New blade, old cap iron, bad fit

[Adam Stevens2]

I have an old Stanley No 5 plane that I have been laboriously trying to get working. A while back I got a new blade from Veritas, because the one that came with the blade was badly pitted. However, I kept the old cap iron and it looks like the humped back of that cap iron basically gets stuck in the opening. Is this something that can be worked around or would I be better off simply getting a new cap iron from Lee Valley as well? I'd like to get one of these planes up and running...

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Stuck in what opening? If you mean the mouth of the plane, it may be that you need to carefully open the mouth of the plane because the Veritas blade is likely thicker than what came stock. But I could be missing something here.

[Adam Stevens2]

Yes, the mouth of the plane, sorry if that was unclear.

[David Weaver]

If the mouth is too tight, you need to file it open some if you can't move the frog back any more.

If the chips are getting under the cap iron, then the bottom edge of the cap iron needs to be reworked (via a stone) so that there are no gaps between it and the iron.

[Jim Koepke]

Adam,

Do you have a way to post pictures?

Pictures always help to see what the problem might be.

How does the blade do at the mouth without the cap iron?

jtk

[Jim Matthews]

+1 on moving the frog assembly that holds the blade "back" toward the handle.

That shouldn't cost any money.
For me, the challenge is getting a cap iron to snugly fit the blade.

The rest is just fettling...

see this Garret Hack video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzDygUaWGj0) around 4:05 for an illustration.

[Maurice Ungaro]

You also might want to get a new style chip breaker that is flat, rather than bumped. Mated with the new blade, should be stellar.

[Adam Stevens2]

As suggested, I moved the frog back and that may solve the mouth-clearance problem. It did create another problem, which I think was one I had tried to avoid by moving the frog forward and that is that the blade does not lie parallel to the frog now.

The problem seems to be where a piece of metal projects out from the base of the frog. I have no idea if this thing has a name or not...

301220

It's a type 11, if that is of any assistance.

[Jim Matthews]

I think that's the "mouth".

The space, between the cutting edge of the plane blade
and the front edge of the mouth, that's surprisingly twitchy.

Too wide, and it's difficult to get a fine shaving.
Too narrow, and the plane will jam.

The sole of the plane is cast iron.
Filing that is a slow process, and part of the fettling video from Garret Hack, above.

There was also an excellent FWW article with Roland Johnson on setting up a handplane
using much the same method. It had excellent photos.

Our very own Jim Koepke posted a thread (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?114373-Fettling-A-Plane-from-Junker-to-Jointer), some years back.
It's worth searching out, as it was comprehensive and well written.

[Adam Stevens2]

I did a quick search and I think it's the 'rib' at the base of the frog that I am referring to, backward of the mouth, where the frog slots into. If I move the frog back that 'rib' projects out and doesn't allow the blade to lie parallel to the frog. Is this a common problem? I sort of assume that the rib should also be parallel to the frog, but if I move the frog that far forward then the problem of the cap iron being basically clogging the mouth recurs.

[Stewie Simpson]

Hi Adam. I think your problem with the new blade is that its designed to be fitted to a Veritas Plane, and most likely is not compatible for use on a Stanley. Your easiest option is to put the Veritas blade aside, and track yourself down a 2nd hand replacement Stanley blade in good condition. Searching on Ebay or maybe an inquiry through this forum would be your best approach for the replacement blade. The blade width of your old blade is generally the important match criteria. Good luck with what ever approach you take.

Stewie;

[bridger berdel]

As suggested, I moved the frog back and that may solve the mouth-clearance problem. It did create another problem, which I think was one I had tried to avoid by moving the frog forward and that is that the blade does not lie parallel to the frog now.

The problem seems to be where a piece of metal projects out from the base of the frog. I have no idea if this thing has a name or not...

301220

It's a type 11, if that is of any assistance.

You can file the front of that rib flush with the face of the frog or even slightly below. You will likely need to also file the back of the mouth. Go slow, mark the rib in line with the face of the frog at the most forward position you think the frog will work. Remove the frog and file to the line on the rib (and mouth as necessary). Test and repeat until the shavings clear the throat at the thickest shaving you will take with that blade.

[David Weaver]

Either file the mouth or use a stock stanley iron, I'd say.

If the cap iron is in good shape, there is a design aspect to it that none of the new ones have, and that is the spring that it supplies under the lever cap in a plane.

When one of the new cap iron designs is used, it's like intentionally taking suspension out of a car before driving it.

If you file the mouth....well, there's tutorials out there, I won't do it justice in a sentence, but it's not hard to do. Just tape over the sides of a file you don't want to have cutting so that you don't file away a whole bunch of cast where you don't want to and make sure you mark the mouth with a square (from both sides of the plane to check that the plane is square, too).