Modern Design.

[Fidel Fernandez]

Hi,

I always wonder why in USA the tendency for woodworking is for old design, but in Europe it tends to be more for contemporary design.

I am not saying that in USA no one makes modern design woodworking or old design in Europe, I just see the tendency.

I also want to ask if you know of websites or forums where is discussed more modern furniture, or modern woodworking design.

My preference is for contemporary design.

[Sean Hughto]

Can you define your terms? What sort of designs are you thinking of as "old and what as "modern"?

While there are many devotees to Chippendale and Federal and Shaker and so forth, there's plenty of Morris and Stickley and G&G. There's also plenty of Krenov and Nakashima and so forth who are relatively modern. Are you talking about Danish modern or mid century or what?

[Kees Heiden]

That's all old stuuf Sean.

Contemporary is NOW.

Sorry Fidel, I have no real answer. I am curious myself. You can find some hobbyist made stuff and discussions on woodworking.de which is more modern then classic.


https://www.rachmaninoffshop.nl/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/strandhoutkrukje1.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Chest_of_Drawers.jpg

[Sean Hughto]

So how about this, Kees:

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7191/14046333523_29c973f6ec_b.jpg

https://geo.yahoo.com/f?s=792600099&t=d60f52944b23f3e6f74b68f8164db630&r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fchevy_ch ase_hughtos%2F14046333523%2Fin%2Fset-72157644375693154&fl_ev=0&lang=en&intl=us
Modern or old?

[Fidel Fernandez]

For example if you go to pirwi dot com (I know links are not allowed, so I wrote the name), they use mostly plywood cut by cnc.

I know this can be done without the plywood, cutting the strips, etc. I like the design, but I have doubts how to make the spacers or how to install them while the glue is drying. (search for the bench flex).

This other website about Danny Damerath dot com (no spaces) and look for tables. The table "Martin Too" is a great example of what I like on furniture.

That is the type of things that I like to discuss.

[Kees Heiden]

No idea Sean. Looks kind of new with a "naturel" touch.

Fidel, I don't know if you will find much in handtool circles.

[Sean Hughto]

http://www.dannykamerath.com/tables/#/martin-too/

[Jim Belair]

It's not a place with the discussion you're seeking, but I turn to Pritam Eames, especially their archives, for inspiration. http://pritameames.com/on_view.html

[Daniel Rode]

For me personally, I tend to work on things that interest me and that I think I can make with my skills and tools. Both of those evolve over time. For example, I never cared much for Shaker furniture until recently. As I learn more about Shaker and country style, I've come to appreciate it more.

I'm more interested in Arts and Crafts styles. I like the style(s) and I can design and build some of my own. Even within A&C there are huge design differences. Stickley, Green & Green, English A&C, are all quite different. Someone may love G&G but be totally put off by a F L Wright piece.

I stayed away from more complex styles, Federal, Chippendale, Queen Anne, etc. because I lacked the skill, knowledge or tools to attempt them. Hopefully over time that will change too.

As for modern, contemporary design, IDK. It all depends on how you define it. Sam Maloof? Love to try to make a Maloof style chair. I can't do it, but I'd like to :).

Ikea style European design, not so much.

[Derek Cohen]

I like contemporary.

The campaign chests I built a few years ago were made without all the brass edging to create a modern look ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Furniture/Chesta.jpg


And The Chair will always carry a contemporary label ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Furniture/The%20Chair/3_zps9108bd1e.jpg

I love this desk and chair by David Haig (from New Zealand) ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Furniture/David%20Haig/pictures4_zps5bfff3b5.jpg

Just a few.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Brian Holcombe]

'Modern' Defines a period and style in the same manner of speaking as 'Arts and Crafts', 'Post Modern', 'Chippendale', ect. Contemporary design is current design, not to be confused with popular period design. All period design was contemporary at their time, but is now period.

Nakashima and Maloof are both period design, the style being 'American Craft', it overlaps Modern in timing but they are wholly different forms of design. Modern design was a style which merged machine, craftsman and architect, where American Craft is mostly devoted to hand craft. There are many overlaps, in fact much of early Danish Modernism more closely represents the ideals of American craft than modern design, but because they were working toward utilizing material in a different manner they are grouped in with Modernism.

[Kees Heiden]

So where are we now? What kind of style is the furniture on that pirwi.com website?
I'm not much of an art connaiseur, I just feel that this contemporary stuff is very different fromG&G or Krenov or Maloof. It looks like these artists are in the first place designers and furniture is just their medium.

[Brian Holcombe]

Contemporary means current, it's fully encompassing of new design. Design 'inspired by' period work is not the same as period work, I'm not accusing you of this by any means, but a lot of people assign the description 'Mid-Century Modern' to everything that remotely looks Danish or American Modern with muddies the waters a bit for the more accurate classifications of design.

[dan sherman]

So where are we now? What kind of style is the furniture on that pirwi.com website?
I'm not much of an art connaiseur, I just feel that this contemporary stuff is very different fromG&G or Krenov or Maloof. It looks like these artists are in the first place designers and furniture is just their medium.

Personally I would call that hipster furniture. A lot of hipsters I Know would love that stuff, and they would call it unique, custom, or some other adjective. However they would treat it more like a piece of art than furniture.


to me modern design is more like the last two pictures Derek posted. Basically more fluid 3D forms. Shaker and Arts & Crafts are cringe worthy in my opinion, but I believe popular with the masses because they are generally easy to make.

[Kees Heiden]

Hipster! :D

My hipster kitchen.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fxwwrAwQmKQ/T7qWeUlwtcI/AAAAAAAAAgo/Sq6O5gOALc8/s1600/DSC02517.JPG

[dan sherman]

Hipster! :D

My hipster kitchen.

personally, I'd call that minimalistic.

[John Coloccia]

For example if you go to pirwi dot com (I know links are not allowed, so I wrote the name), they use mostly plywood cut by cnc.

I know this can be done without the plywood, cutting the strips, etc. I like the design, but I have doubts how to make the spacers or how to install them while the glue is drying. (search for the bench flex).

This other website about Danny Damerath dot com (no spaces) and look for tables. The table "Martin Too" is a great example of what I like on furniture.

That is the type of things that I like to discuss.

Links are OK to further the discussion, as far as I know:

http://www.dannykamerath.com/tables/#/martin-too/

If I understand the question you're asking, I think the answer is that it doesn't go with anything.

:rolleyes:

What do I mean...

I think it's pretty popular in the US to grab cheap furniture from, heaven forbid, places like Walmart. By and large, it's boxy, stuffy, boring design that would be at home in the 70s just as much as today. Where would I put a table like Danny's? It's far more popular in Europe to grab cheap furniture from places like Ikea. Yeah, Ikea does make some junk, but they also make some very nice, well thought out pieces as well. I have a modular bookcase from them. I built it exactly how I wanted, and it's very high quality, right down to the soft close drawer slides. Very high quality. We outfitted my wife's entire office with mostly Ikea furniture. It's sharp and very functional, not to mention inexpensive. They actually have real designers that make intelligent, and sharp looking, furniture. A table like that would be right at home in a home furnished with Ikea furniture and cabinets.

I think you'll see more and more sharp, contemporary design in the US as younger generations have to learn to do more with less, and I really do believe that the younger generation has more of an appreciation for elegant design than much of the older generations in the US do. I think more elegant design is really somewhat driven by the generally more crowded conditions in much of Europe. Much US style furniture is just completely dysfunctional in small home, especially where rooms are multipurpose.

Personally, we tend towards modern design in our home. We like the simple, functional lines. We cringe every time we've had to walk through a Raymour and Flannigan, or Ethan Allan. Nothing wrong with the stuff. It mostly seems well made. I just feels like I'm on a tour of a gigantic nursing home :)

Just my opinion.

[Fidel Fernandez]

Yes, I know the beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Nothing wrong with well made furniture even if It is not in my style.

I was watching youtube during lunch hour and I saw this guy (he works with metal and wood logs), saved a burned log from Colorado.

The log was perfect from the outside, but the core was burned. It looked like a thunder destroyed the tree.
It was the perfect specimen for an sculpture, maybe a human body, or just an sculpture. The edges were ragged and they looked so nice to continue and make an expression.

Well, he removed all the internal burned wood (I wold have left some there as artistic expression). He rounded the edges, installed some LED lights inside, multicolor, etc. In my opinion that beautiful log was wasted and removed all the character and beauty.
He thought different and he was happy with the result.

I like more contemporary furniture, because it is exploring methods not used before together. All the woodworking concepts apply, but the result is different. You can carve, saw, mortice and tenon, etc. I also like more the clean lines look.

My problem is that I am self taught and I am learning and also a novice. I have so many questions and probably I follow the long and difficult path some times, because I don't know another way.
So if I find people working in the same type of furniture, they could have an answer to my questions.

[Chris Hachet]

I would like to try to build a modern piece of furniture. Just have not found the right piece. To me, a more modern design ethos indicates confidence about the future, and a lot of people have felt a good deal of uncertainty in our country. So to me it is almost political rather than aesthetic...

Back in the 1950's and 1960's even with the cold war I think a lot of people felt a lot more positive, hence stuff like Mid Century Modern design. I really wish we had stuff as cool as mid century modern 1950's era being done in our country today.

[Brian Holcombe]

IMO, they had a relative new process, new material and a huge consumer group who wanted something which represented them. Mass production as a whole is usually pointed at as an early impetus for modernism but in my opinion the beginning of modernism more specifically starts with the Bessemer process and the ability to mass produce steel shapes for architecture fallowed by the need to utilizing steel shapes for furniture. It was fallowed closely by the ability to mass produce molded plywood and fiberglass shapes.

[Kees Heiden]

So if I find people working in the same type of furniture, they could have an answer to my questions.

Just ask away. A lot of work methods are general anyway. Many modern designs are geared towards powertools, but you can use handtools too.

[Fidel Fernandez]

Chris, There is a lot of modern furniture build in USA. The problem is to find them.
i.e.
http://www.taylordonsker.com/gallery/
http://www.dannykamerath.com/
This one is mostly turning, but is modern http://davidbelser.com/
http://gregklassen.bigcartel.com/
http://www.gretadeparry.com/furniture2
http://www.michaelfortune.com/
http://www.danielmoyerdesign.com/
etc.

I have to search by them, because I don't see them in forums. I am not young, I am middle age (54), but I truly enjoyed this modern furniture/fine art produced in USA.

[Fidel Fernandez]

Kees,

Thanks so much, I will ask a lot of questions. Be careful what you wish for.. :p

I tried to avoid power tools. I made furniture with my power tools, but I didn't feel any joy. It was more like I need it to finish quick.
Hand working gives me more joy, I use the power tools like the planer. I can do it by hand, but it is a lot of work.

[David Weaver]

personally, I'd call that minimalistic.

Yeah, except for the super pimp dad range in the middle there. Looks expensive. kees,....you pimp!!

[David Weaver]

If such a thing exists in furniture and woodworking, I think it's just a matter of taste/trend.

I was reading something a couple of months ago where someone from germany had popped into a trucking forum and began to berate american trucks (like peterbilt and kenworth custom types) because they were "1950s" style trucks.

His entire argument was that the european trucks were better because they were "much more modern".

Maybe we like things that are less temporal and modern here (Ok, that's almost a joke as we've become a consume and discard society) because the people over here are generally the poor immigrants from europe.

Most of the furniture I see for sale around here in galleries is modern type furniture with little hand work, and if there is any hand work, it's tasteless stuff like wedged mortise and tenon. That's my opinion of course. I don't care to see the ends of joints. The ask is is always high - slab chairs of purpleheart and curly maple for several thousand dollars, etc. I don't know if there is any bargaining involved when it sells.

[Brian Holcombe]

If such a thing exists in furniture and woodworking, I think it's just a matter of taste/trend.

I was reading something a couple of months ago where someone from germany had popped into a trucking forum and began to berate american trucks (like peterbilt and kenworth custom types) because they were "1950s" style trucks.

His entire argument was that the european trucks were better because they were "much more modern".

Maybe we like things that are less temporal and modern here (Ok, that's almost a joke as we've become a consume and discard society) because the people over here are generally the poor immigrants from europe.

Most of the furniture I see for sale around here in galleries is modern type furniture with little hand work, and if there is any hand work, it's tasteless stuff like wedged mortise and tenon. That's my opinion of course. I don't care to see the ends of joints. The ask is is always high - slab chairs of purpleheart and curly maple for several thousand dollars, etc. I don't know if there is any bargaining involved when it sells.

Depends on where you look. Look at a company like Rud Rasmussen, who produces the designs of architects Mogens Koch and Kaare Klint and they are producing stuff utilizing a combination hand work (true hand work) and machine work. I've seen how they produce dovetails for instance, which is to cut on the bandsaw but chopped by hand. They are using a shaped edge on their case goods and producing a 'finished' product by the standards of yesteryear. It's expensive, but definitely not at the price of gallery furniture. This is modern by it's definition but in my opinion a fine example of craft.

Being mostly interested in Japanese case goods, like Tansu, I dont find exposed joinery to be offensive unless it's done with high contrast woods (low contrast or tone on tone for me).

[Jim Matthews]

So how about this, Kees:

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7191/14046333523_29c973f6ec_b.jpg

https://geo.yahoo.com/f?s=792600099&t=d60f52944b23f3e6f74b68f8164db630&r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fchevy_ch ase_hughtos%2F14046333523%2Fin%2Fset-72157644375693154&fl_ev=0&lang=en&intl=us
Modern or old?

Awesome is timeless.

kudos

[Jim Matthews]

The recent "Made in Massachusetts" exhibition of studio furniture at the Fuller Craft museum
may have illustrated the distinction more clearly.

It included traditional masterworks, as exemplified by Phil Lowe's federal period chair
to the fanciful silk-screened cabinets of Jenna Goldberg.

To my mind, modern design was exemplified by Gere Osgood's iconic desk.
Sleek, novel and fully functional.

300083

[Brian Holcombe]

Jim, Did they have anything by Peter Follansbee, the Wainscot chair of his is pretty sweet. Not modern by any stretch of the term, but definitely craft.

[Sean Hughto]

Jim, you're nice. Thanks. My point was only that there are indeed folks on this board who make things other than pieces in classic styles and reproductions. Taste for it .... That's another matter.

[george wilson]

I hardly ever make modern furniture. In fact,I don't make much furniture. But my wife likes Art Deco. I never paid much attention to it before I met her.

This is a table and jewelry box I made for her in the 90's. It has wrought iron "legs". The table and box are made of curly maple,,lace wood,cocobolo,and Brazilian rosewood. There are small panels of stained glass flanking the bracelet drawer. It is faced with a mirror with brass trim. I made the drawer pulls also,from brass. The bracelet holder is the size of her wrist. It pops up when the drawer is opened. Inside the tall doors are places to hang long necklaces.

It is finished in nitrocellulose lacquer.

Lots of angle cutting in this piece.

You will either like it or hate it,I'm sure!

[Sean Hughto]

Exquisite! Like everything you make. Your patience and attention to detail is unrivaled. Lovely design too. All class.

[Paul Sidener]

I would think you would be better off looking at woodworker's blogs. I have been in Jeff Miller's workshop, he makes some beautiful contemporary pieces. He has some interesting techniques as well. He has a wonderful blog.

http://furnituremaking.com

[Frederick Skelly]

That's all old stuuf Sean.

Contemporary is NOW

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Chest_of_Drawers.jpg

Umm, Kees? You, uh didnt build this one did you? Because, well, it ummm, well it looks like someone was moving and the load shifted.

Uh. Sorry man.

[Shawn Pixley]

You are absolutely correct here! New materials, an affluent society, and a rejection of the traditional combined with ideas coming out of Scandanavia which coalesced into the American mid century modern movement.

[Sean Hughto]

Fred, drawers are the compartments housing our personas. From the skins we cover ourselves in to meet the world each day to the implements we utilize to cook and feed ourselves to the make up, papers and pens and on and on. For this piece I utilized found drawers that had housed persona fragments and built them fresh housings in a nod to the tansu aesthetic. These persona fragments and their housings cascade over one another in the jumble of modern day tiddlywinks. The flexible strap represents the boundary between ourselves and the world - flexible and barely able to contain our fragments. I hope that helps. ;)

[Shawn Pixley]

Ask away. I tend towards Japanese modern. We live in a modern house and largely have modern furniture except for a few antique pieces I have collected (Art Moderne, Art Deco, Arts and Crafts, and Eastlake Victorian. I would be a bit (maybe a lot) more minimalist than my wife.

The stacked drawer assemblage is not furniture IMO. it is intended as art. I don't care for it myself.

[Shawn Pixley]

So how about this, Kees:

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7191/14046333523_29c973f6ec_b.jpg

https://geo.yahoo.com/f?s=792600099&t=d60f52944b23f3e6f74b68f8164db630&r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fchevy_ch ase_hughtos%2F14046333523%2Fin%2Fset-72157644375693154&fl_ev=0&lang=en&intl=us
Modern or old?

Modern rustic. Nice craftsmanship. Not my personal style or liking.

[Sean Hughto]

What a relief to have a label. Lol

[Shawn Pixley]

The recent "Made in Massachusetts" exhibition of studio furniture at the Fuller Craft museum
may have illustrated the distinction more clearly.

It included traditional masterworks, as exemplified by Phil Lowe's federal period chair
to the fanciful silk-screened cabinets of Jenna Goldberg.

To my mind, modern design was exemplified by Gere Osgood's iconic desk.
Sleek, novel and fully functional.

300083

Beautiful!

I like John Makepeace's work as well.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ijc3i0aB9bU/TXtie-lh3KI/AAAAAAAAB08/QPFePiOpCRg/s1600/John%2BMakepeace%2BFlow%2Bchest.JPG http://www.johnmakepeacefurniture.com/john-makepeace-furniture-designer-maker/furniture-design-gallery-page-images/flow-chest-detail.jpg http://www.itsrudetostare.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Trilogy-jpg.jpg

[David Weaver]

I hardly ever make modern furniture. In fact,I don't make much furniture. But my wife likes Art Deco. I never paid much attention to it before I met her.

This is a table and jewelry box I made for her in the 90's. It has wrought iron "legs". The table and box are made of curly maple,,lace wood,cocobolo,and Brazilian rosewood. There are small panels of stained glass flanking the bracelet drawer. It is faced with a mirror with brass trim. I made the drawer pulls also,from brass. The bracelet holder is the size of her wrist. It pops up when the drawer is opened. Inside the tall doors are places to hang long necklaces.

It is finished in nitrocellulose lacquer.

Lots of angle cutting in this piece.

You will either like it or hate it,I'm sure!

When I see that, I think of d'angelico guitars.

[Frederick Skelly]

Fred, drawers are the compartments housing our personas. From the skins we cover ourselves in to meet the world each day to the implements we utilize to cook and feed ourselves to the make up, papers and pens and on and on. For this piece I utilized found drawers that had housed persona fragments and built them fresh housings in a nod to the tansu aesthetic. These persona fragments and their housings cascade over one another in the jumble of modern day tiddlywinks. The flexible strap represents the boundary between ourselves and the world - flexible and barely able to contain our fragments. I hope that helps. ;)

Oh man, I cant stop laughing. I cant stop. Im so glad you explained it Sean. I was worried some guy's stuff fell out of his truck all over the Autobaun.

I just cant stop laughin man!

I prefer your work or Shawn Pixley's. Both of you are great with design.

[Paul Sidener]

That's all old stuuf Sean.

Contemporary is NOW.

Sorry Fidel, I have no real answer. I am curious myself. You can find some hobbyist made stuff and discussions on woodworking.de which is more modern then classic.


https://www.rachmaninoffshop.nl/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/strandhoutkrukje1.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Chest_of_Drawers.jpg

Reminds me of this.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoqpjOZxf2M

[Mel Fulks]

George, beautiful. Seems more "Deco inspired" than Deco, a good thing since it was not made in that period. The trompe
Loil facade is not unmasked until the cabinet is opened, and the fine points and beauty of the interior that are usually reserved for your wife make it a great gift.

[Frederick Skelly]

All joking aside, this has been a GREAT thread. I learned more about design by reading this thread and reviewing the links you folks provided than I think I previously KNEW. My stuff is almost always rectangular. Its pretty enough but very straight forward and doesnt push any artistic boundaries. Heck, I never knew some of this stuff EXISTED. (Yes, I know that sounds ignorant or sheltered or both - but its true.)

Thanks for the lesson.

[Peter Pedisich]

This is a very interesting thread.
A reminder that great design, like great music, transcends categories.

[Jim Matthews]

I must admit, I'm surprised by this.

It's slick, and playful without being cute.

Kudos

[Jim Matthews]

I vaguely remember the show.

I had to stand back from the Osgood desk, so as not to drool on the finish.
I don't recall anything elaborately carved, on display.

The thrust of the exhibition was "studio" furniture, which I took to mean, "You don't dare use it."
Some of it was achingly beautiful, and wildly impractical.

I prefer modern designs that people actively use.
It's why I make things, after all.

[Jim Matthews]

That crenellated chest of drawers is really clever.

The complex carvings with such a simple finish -
it's striking and original.

The three legged desk is a bit far afield for me, however.

Even money says the wilder the design, the faster it sells.

[Brian Holcombe]

I agree, I think the practical use of something is in itself, beautiful.

[Kees Heiden]

Umm, Kees? You, uh didnt build this one did you? Because, well, it ummm, well it looks like someone was moving and the load shifted.

Uh. Sorry man.

Don't worry Fred. i googled for "Dutch design". That's quite a phenomenon at the moment in the art world.

The kitchen on the first page is my work. Its Italian design, adapted to my situation. Maple and the narrow horizontal strips are wallnut.

[Kees Heiden]

If you want a feel for what's available to normal people in The Netherlands, have a look at this website. It is a mall, specialised in furniture, close to my home. No fancy designer stuff, just the things normal civilians are looking for at the moment. Just click on the links for the indivual stores and you'll quickly get an idea.

http://www.wooon-leiderdorp.nl/wooonwinkels

Anything like that in America?

[Warren Mickley]

If you want a feel for what's available to normal people in The Netherlands, have a look at this website. It is a mall, specialised in furniture, close to my home. No fancy designer stuff, just the things normal civilians are looking for at the moment. Just click on the links for the indivual stores and you'll quickly get an idea.

http://www.wooon-leiderdorp.nl/wooonwinkels

Anything like that in America?

Kees that looks like period furniture, old fashioned 20th century stuff. I had a hoekbank (sofa) just like one of those in my kitchen thirty years ago. I got it for free because it was old 1960 style. They even brought back some of the 1950's chrome.

[Kees Heiden]

Which one do you mean? It's quite varied. Some stores are rather modern, there is a bunch of what we call "Brocante". There is traditional stuff. I don't think it is too different from what is available in America?