1 3/4" door rail/stile/sash router bit

[Brian D Smith]

Hi all,

Hoping you can help me find this. I collecting the cutters I need for a door project for my home and I'm having trouble finding what I want.

This picture (I borrowed for Google) shows what I'm after. For 1 3/4 stock, 1/2" shank.

Profile is a slight ogee with a small shoulder.

I want the profiles/stops to be matched and the gap or slot between them to be 1/2".

So for example, 5/8" profile height on either side with a 1/2" gap. So the initial pass would produce a 5/8" profile with a ~9/8" flat verticle section...in the picture the tall flat part above the lip were the panel or glass would sit.

I've found the what I want is mostly called a window sash bit but nothing I have found gives me the profile or sizes I'm after.

298882

Any help?!

Brian

[Peter Quinn]

You are not going to make a 1 3/4" sash or door frame with glass rabbit (thats what they call that flat step) in a single pass on a router, its tough even on a 5HP shaper, that is a huge amount of wood to remove., and with the bars in the middle, the last pass is riding on a bearing surface of maybe 1/4".....see the problem. Its easier to do it with a single profile cutter on the bottom, a 1/4" slot cutter as a depth reference above that, then make a TS cut or multiple passes with a rabbit or straight cut to clean the waste. This yields a better cut quality, its easier on the machine be it router or shaper, and its safer assuming you work safe. Here's (http://www.amazon.com/Freud-99-268-Interior-Hi-Density-Carbide/dp/B000NJECMA) a set that will do this on a router from Freud. You have to remove much of the stack....or you can run the whole cutter stack and just saw or route the molding cut off of one side. A few others make similar sets (eagle, infinity, amana, etc)

Use your creativity and careful set ups, think in stages, anything is possible. Some router users I've found tend to think every joinery operation or molding comes from a single profile, you just need to buy the right bit. Not so much. It may take a number of distinct set ups to make a sash frame, and you can stack the router spindle as needed to make it happen. With a shaper every set gets stacked on the spindle, so you get used to the process of manipulating the cutters to do what you want, its maybe more intuitive?

One tip....first glass rabbit removal on bars is easy, you still have the wide bearing surface of the bar plus the half the rabbit you haven't removed. For the second one you need to add a shim to the fence equal to what you have removed that will support the stock vertically and horizontally as it passes the blade or cutter. On a TS I run a solid strip the length of the fence, on a shaper or router I run a strip on the out feed fence only, can't shim the infeed fence because the material is still there!

[Brian D Smith]

Thanks for all the info.

I don't mind make two passes or so I was just hoping to not have to go between all those tools just for repeatablilty sake.

I guess I could do a profile cut and a dado cut to clear the waste at one shot.

Amana makes a set that is for 1 3/4 stock but the straight cutter is too small and the bearing to tall (leaves too wide of a step) for what I'm looking for.

Guess I could call them and see if they could adjust it for me.

Anyone know something off the shelf?

Brian

[Peter Quinn]

I've made a lot of doors, not exactly understanding what your issue is with the "bearing too tall"? The bearing on these sets is to set the fence on the router table or to run a curved pattern. The bearing on the cope is for safety to keep the end cuts from diving in. Neither of theses has anything to do with the "steps" or flats in your molded profile. They are set to the minor diameter of the cutter and are merely an edge guide. There is a direct trade off between cut quality and depth of cut on the molding cuts. You simply can't take it all out in one pass without wrecking the parts. On a large shaper you can, on a router, not really. Two passes.....no, not really. Most of these entry door sets make a 1/2"-5/8" deep molded profile. Ever try to flush trim off 5/16" in a single pass with a router? 1/8" per pass is heavy. So think 3-4 passes for quality. You can do this consistently by setting the fence up to the bearings, then packing it out with shim plates, say 1/8" masonite, or you could make different plates, say 3/8", 1/4" and 1/8". First pass...3/8" plate, router takes off 1/8". Next pass, 1/4" plate...etc. You don't need to involve a dado to remove the waste in the glass rabbit, that is suicide raising a dado almost all the way up and pushing what amount to small parts over it. You only need a single rip blade to take the waste out as solid. Ive run these parts on a 9HP shaper, the issue is the wood as much as anything. The sash you posted in the pic is...shall we say....chunky? The flats between the molding look like they are approaching 1"? That looks more like prison bars and less like an elegant sash, the whole point of making a sash is to maximize view, though it still has to be strong enough to keep out the elements.

Once you make the parts delicate the force of the cutter on these parts can move them around, contort them as they pass by, stock control is challenging and critical. Did you look at the Freud set I linked above? It has every element you need to make any door or sash. This amana set will do it too. ( http://www.timberline-amana.com/instructions/inst_trs-290.pdf ). The grovers make a 1/2" groove which is standard for insulated glass. Another thing I have done on glass door frames is to make the two sided mold with the 1/2" panel groove, rip off the molding on one side close to but not quite at the bottom of the pane groove, then flush trim with a laminate trimmer, very accurate, quick enough. You could do small bars that way with a dedicated fence on a router table.

Id suggest you get a set and make some practice cuts, it will make a lot more sense to you than looking at pictures of cutters.