teaching a laminated plane build class

[bridger berdel]

I've been teaching a couple of classes at the local woodcraft store for the last year or so. One is freehand sharpening, the other is plane tune up. Both are 2 hour classes. I'm thinking of offering a full day class to build the baltic birch laminated jack plane here:

www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?218110-experimental-plane&highlight=

I'm looking for suggestions and input from those of you who have taken or held full day classes. A few data points-
As this will require the use of some of woodcraft's machines, table saw, band saw, drill press, belt/disc sander, etc it will be listed as an intermediate level class.
Depending on how the materials and supplies are handled, the cost of the class could be quite high. My initial impetus for building this plane the way I did was largely ease and cost- I had spare blades and ply scraps on hand. My cash outlay to build this plane was zero. The cost to attend this class will be around $200.
I don't have any way to guage how much interest there will be in such a class.
There is a lead time of 3 months or so to get a class onto the schedule and thus listed in the mailed flyer and the website.
I'm thinking of asking to use their classroom/shop for an afternoon to do a quick build as a test run. I figure I'll need to bring in some stuff that that shop is a bit light on- layout tools and clamps come readily to mind.

[ken hatch]

Bridger,

I'm in the Tucson area and have some European Beech cutoffs from my last bench build (enough to keep me in plane blanks for several lifetimes) that should be perfect for Krenov style planes.

Ask Tom about the wood, I gave him a hunk for a plane build. If interested we can make it work.

ken

[Kees Heiden]

Years ago I took a class like that, making a Krenov smoother. It was a two day class. Now I can make a plane like that in half a day, but when you've never done this before it sure takes some time.

[bill tindall]

A lot of the time and angst in making the plane is fretting over a tight mouth. Having adapted the procedure described by Kato and Kawai for setting a tight cap iron I find the tight mouth not just useless, but it gets in the way. I have since opened up all the mouths on my Krenov style planes to enable better shaving ejection. I would suggest that including a lesson on setting the cap iron would be a valuable addition to the class.

Personally, I did not charge $200 for teaching 5 people how to build a Krenov plane. I doubt I would have gotten 5 people in the class. But we don't have a lot of high paid professionals where I live, nor would I have wanted to just target that audience.

[David Weaver]

A lot of the time and angst in making the plane is fretting over a tight mouth. Having adapted the procedure described by Kato and Kawai for setting a tight cap iron I find the tight mouth not just useless, but it gets in the way. I have since opened up all the mouths on my Krenov style planes to enable better shaving ejection. I would suggest that including a lesson on setting the cap iron would be a valuable addition to the class.

Personally, I did not charge $200 for teaching 5 people how to build a Krenov plane. I doubt I would have gotten 5 people in the class. But we don't have a lot of high paid professionals where I live, nor would I have wanted to just target that audience.

I agree on the statement about the cap iron. It should be one of the first things any beginner learns, and would cut out a lot of the nonsense I spent money on over the years, and a lot of the unproductive time sharpening irons to ridiculous levels and taking very thin shavings to avoid trouble.

Same with the statement about tight mouths, they are problematic on a 50 degree cap iron when the mouth is a hundredth and the wear on the plane is following back toward the bed. Presume that krenov planes probably have a fairly short wear, though, or their wedges would cause problems combined with them.

I've otherwise got no suggestions on the class other than telling the people there why things are the way they are on a plane, and giving them a paper take-away that summarizes the important items so that people can retain what they need to retain knowledge-wise (and continue to make good planes for themselves).

[bridger berdel]

A lot of the time and angst in making the plane is fretting over a tight mouth. Having adapted the procedure described by Kato and Kawai for setting a tight cap iron I find the tight mouth not just useless, but it gets in the way. I have since opened up all the mouths on my Krenov style planes to enable better shaving ejection. I would suggest that including a lesson on setting the cap iron would be a valuable addition to the class.



absolutely. the focus of this class is teaching a planemaking method that produces a good performing plane quickly and without a great deal of fuss. for a plane built from plywood a tight mouth would be a disaster. the basics of cap iron use is already a part of my existing plane tune up curriculum- it will certainly need to be included here.






Personally, I did not charge $200 for teaching 5 people how to build a Krenov plane. I doubt I would have gotten 5 people in the class. But we don't have a lot of high paid professionals where I live, nor would I have wanted to just target that audience.

for the most part the prices are set by woodcraft. they take 50% and need to keep their store out of the red... and so do I. Either Woodcraft supplies the class materials from their stock at a small discount, I supply them and set my own price or some combination of the above. I have located some stock bailey pattern blade and chipbreaker sets which I think I'll base the class on. I think that Woodcraft will probably want to offer an upgrade blade and chipbreaker set from their catalog as an option.

as far as high paid professionals dabbling in woodworking as a hobby and not needing to justify costs, I'm seeing mostly retirees looking for a hobby and tradesmen looking for hand tool skills. Tucson must have some of the money is no object type hobbyists, but I suspect that those folks would hop on a plane and take their classes at a bigger name venue than the local woodcraft store. anyhow, I agree that the lower the cost of the class the better.

[bridger berdel]

Years ago I took a class like that, making a Krenov smoother. It was a two day class. Now I can make a plane like that in half a day, but when you've never done this before it sure takes some time.

using the baltic birch ply is definitely a time saver.

[Doug Trembath]

Bridger, let me be the first to say I admire your interest in perpetuating the "build it yourself" method. Many before you have advocated it, and many, many newbie woodworkers have their first hand made planes as favorites. Krenov did a lot a lot to advance the advantages of user built hand planes, and you also deserve kudos for your efforts. As Derek Cohen would say, "Good on ya!"

Having worked with Rockler in a similar fashion, I understand the ethos of instruction in that forum, but it behooves you to transcend the "get them to buy more stuff" mindset, and truly deliver your message. That can be particularly difficult to navigate, but I found it important to provide the correct message without torpedoing the needs of the vendor. Hope that message is clear...

I think your intent is clear, the materials you have chosen provide a plethora of opportunities which can only be supplemented by the vendor, and if your equipment issues allow, you should be well positioned to provide some good, obviously well intentioned, successful tuition.

Best of luck, and, again, good on ya, for trying!

Doug Trembath

[bridger berdel]

....... telling the people there why things are the way they are on a plane, and giving them a paper take-away that summarizes the important items so that people can retain what they need to retain knowledge-wise (and continue to make good planes for themselves).


excellent idea. I'll work on a 1 or 2 page write up. I imagine that the hard part will be distilling the available data down to a manageable amount. I'm not shy about borrowing (with attribution) the work of others. got any good links?

[bridger berdel]

Bridger, let me be the first to say I admire your interest in perpetuating the "build it yourself" method. Many before you have advocated it, and many, many newbie woodworkers have their first hand made planes as favorites. Krenov did a lot a lot to advance the advantages of user built hand planes, and you also deserve kudos for your efforts. As Derek Cohen would say, "Good on ya!"



what I'm doing owes more to krenov than krenov owes to it..... the only real departures from krenov are the use of plywood (which I get the feeling he would have found amusing and would have approved of), and the use of the chipbreaker. the bailey pattern chipbreaker will probably require a screw cap rather than a wedge, another thing that will make these planes un-krenov-like.




Having worked with Rockler in a similar fashion, I understand the ethos of instruction in that forum, but it behooves you to transcend the "get them to buy more stuff" mindset, and truly deliver your message. That can be particularly difficult to navigate, but I found it important to provide the correct message without torpedoing the needs of the vendor. Hope that message is clear...




ya, it's a bit of a balancing act. I'm a bottom feeder tool buyer for the most part, though I do buy from them if they are even close to being competitive, pricewise, on stuff I need. I appreciate the existence of a brick and mortar store a few minutes drive from my house, and don't begrudge them the business model of feeding the woodworking gadget addiction as long as they keep supplying real stuff too.





I think your intent is clear, the materials you have chosen provide a plethora of opportunities which can only be supplemented by the vendor, and if your equipment issues allow, you should be well positioned to provide some good, obviously well intentioned, successful tuition.

Best of luck, and, again, good on ya, for trying!

Doug Trembath


and have a little fun, too :)