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View Full Version : Chisel questions - Japanese related



Brian Holcombe
10-22-2014, 3:28 PM
Howdy,

I'm working through my dovetail bench project and while I knocked out all of the large dovetails and wedge tenons with my current set of LN chisels I couldnt help but wonder if a set of Koyama-ichi Chu Tataki nomi's would be more successful.

The issue I have with the LN's has been the edge holding when going through white oak. I've microbeveled the edge, but I do not like to put a heavy angle on them because they then become less useful for other tasks. If I had to guess I'd say I'm putting about a 35 degree bevel on them.

I'm being romanced by the idea of heavy duty white steel chisels and a 24 oz steel hammer.

I dont need a whole set, so I'll probably end up getting 4-5 of those and a two mortising chisels for the mortises I most commonly make.

Any thoughts are appreciated, wondering if this is worthwhile, or if the siren song of Japanese chisels is just that.

David Weaver
10-22-2014, 3:47 PM
In my opinion, any of the decent japanese chisels are going to hold up to that kind of stuff a little better as long as your strikes are direct pressure straight up and down.

I get a tiny bit of damage from mortising out a plane mortise briskly, but I can mortise the whole plane mortise (which is quite a bit of volume) and still do heavy paring work with the chisel and still do a quick touch up on a washita stone and go to the next one.

Only the most commodity-ish of the chisels have delivered ho hum, and one other chisel that I abused that couldn't take the abuse as well as an inexpensive old american framing chisel.

Are you still going to get damage? Yes. Is it going to be less than what LN chisels give you? I don't know. Are you going to love what the chisels deliver in every other circumstance vs. A2 chisels. Absolutely. A2 is a bizarre choice for a chisel steel.

(unless you have the O1 chisels, and then yes, the japanese chisels will stand up better, too).

For outright cruel abuse, HSS is hard to beat, though. Even if it's cheap mujingfang chisels (which I wouldn't ..well I did, but I wouldn't buy them as they come in one small, one medium and three very large sizes and not in some sensible combination - and the shipping makes them cost a lot more than the $10 each price tag that they carry).

From a practicality standpoint (since you've already spent the money), I'd say stick with the LNs and give them a small microbevel and then hone it off later. From a user enjoyment standpoint, I'd say get some nice japanese chisels. From a new purchaser (who doesn't have either yet), definitely japanese. Definitely.

Terry Beadle
10-22-2014, 4:14 PM
I know Mr. Weaver knows of what he speaks. I would recommend a heavier hammer and I wouldn't think you would need 4 ~ 5 of the Japanese chisels. A 1/4, 3/8ths , and a half should do you well.

White oak shouldn't bother a LN A2 chisel set to 35 degrees. It should last a good long while between re-sharpenings or re-honings. I'd check to make sure it's a 35 degree micro bevel and if
it's not lasting, increase it to 38 and use a heavier hammer with lite taps. If it's still not good, use a japanese mortising chisel set to 35 degrees. Just a cheap one will do the job IMO.

For example: http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/iyoroi-mortise-chisel.aspx is $55.

Enjoy the shavings!

Kees Heiden
10-22-2014, 4:14 PM
I can vouch for the Koyamachi chisels. i bought them because I had 9 large drawers in the pipeline made from Jatoba and western red ceder. About the worst woods you can use for dovetailing, but hey, the wood was free so no reason to complain. My antique Dutch and Swedish chisels didn't survive very long in Jatoba. The Koyamachi's were a lot beter. I could easilly dovetail one drawer, touch up the edge and continue with the next one. No need to do a lot of edge repair after one drawer corner like before. I did have the edge honed above 30 degrees though. The WRC was a pain with any chisel I had, only super sharp at a very low angle made reasonable cuts and I had to touch up the edge after each corner.

The chisel didn't like morticing in maple too much, but I think that was my lack of technique at that time.

Brian Holcombe
10-22-2014, 4:42 PM
Thanks Fellas. I'm going to get a few and see how it goes.

...I'm doing my next project in walnut, lol. I need a break from rock maple, sapele and white oak.

Brian Holcombe
10-22-2014, 5:49 PM
They're on their way (or will be soon), got the biggest hammer too.