Bag Tags/Double Sided Engraving

[Bob WrightNC]

Guys, I haven't gotten my laser yet but working on my first order and have a material question. Is there a romark type material that can be engraved on both sides that would be durable enough to use as a luggage tag/bag tag? Thanks!

[Guy Hilliard]

Yes, Romark Laser Max (and some of the other materials) are available in 3 layers - 1/8" thick. Depending on what your supplier stocks it may be a special order with minimum order quantities.

[Bob WrightNC]

Guy,
Is this pretty durable stuff if I wanted to make tags out of it for ball teams, etc.? Thanks.

[Mike Null]

Bob

I sometimes cement two pieces together using solvent cement. It holds well.

[Matt Turner (physics)]

Would anodized aluminum tags work?

[Bob WrightNC]

Matt, I'm so new into it, I'm not sure what the best option is at this point. Do you take the romark and glue it back-to-back like Mike was saying or do you engrave white and spray paint both sides? You have more color options like that but is it durable? No telling how many of these I could sell - kind of a natural niche market for me and I'd like to get it right out of the gate. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[Kev Williams]

Lasermax is extremely durable, BUT-- the thin cap is can be worn off if they're subject to any abrasion (in and out of Levi's pockets for example)

If you want REAL durable, get Rowmark Ultramatte instead of Laser-anything. Ultramatte has a .010" thick cap designed for rotary engraving, but you CAN laser engrave it. Won't look quite as nice as laserable material would, but close. Takes some experimenting.

I just did this with my 25w ULS, 2 passes at 100 power and 90 speed, 3rd pass at 100 power and 60 speed. Could've gotten away with 2 slower passes, I'm sure. And check the thickness of the white cap, nothing short of a grinder will wear that down! :) AND, the stuff is UV resistant and chemical resistant. I've soaked this stuff in gasoline and diesel fuel for a whole weekend just to see what happens... nothing. Just keep it away from xylene, acetone and other such nasty stuff and this stuff will last forever...

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[Mike Null]

I would avoid painted anything for this application.

[Ross Moshinsky]

I've done 1/16" plastic for personal stuff. It's acceptable but not great. 1/8" is better. On small batches, I glue two pieces of 1/16" together. On a nice size order, buy the 1/8" stuff.

1/8" wood of some sort would probably be a better choice overall. Your cost of material is going to be WAY less. With an 80W you should be able to run at 100% speed or darn close to it.

[Bob WrightNC]

I've done 1/16" plastic for personal stuff. It's acceptable but not great. 1/8" is better. On small batches, I glue two pieces of 1/16" together. On a nice size order, buy the 1/8" stuff.

Cut, then glue or glue, then cut? Kev, like the look of that.

[Kev Williams]

Much easier to just buy 1/8" and be done with it. My sample above is 1/8", white on both sides. It also cuts fine by laser, more than one cut pass gives a cleaner cut. Just be sure to cut thru the masking before engraving, unless you plan to mask after engraving. Masking and cutting thru transfer tape leaves a much cleaner edge than cutting thru the factory masking. The laser cut edges will be gooey, a little alcohol and a rag takes care of that.

My method for multiple engraved and cut parts is to engrave first, mask with transfer tape, then cut the plates thru the tape. Another thing I like about transfer tape, it will just fall off after sitting in warm soapy water for 15 minutes.

[Ross Moshinsky]

Cut, then glue or glue, then cut? Kev, like the look of that.

I apply very thin laminating tape. Engrave, cut, tape together.

In an ideal world you buy the 1/8" material but it's hard justifying spending $25+ for the plastic for 7 tags which won't even use 1/4 of the sheet. Also I've gotten into the practice of cutting out plastic with multiple passes on tags/keychains. It really does cut down on the sticky edges.

[Andrew Holloway]

I'm with Matt. For durability, why not use aluminium dog tags? They are double sided and available in a huge range of colours, shapes and sizes.

[Kev Williams]

7 tags? Bob didn't say how many tags he wants to make, but he did say "No telling how many of these I could sell - kind of a natural niche market for me and I'd like to get it right out of the gate."

I can get a 1/4 sheet of 1/8" Rowmark for $26, and you can get 120 2" x 1-1/8" tags out of it, which is 21.7 cents each. And if someone wants a funny shaped tag, your laser can make it.

120 same size .050" thick anodized dog tags from identificationtags.com will cost you 51 cents each. More than twice the cost. And no shape changes unless you have some cnc machining equipment...

As for durability, 1/8" Rowmark is at least equal if not more so than .050 anodized aluminum. Around 25 years ago a customer supplied me with pre-cut 1/8" thick aluminum plates to be engraved and painted, which were operator control panel ID labels they installed on mining trucks they build. About 3 years later they brought in a handful of them, all had the paint missing, and many even had portions of the .01" deep engraving missing. These plates were/are subjected to environmental extremes and nasty chemicals, and they asked about having me engrave stainless. Not EVEN wanting THAT headache, I suggested that I make the plates using Rowmark. I've made them every week since, and in 20+ years not one complaint from my customer or theirs about them. Surviving a fire is about the only edge aluminum has that I can think of. I don't sell the stuff, I just know it works, for me anyway.

[Bob WrightNC]

Since I'm new, I think I'm going to try all three ways(count the expense as training) and see which I like best. And guys, I'm not trying to hold your feet to the fire on this, but as I start this business, I have no idea what/how to charge for a job like this. I'm going to have at least 13 3x5 tags with the potential of a ton more. What would be a safe range for pricing something like this? Thanks!

[Gary Hair]

I'm going to have at least 13 3x5 tags with the potential of a ton more. What would be a safe range for pricing something like this? Thanks!

"at least" and "a ton more" don't really mean much when pricing. You need to know exactly how many they are going to pay for now, on this order. I'd charge based on the material price and you time * your hourly rate - $120 works pretty well as a base rate for me, but I usually end up getting much more than that.

If you base your prices on the "a ton more" part then you will end up getting screwed... Everyone asks for pricing for 1,000 pieces and then when they order 10 they want the same price. My advice is to price out a single piece (mine would be $35 - my minimum charge) then do a price for 2-5, 6-10, 11-50, 51-1,000, etc. That way when they want 5 of them they will know exactly what you are charging. Don't forget a setup charge - mine is a set minimum amount even if they provide perfect, laser ready artwork.

Pricing is the hardest part of business and can have a huge impact on your success. Better to start out high and lower prices than to start out too low and have to explain an increase.

[Ross Moshinsky]

There are two ways to look at small orders that will turn into large ones.

1. Give away the sample batch. If it's a low cost, easy setup job, this may make sense. Obviously in other circumstances it won't.
2. Price the job out based on quantity. 1-10 pcs = X. 11-49 = Y. 50-149 = Z. You can also add in a one time setup fee if you feel it is required.

At the end of the day, there is no right answer. You have to do what's best for you.

[Bob WrightNC]

Thanks for the great feedback!

[Tim Bateson]

I've done a couple hundred anodized aluminum luggage/sports tags. Very durable. Another option - Looks like you already have the heat press, buy a sublimation printer and go full photo quality color.

[Bob WrightNC]

Tim,
Don't get me started on dye sublimation - had one venture with cheap Chinese inks and trying to match color profiles. Man, tough stuff. Printer is just sitting there collecting dust and I may jump back in at sometime but very aggravating.

[Bob WrightNC]

Has anyone taken acrylic, glue together and then engrave that product to get what you want? Does the glue create problems?

[Mike Null]

I did about 80 3" x 5" anodized tags a week ago. Engraved one side with copy and paste text for $9.00 each. Tags also had 4 holes--bought them cut and drilled from Johnson Plastics.

[Bob WrightNC]

I did about 80 3" x 5" anodized tags a week ago. Engraved one side with copy and paste text for $9.00 each. Tags also had 4 holes--bought them cut and drilled from Johnson Plastics.

Cut and drilled - boy, this thread keeps getting more interesting all the time. Thanks Mike.