303916First side,303917 Second side, 303918 Thickness. This is an old Trimaster 3TPI. Your new RK should be better. Dave

[Chris Parks]

Go to Youtube and search Alex Snodgrass. He shows how to properly adjust a band saw and eliminate drift.

The problem with AS's video is he does not address flat wheel BS's as the MM is only crowned wheel types which are commonly found from the Asian manufacturers.

[Chris Padilla]

This happened to me with my MM20 yesterday. One of the lower guides had come loose so the blade would wave back n forth. You may need to snug up the upper and lower guides a bit more or make sure they haven't vibrated loose.

[David Ragan]

This is about what you should see when everything is tuned up.303916First side,303917 Second side, 303918 Thickness. This is an old Trimaster 3TPI. Your new RK should be better. Dave

David,

I see ripples on your piece? I get uniform cuts, a parallelogram, if you will.

Am I expecting too much when I strive to not only achieve a uniform cut, etc...but also a finish-ready surface? That is what my end game here is.....a surface that has no ripples at all.

My small bandsaw has wandered when the blade was dull. I was sawing something of no major importance a few years ago, and was horrified to see the blade not drift, but wander. I changed the blade, it straightened out.

[glenn bradley]

David's results look like my Timberwolf 2-3 blade which cuts fast but, not smooth. A Woodslicer cuts much smoother but, "finish ready" off a bandsaw is something I have never seen . . . unless you are making that distressed country-chic stuff they sell at fairs(?). Veneers ready for use can be had but again, this will depend on the use. I do not even consider the surface off the tablesaw to be finish ready so your 'end game' may be subjective. What do you consider a "finish ready" surface? Once we know that we can answer more definitively as to your chances ;-)

[James Nugnes]

Could I ask the OP to come back to us and let us know how this works out? I know once you get a power tool sorted out you can often be so relieved you are just happy to be able to work with it confidently. Bandsaws are one of the more useful and interesting power tools you will ever have. Clearly the designers are pushing the edges of the veneer resaw envelope via throat depth, HP, column rigidity, blade width min/max etc. While veneer resaw is not my application, guys like me that like to buy a power tool overbuilt to application benefit. So while I do not have a direct equivalent to the issues defined in this thread and have two completely different bandsaws from the OP's, it does look like an interesting issue to flesh out.

I suspect it is a tough area of tool design as well. It seems to me that the design changes are somewhat serial in nature with everybody competing first on increased throat depth to wheel size then followed by increased horsepower to accommodate the increased throat depth. Not sure if these super rigid columns have always been there or if they were yet another serial change made as many suppliers upped the anti looking to capture the killer app part of the woodworking bandsaw market, veneer resaw.

[David Kumm]

I caught the light just right on the picture. The veneer is .035" thick and sawed on both sides. The ripples you see are more like chattermarks from a planer with dull blades on the second side. Hard to get a much better finish on the second sawed side as it is difficult for the carbide to be ground as consistently on a thin band as on a heavy steel circular saw plate. I think you have to expect chattermark type ripples and finish with a sander. Dave

[David Ragan]

Well, yes, "finish ready" was a bit theatrical :).

You get my drift, though ha ha ha........no ripples, and ready for maybe 180 abrasive (notice how I did note say "sandpaper" for the purists out there, which I have been accused of.)

I have issues posting photographs here of late, and have not felt inspired to hash this out with the moderator of that forum, who was kind enough to help me out personally.

So-I will get to it in the next couple of weeks. Right now, though, my shop is getting some overhauling done, and that is my focus.

Experimentation and pictures coming to a chat room near you "soon".

[Erik Loza]

David, I would try a different blade. Something like a Lenox Woodmaster CT 1.0".

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[John Lanciani]

.....no ripples, and ready for maybe 180 abrasive

As someone who has cut a couple thousand sf of veneer on a bandsaw (MM20 with a Lenox Trimaster 2/3 TPI) I can safely say "No Chance", and doubly so if you're hand feeding. I go directly from the saw to the vacuum bag with the veneer I cut, but you're chasing a fantasy if you're expecting to be able to sand with 180g right off the saw, no matter what equipment you're using.