Little finger numbness after turning?

[John Sincerbeaux]

New to turning! A couple of days ago I roughed out 14" Koa HF. I used a 3/4" bg to initially round the piece. I have found that sometimes when performing a push-cut, I use my full hand over the gouge. This results in my pinky contacting the flute of the gouge which is pretty sharp without being sharp! Obviously when roughing out the chain-sawed log, there is quite a bit of banging and pushing and vibration. Once the form gets true, I usually use more of a thumb pushing the push-cut which is easier on the hand. It took me a couple hours to rough out. Never felt any pain but that night I noticed my pinky was a bit numb and tingly on the outside edge. It was my fith HF to date and I'm sure I still am over muscling things but I think it is mainly from my finger intersecting with the point flute and a lot of energy being absorbed at that point?
Has that happened to anyone else? Does a tight glove help?
48 hours now and still tingly:(

Thanks in advance for any advice, critique, or remedies

[Thom Sturgill]

You may have damaged a nerve. There are two nerves, one along each side of the finger that provide sensation to the finger. . Damaging the nerve can cause numbness on the side of the finger supplied by the nerve.

Go see a doctor. Numbness after 48 hours is not normal. Neuropathy would generally affect the entire hand starting with the little fingers, while Carpal Tunnel Syndrome tends to affect the thumb and first three fingers fingers. I get some numbness from both, but none related specific to turning.

[Alan Gan]

When dealing with numbness that effects the entire pinky and most of the ring finger this would be caused by the Ulnar nerve.This nerve runs under your elbow, think funny bone. There are Ulnar slide exercise that an help this, Surgery is the next step.

One easy test for this is to spread your hand out wide and stiff, with your other hand try to push your 1st finger back toward your middle finger and then push your Pinky in toward your ring finger. There should be a lot of resistance, if you cannot stop the fingers from touching Ulnar could be the culprit.

Good advice Thom gave you, go see a Dr.just in case, you do not want permanent damage.

[John Sincerbeaux]

Thanks guys. It's really just on the outboard side of the pinky. Thankfully the finger tip is fine. I think just the way my pinky gripped the flute portion of the gouge and the pounding/vibration kinda pinched a nerve?

[Thom Sturgill]

You do not mention the orientation of the wood. Wood always cuts easier across the grain (toward or away from the center) rather than lengthwise. If you are turning end grain, do your roughing cut as a series of steps into the piece rather than a sweep from tail to head stock. If turning side or face grain push cut moving the length of the bed. Lyle Jameison has a good video on you tube for roughing a bowl from a split log. In either case, if you are getting beat up you are probably doing it wrong.

[John Sincerbeaux]

Face grain!
If there is a way you can rough out a log that was chain sawed without some bang'n around, I'd like to see how. I learned from a guy who does 20"+ HF's, and I'll never forget my first impression on how much bang'n goes on as the facets of the log make contact with the gouge. I remember him telling me that the reason most turners don't turn large HF's is because it's too scary. I do agree that I'm doing something wrong? I've always wondered why Lyle Jamison is Always wearing a glove?

[Kyle Iwamoto]

New to turning and you are roughing a 14" koa HF? That is a LOT of money. Both the koa and the equipment to turn a 14" HF. :)

This is what I do. Learn to cut with your other hand. I use right handed and left handed cuts. Especially when roughing, when I get beat up too. This supposedly helps prevent repetitive motion injuries. Plus, when you get tired using the right hand, use the left hand and give your right hand a much needed break. You can turn twice as long. Even changing your stance helps change things up a bit to help keep the RMI away.

I use gloves, but that is a whole nother discussion if it's "safe" or not...... I think it's safe provided the gloves are tight fitting ones and not the loose floppy type.

[Steve Schlumpf]

John, being new to turning, I have to wonder just how much of a grip you had on the gouge. You only need enough pressure to keep the gouge from sliding on the toolrest. If you were applying a lot of pressure - while 'fighting' the wood - during roughout, then I can understand why you probably pinched a nerve. I have had my little finger go numb like that also but it usually went back to feeling normal in a couple of hours. I do wear gloves because they help cushion my hand from the metal toolrest and gouge.

If your finger is still numb, I agree that you should have it looked at. Good luck!

[John Sincerbeaux]

Aloha Kyle,
Yes, I have placed myself in a monster Vortex:). I have been doing flat work for most my life. I used to do woodworking as a way to pay for flying lessons. Now I use my flying to pay for my woodwork. I fly professionally to HNL every week. I have participated in the Hawaii woodshow for almost ten years. I have sold my work through all the Martin & MacArthur stores as well as a few galleries in HNL. A year ago, while in Sante Fe, I saw some Hollow Forms that totally inspired me. And in all my years in Hawaii, I never saw Koa hollow forms so I decided that I would learn how to turn. I am kinda a research geek and learned as much as I could about tools and techniques. I bought a VB 36 (long bed) from Steinert which now produces that lathe in Germany. I have purchased the best of everything I think is possible only after again research and by talking to turners I know.
I have a nice Koa supplier in HNL although it is always a struggle to find premium curly Koa. It's actually kind of hilarious how I get a 20" koa log on to my jet:). I gave an 18" log to the guy who mentored me. He turned it in March, turned again in Aug. He sold it a few weeks ago in a gallery here in Dallas for $5000.00.

I would love to talk to you sometime about your work. We probably know many of the same "Island Turners"?
My website is. www.sincerbeaux.com
Aloha

[John Sincerbeaux]

Steve, I definitely think my grip is too strong. I used a glove on my previous HF and had no problem. I think a glove is the way to go and I also like how it protects you from the super heated shavings.

Thanks again for for your advice.

If will see if I can't post some pics here of my current HF.

[John Sincerbeaux]

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[Dan Clark]

John,

I took a look at the pics on your website. That's some exquisite work! I especially like the Koi(?) jewelry box. The workmanship is excellent, but it's the style and delicacy in which it was rendered that make it a unique work of art, IMO.

Regards,

Dan.

[Don Bunce]

Perhaps a setup like is shown in the first minute of this video would help to relieve the stress of roughing out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKat201Vy4

[Kyle Iwamoto]

You do some very nice work!
You're is a league way above me.... That VB is my dream lathe......

[John Sincerbeaux]

Thank you guys for the kind words.

Tomorrow, off to a hand specialist/surgeon:(

[Bruce Pratt]

Ok. I will wade into this, and probably get thumped, but here goes. IMHO, there is no reason why roughing a chain-sawed piece into round should be an exercise in noise and pain. With the right tool presentation, right speed, sharp tool, light cuts, and some patience, it is no more of a problem than rounding small square stock into a cylinder. If one is getting lots of thumping and banging, the cuts are too deep and the tool handle may be too high... even with a roughing gouge, and cutting lots of air, one can "ride the bevel" and get quiet/clean cuts on rough stock.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Bruce, not here to thump ya but have to point out that the out-of-balance chunk of wood you decide to turn has a lot to do with the speed you can turn. Larger pieces require you to really turn the speed down and no matter how you hold the sharp gouge, it wants to pull the tip into the wood, resulting in a challenge to maintain control. Once the wood is somewhat balanced, then you can turn the speed up but even then, mass can be a little intimidating. :D

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[Bruce Pratt]

Agreed, out of balance requires low speed. I may start some really OOB pieces at 100-150rpm. I tend to hold the handle of the roughing gouge really low. It seems to reduce the tendency to pull into the wood.