Harbor Freight dust collector question

[wallace chapman]

Hello, I'm new to the forum, even though I've been reading many of the posts for awhile now.

Question: I seem to be showing symptoms of wood allergies lately and am forced to get a decent dust collector. I have a two car garage that I keep the door open during warmer months.

Can I get by with a 1 1/2 HP DC unit for four main machines?

I will need to only use one machine at a time, Max 2. I need to control dust at the tablesaw, Radial saw, Planer and jointer. I need something economical right now. I just had the electrician install a 240 volt plug for a new cabinet saw a couple of weeks ago and now it seems I may be forced to pay out for another one for a 2hp or greater DC unit. I've been reading Bill Pentz's website and posts here and now disheartened by the cost of these units.

If the answer is yes about the smaller unit, does anyone here have any experience with the Harbor Freight 2hp (?) unit or the Sears 1 1/2 hp DC on their website? I will want to conver these to a canister filter or at some point and eventually go with a cyclone.

Any economical suggestions would be great.

[Frank Hagan]

Well, bad news I'm afraid. If you are allergic to dust, then the cheaper bag-type DCs may make it worse. They tend to become "dust pumps", pumping out the invisible bad dust into the air. If you can locate them outside, where they won't contaminate the air in the shop, they would work. Some guys have built little DC sheds for this purpose. You may be better off with plenty of ventilation rather than a "dust pump".

For a lengthy explanation of woodshop dust control, see Bill Pentz's site at http://www.billpentz.com

The cartridge style dust collectors seem to do a better job. The Jet DC1100 is reviewed favorably on Pentz's site. There is also a link to Wynn Environmental's retrofit kits that can outfit a bag-type DC with a cartridge filter that filters to the 1 micron range (see http://www.wynnenv.com/35A_series_cartridge_kit.htm for one for the HF DC).

[Dave Sweeney]

Alergies aside, the HF 2HP DC will work just fine for your sized shop as long as you don't have too elaborate of a piping collection system. I've been using mine for two years now with no complaints. Definately change out the stock bags that come with it for some more efficient ones like the Grizzly G5556 for example. If your timing is right and it's "on-sale" and you can get ahold of one of their 10% off coupons, you should be able to pick one up for about $135.

[Joe Spear]

There has been a lot of discussion about the HF dust collector on the WoodNet Forums over the past year, mostly favorable. I got mine for $149.95 + $7 shipping and handling. Sometimes the price goes as low as $129.99 + s&h. The dust collector works very well. At the amperage listed on the motor, it may be closer to 1 1/2 hp vs. than 2 hp that is sometimes claimed. It can pull up to 22 amps on startup but is rated at 16 amps for continuous use. I have it on a dedicated 20-amp circuit and have had no problems. It will blow a 15-amp circuit though. The motor can not be converted to use 220 v. The bags, however, leak too much dust. (I think they're 30 micron.) But you can get good replacement bags that fit from different sources, including Grizzly. You can also get a Wynn filter cartridge that will fit with no modifications. (See their website.) With replacement bags or a cartridge filter, you can have a dust collector that does the job at a lower price that most others (if you don't get it for the ridiculous $229.99 or $249.99 prices that HF sometimes lists it at). I use it on only one machine at a time, but it might be possible to hook it up to a couple at once. I just use the push-on plastic hose fittings on whatever machine I happen to be using at the time. The Long Ranger remote control works well with it, also.

[Allan Johanson]

Buy a proper fitting cartridge respirator with HEPA filters and wear it all the time. That's your best protection against the dust. No DC will catch all the dust, not even a giant cyclone. Don't mess with these allergic reactions.

Good luck!

Allan

[Brad Olson]

If you either put a canister on it, or low micron bags you might see some improvement.

You might also want to look into an overhead filter. There is some debate if these things really work, but I suspect the would help a little bit especially if you pay close attention to the final filter and get a low micron filter made for it (Wynn enviromental might be able to make a custome one cheap)

Check my WW link for how to put a canister on the HFDC

If you have about $900 available you should get a cyclone. Right now both Oneida and Grizzly have EXCELLENT prices on cyclone dust collectors, prices that may not last too long.

[wallace chapman]

The HF DC works great with a separator hood attached. I sucked in loads of dust around the shop and really had to strain to see any particles floating in the sunlight. The .1 micron bag from Highland Hardware are incredible. Do I still need to install a neutral vane?

Three questions on this setup:

1. should the trash can seperator be closer in the suction line to the tool or closer to the DC unit?

2. I have a galvanized can for the Separator, can I use cardboard to line the inside to quiet it down and also allow me to use a trash bag held in place by the cardboard?

3. Do I need the top and bottom bag to be .1 micron or can the bottom collection bag be the 30 micron bag? The gentleman at Highland Hardware seems to think that only the top bag needs to be the .1 micron bag. would it still be necessary for me to go the extra step and get the Wynn environmental filters?

The Plumber came by today and planned out the duct work, he seems to think all 4" would be fine and reducing down for some of the smaller machines with drops coming off of the main.

PS: What respirator are you using?

[terry richards]

I can comment on your galv. can question. I put a self-stick weatherstrip around the bottom of the separator lid. When the DC is running, a strong seal is made as the pressure inside the can drops considerably and pulls the lid down. If you try to put a trash bag inside the separator, make doubly certain it doesn't get sucked into your fan. Don't underestimate how much turbulence is swirling around inside. If noise in the can is a problem, you could probably do just as well by wrapping some foam rubber on the outside of the can. Also, the noise dissipates a lot as the can gets a few inches of sawdust in the bottom.

My galv can is set right next to the DC. To put it out closer to the dust source might improve efficiency a little bit, but it and its piping take up lots of space in the shop and moves its incremental noise closer to your ears.

[Frank Hagan]

I built a separator for the output of my DeWalt 735 planer, and I used that foam pipe insulation. It works well to form a good gasket around the circumfrence of the trash can (the planer pushes the chips out at a good clip, so the can is pressurized ... for a separator for a DC, where the can is on the suction side, a metal can is probably needed to prevent oil canning. But I think the pipe insulation as a gasket would work as well on the suction side.)

[Bill Fields]

Wallace:

Welcome--you will find invauable info and tips here!

Someone posted what seems to be a simple solution to "bag suck".. They bought enough wire "hardware cloth" to force the bag against the can side thus holding in place. Remove the wire and then remove the bag of chips.

I have bought this setup, but my system is not installed yet so can not tell ypu if it works.

Also. I like the respirator approach.

BILL FIELDS

[Ralph Barhorst]

I purchased the same HF system but added the Wynn filter as shown in this thread. I have never even connected the cloth filters that come with the DC. The Wynn filter works great and I no longer have any problems with fine dust. I also paid $159 for the HP DC. The filter from Wynn was around $80.

Call Wynn and they will tell you which filter is the best for what you want.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=26625

http://www.wynnenv.com/cartridge_filters.htm

[Jim Bell]

Buy the HF collector and roll it outside before turning it on. Heck you might not even need a bag
Jim

[Bernie Weishapl]

Wallace I have the HF DC. It does a good job if you don't try to do to much. I run one machine at a time and have 4 hooked up and use blast gates. I bought the Wynn Cartridge Filter which is .5 micron for $91. I have it hooked to my Jointer, Band Saw, Table Saw and Lathe. The main thing on the lathe is it doen't pick up a lot of the chips but does well taking the dust away when sanding.

[Larry Turner]

I have a question. I have a HF model 45378 dust Collector. Because I moved a little over a year ago I put my DC in storage. Now I have a new shop and pluged in my DC and it will not come on. Can anyone please tell me how I can get it going again?

[Curt Harms]

I have the Wynn spun bond filter. The advantage showed up a few days ago. I've had the Wynn filter for a couple years of light use. I blew it from the outside with compressed air at around 60 psi and tapped the outside of the filter with a 1X2. I finally took it off and washed it out which is something you can do with the spun bond poly filter but not paper filters. I got about a gallon of dust out of the filter after compressed air and tapping. I built a Thien baffle and it seems to work well so far. I don't feel the need for a preseparator. The advantage of of a preseparator is it keeps a lot of stuff out of the fan and lower bag. The downside to a preseparator is it takes up space and there's a performance hit. I'm happy with the Thien baffle solution so far.

Curt

[Alex Berkovsky]

Larry,
It's a common problem with HF DC. I am not sure if I can link to another forum so I will PM you the links.

[Steve Sawyer]

I have the "2HP" HF DC. I fit it out-of-the-box with the 0.5 micron Wynn filter, and a plastic bag on the bottom. Works well through about 12 ft of 4" PVC ducting to a table saw, jointer, planer and bandsaw with blast gates. The jointer, planer and band saw have a flexible hose that I move from one machine to the other. The ducting is permanently attached to the table saw. I also have a 30-gallon plastic drum with a Thien baffle as a chip separator for the jointer and planer.

This setup works extremely well. However, I noticed (as mentioned above) that even with a good DC system, there is some that inevitably escapes, plus there are some operations that inherently have no DC at all - hand planing, hand sawing, jig saws, many routing operations, hand drilling, all of which are going to create dust that gets further spread around when you clean up. I began to notice some respiratory irritation when working in the shop, even when no wood cutting had been done for over 24 hours! I purchased and began using a Jet AFS400 benchtop ambient air cleaner that uses a 1-micron filter. I put it on end on a little roller base so I can roll it under one end of my workbench, added a timer switch to it, and was amazed at the improved air quality as indicated by my lack of respiratory discomfort. My shop is very small so I can get away with that small unit, but Jet makes larger units.

[David Hostetler]

Another 2HP HF DC / Wynn Spun Bond Poly 35A user here. I am adding a Thien Baffle. Mine is the 97869 (new model). DO NOT RELY ON THE NEW MODELS 5 MICRON BAG!!!! 5 microns is too course to do any good, you need to go 1 micron at least...

I got mine on sale with the 20% off coupon. I paid $144.99 for mine... The Spun Bond was $170.00 after shipping. WELL WORTH THE MONEY is all I can say about it...

Like a lot of other HF power tools, as well as other mfg tools that are equipped with the same Chinese components, the power switches are known to get gunked up and fail. On some of the older tools, such as that 45378, well their time is due on a lot of them. My Northern Tool Drill press has that same switch. It's simply a matter of time before it fails.. I would start tracing the wiring faults there. That is the most likely failure...

FWIW, I am not the biggest HF fan, but then again, I don't rule them out out of hand... I have the following...

Central Machinery #32208 Band Saw (Modded)
Central Machinery #97869 Dust Collector. (Modded)
Central Machinery #34706 12x36 Lathe with swivel head (Jet 1236 clone).

And I am up around 100 various bar clamps, pipe clamps, and spring clamps from HF as well..

I give them credit where credit is due, and warn folks away from the duds..

I think *MOST* of my HF tool descisions were made from the "HF Gems List".

[Keith Outten]

I have a question. I have a HF model 45378 dust Collector. Because I moved a little over a year ago I put my DC in storage. Now I have a new shop and pluged in my DC and it will not come on. Can anyone please tell me how I can get it going again?

Larry,

The HF dust collectors are made with low quality switches. I have one in the sign shop at CNU, the switch didn't last very long. The good news is that it is relatively painless to install a quality switch from your local Borg or hardware store.

In my workshop at home I have a Grizzly 1.5hp DC that is over 16 years old. The performance of the Grizzly is superior to the HF 2hp unit.

Neither of the Dust Collectors use bags or filters, I use a chip box located outside which improves performance and takes care of any little leaks and certainly the dust pump issue. If a little bit of dust leaks outside there isn't any harm, if it leaks inside the cumulative affect on your health is a serious issue.

For me there are only two suitable options concerning dust collection. Either use an exterior chip box or purchase a top notch quality cyclone dust collector with built-in filtering capability. The former option is inexpensive and just as effective as the more expensive cyclone. If the weather in your area is too severe in the winter making the heat loss a big issue then the cyclone would probably be your best choice.
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