Noob question about assembling face frame using pocket screws

[Tom Henderson2]

Hello everyone.

I'm new to face frames, and I'm new to pocket screws and I have a noob question. Forgive me if I use the wrong nomenclature.

The face frame has 1x3 horizontal members about 6' long. There are seven vertical members made of 1x2, ~15" long. All birch, with 2 pocket screws at each joint.

So it is fairly long, fairly narrow, with a lot of vertical members. Are there any assembly goblins I should be aware of?

I've assembled some smaller frames and they came out fine; flat and square without much trouble just using the Kreg clamps. But I'm wondering if I need to put together some sort of assembly jig in addition to the clamps to help keep the parts square as I put it together...

I've pretty much concluded that since the pocket screws pull the joints up tight, that the final shape (squareness and flatness) will be defined by how square the lumber is more than how it is held during assembly, but I'm looking for some insight from you experienced folks.

Should I just clamp each joint as it goes together, or do I need something more elaborate?

Thanks in advance!

-Tom in SoCal

[scott vroom]

I always use a pair of spacer blocks to position internal ff members....makes the job much easier and more accurate.

A single clamp is sufficient to hold the jonit together while driving screws.

[Mark Bolton]

No jig or assembly table is going to make up for the material prep. If your cuts are not square and 90 degrees you can force it into a face frame table and screw it and when you release the clamps its going to pop into whatever shape it wants. I have two simple face frame tables that hang on the wall that I use for door and face frame assembly. They are simply a sheet of material (whatever size you choose) hung on brackets at a slight angle back to the wall with right angle fences screwed along the bottom and either one or both vertical edges. Think of a painters easel with a horizontal fence at the bottom and a vertical fence left, right, or both. You stack your face frame on there (face against the table) and it automatically squares everything. It makes assembly very fast however your material has to be cut properly to begin with.

You'd have to be doing face frames or doors regularly to make it worth while but taking up a bit of wall space isnt much of an issue.

[Prashun Patel]

I agree that the face clamp is enough to hold the joint true.

I think time is much better spent building a shooting board or aligning your miter saw so your ends are dead nuts square and consistent sizes.

A good miter set up is like yoga pants: it makes everyone's butts look good.

[Earl McLain]

I agree that the face clamp is enough to hold the joint true.

I think time is much better spent building a shooting board or aligning your miter saw so your ends are dead nuts square and consistent sizes.

A good miter set up is like yoga pants: it makes everyone's butts look good.

I have found the first statement to be true, and the right angle clamp works great as well.

Second statement...my miter saw is dead on, and compared to my old department store version it's a gift from Heaven.

Third statement...it's obvious that Prashun doesn't get to Wal-mart very often!! (if i had been eating or drinking when i read that i'd still be cleaning up the mess!! That was just plain funny!!)
earl

[Art Mann]

Well, I'm going to differ a little with the other posters here but I have done a lot of face frame and carcass construction using pocket screws and early on I used to get bad results. No more. I clamp up face frames using cabinet clamps before running the screws as if I were gluing up a M&T joint. The vise grip clamp that Kreg furnishes with some of their kits just didn't hold the joint tight enough. If the joint isn't held tightly, the screws will sometimes cause the drilled piece to slip or skew. If that happens you have a problem on your hands trying to undo and reposition the fasteners or sand the pieces flush.

[Jim German]

The vise grip clamp that Kreg furnishes with some of their kits just didn't hold the joint tight enough. If the joint isn't held tightly, the screws will sometimes cause the drilled piece to slip or skew. If that happens you have a problem on your hands trying to undo and reposition the fasteners or sand the pieces flush.
I've found this to be true as well. Particularly if the two pieces aren't the exact same thickness.

[Bill White]

It is obvious that Prashun has never seen me in yoga pants. :)
I agree with others that the stock prep is very important.
I always use glue as well as the correct type screw.
Bill

[scott vroom]

Well, I'm going to differ a little with the other posters here but I have done a lot of face frame and carcass construction using pocket screws and early on I used to get bad results. No more. I clamp up face frames using cabinet clamps before running the screws as if I were gluing up a M&T joint. The vise grip clamp that Kreg furnishes with some of their kits just didn't hold the joint tight enough. If the joint isn't held tightly, the screws will sometimes cause the drilled piece to slip or skew. If that happens you have a problem on your hands trying to undo and reposition the fasteners or sand the pieces flush.

With all due respect, I disagree that cabinet clamps are necessary to execute a perfect pocket screw joint. My Kreg vice clamp is adjustable and can be tightened to the point where there is no chance of the pieces slipping unless, as anther poster suggested, the FF pieces are different thicknesses. This is why it's crucial to run all of your face frame stock through a thickness planer at the same time.

[Art Mann]

Well, I reckon if the original poster has trouble doing it the way you describe, then he can try the way I describe. Keep in mind that there are a lot of people, possibly including the originator of this thread, who don't have a thickness planer. It would be wildly optimistic to assume you can buy material of consistent thickness at the average lumber yard. I do have a thickness planer and machine all my stock from rough sawn but I still work with stock that is not all the same thickness sometimes. I don't have time to sort everything with a caliper. It doesn't take much difference for the Kreg clamp not to work well in my experience.

[scott vroom]

Well, I reckon if the original poster has trouble doing it the way you describe, then he can try the way I describe. Keep in mind that there are a lot of people, possibly including the originator of this thread, who don't have a thickness planer. It would be wildly optimistic to assume you can buy material of consistent thickness at the average lumber yard. I do have a thickness planer and machine all my stock from rough sawn but I still work with stock that is not all the same thickness sometimes. I don't have time to sort everything with a caliper. It doesn't take much difference for the Kreg clamp not to work well in my experience.


I wasn't trying to offend you Art :). I was making the point that consistent material thickness is the key to using a vice clamp in FF assembly. Your point is well taken, and your solution for dissimilar thicknessed pieces is an excellent one.

[Tom Henderson2]

I think time is much better spent building a shooting board or aligning your miter saw so your ends are dead nuts square and consistent sizes.


Good point Prashun; I've been saying for quite some time that I ought to make a sled for my tablesaw; this is probably the time. Thanks for the nudge.


I clamp up face frames using cabinet clamps before running the screws as if I were gluing up a M&T joint.

Great idea Art; All the lumber was purchased S4S since I don't have a thickness planer, so some slight thickness differences are inevitable. A cabinet clamp will ensure nothing moved before the screws pull tight. Thanks for the suggestion.

And thanks to all for a great thread; it has been very helpful to me.

-Tom in SoCal