20" Grizzly Planer

[Yonak Hawkins]

I am looking at the Grizzly G1033X and the G0454 planers. What I like about the 1033 is the heavier bed, higher amperage motor and the smooth steel outfeed roller. Unfortunately, it only comes with the spiral cutter head.

The thing is, on my current planer I replace the knives, maybe, two or three times a year, on average. I understand that the individual cutters on the spiral head have four edges that can be turned when one side gets knicked or dull. That means a set of cutters would last 16 months to two years and replacing the entire set costs about $650.

I wonder what I'm missing here about the spiral cutterhead. The only advantage I see are better cuts on the occasional board that has an irregular grain and quieter operation.

I would love to hear from anyone who has the G0454. Are you happy with it ? Is the motor stout enough for you. Is there any reason why I should be wary of the knurled outfeed roller ? I'm sure it still results in a smooth board, right ?

Any response is welcome and appreciated.

[Cary Falk]

I have the 453Z 15" with the spiral head. You are missing the fact that the cutters are carbide rather than steel and will last much much longer. The smooth outfeed roller is a plus. I was able to ease up enough on my outfeed roller enough to not get marks on the wood. The quiet factor is huge also. I hope that helps.

[glenn bradley]

The cost savings over a short period of time with insert cutters is well documented. You will spend the money anyway. May as we'll spend less overall and enjoy the benefits of a spiral head.

[Justin Jump]

Im in your same boat, but i opted for the 15" G0453Z....I actually have one on hold until Saturday, depending on what I find at the Tent Sale.

Not sure which cutter head the 1033 has, but I believe it's the Shelix, and in that case......thats the 15x15x2.5 cutter insert listed on teh spec sheet for the 1033x.

$34.95 for a pack of 10.
10 packs of 10 for 100 cutters
$349.95

[Yonak Hawkins]

Glenn, I don't understand where the cost savings is realized with inserts. The initial cost is $900 more, plus I don't see the savings in the long term, either. I appreciate Cary's observation about the inserts being carbide .. that's something I wasn't aware of .. but still, they can't be re-ground and must be replaced at a very high cost, after four re-mountings.

[Yonak Hawkins]

Im in your same boat, but i opted for the 15" G0453Z....I actually have one on hold until Saturday, depending on what I find at the Tent Sale.

Not sure which cutter head the 1033 has, but I believe it's the Shelix, and in that case......thats the 15x15x2.5 cutter insert listed on teh spec sheet for the 1033x.

$34.95 for a pack of 10.
10 packs of 10 for 100 cutters
$349.95

Justin, I had read that it's, like, $65.00 for a pack of 10. $34.95 sounds a little more reasonable.

[eugene thomas]

Think the biggest savings is time. I can run pretty much any wood through my 454 z and no chipping. BIG time saver. Since bought my new planer my wide belt sander getting lot less run time.

[Justin Jump]

Justin, I had read that it's, like, $65.00 for a pack of 10. $34.95 sounds a little more reasonable.


T21348 Carbide Replacement Inserts - 14 x 14 x 2mm, 10 Pack (http://www.grizzly.com/products/Carbide-Replacement-Inserts-14-x-14-x-2mm-10-Pack/T21348) - These one's are $69.95, but the size is wrong.

H7354 Shelix Indexable Carbide Inserts - 15 x 15 x 2.5mm, 10 Pk. (http://www.grizzly.com/products/Shelix-Indexable-Carbide-Inserts-15-x-15-x-2-5mm-10-Pk-/H7354) - These ones are $34.95, and are the same size as the one's called out on the specs on the website....see below.

Maybe a quick call to CS at grizzly will confirm which cutter head is used.




Specifications

Motor: 5 HP, 220V, single-phase, 30A
Table size: 25-3/4" x 20" (56" x 20" with extensions)
Maximum cutting width: 20"
Maximum cutting height: 8-5/8"
Maximum cutting depth: 1/8"
Minimum length of stock: 7"
Minimum stock thickness: 1/4"
Feed rates: 16 & 20 FPM
Cutterhead diameter: 3-1/4"
Cutterhead speed: 5000 RPM
Number of Cutter inserts: 96
Insert Size: 15 x 15 x 2.5mm
Overall dimensions: 56" L X 39" W X 41"H
Footprint: 28" x 22"
Approximate shipping weight: 909 lbs.

[Mel Fulks]

Yonak, I try not to post on this subject ,because those who have trouble changing knives and have only used inferior steel
in the past are clearly convinced the inserts are better. I have to guess the cost saving thing was documented ,in most cases by ,by marketing people. I worked in a shop that had a modern 20 inch insert head ,thousand dollars to change out.
And I find changing them a more tedious process than than standard knives,maybe that's just because I know how to change them. The inserts can also hit something and get "reset" with a high corner that can gouge and ruin a final pass.
Damage to steel knives leaves "extra" wood. I can agree with some of the features of inserts ,without thinking they are
better.

[Matt Day]

Advantages:
Quieter
Less tearout
No fussy knife changes
More time between "knife" changes
Draws less amps (I think?)

Here's a fww'ing article on cost.
http://www.finewoodworking.com/tool-guide/article/bottom-line-on-segmented-cutterhead-cost.aspx

[Mel Fulks]

OK,looked at the FWW article. I think there are flaws. We always used more of the knife width that they estimate. I know
of no planers that have HSS when bought new, it's SEMI high speed. Big difference, "near beer" is not beer, coal is not the
same as diamonds. Disagree the inserts are faster to change out, it is true that just turning a few inserts can remove the
worst defects and get machine going again. But the biggest problem is its raining ,and I need to work outside.

[J.R. Rutter]

My 0.02 is that it depends on your situation. If you are working by yourself at a more relaxed pace and understand how to dial in machinery (and enjoy getting top performance), then straight knives might be the way to go. Fresh steel knives give a better finish than fresh carbide inserts. Reading the grain gets you good tearout-free surfaces most of the time. Custom grinds like back bevels make a big difference in curly grained wood.

If you are more production oriented and have different people feeding the planer, then spiral inserts take away the need to pay attention to grain direction. Tearout in ribbon grain or curly wood is minimal and shallow if it happens at all. Carbide inserts with some wear cut better than steel knives that are dulling. The wood may not be as glossy as when they were fresh, but tearout performance is the same, IME. And it takes a long, long time to wear out carbide inserts. In my commercial shop, we rotate once a year. Shop around for inserts. You can get better deals. The planer does definitely run quieter and the shavings are smaller with spiral insert.

[Charlie Stickney]

I have the Grizzly 20" planer and 12" jointer. Both have the Byrd Shelix Cutterhead. I have yet to turn the inserts in 5 years of use and I see no loss in finish coming out/off of the machines. I use a lot of exotic/hard woods. I figure I can get 20+ years out of a set. Globaltooling.com has the inserts for $26.10/10. So a set for the 20" planer is $261.00. (You can't get many sharpenings on 20" knives for that).
If anyone has never used a machine with the Bryd Shelix head, please do so if you ever have the opportunity. I think you will be well pleased. I personally would never go back to a straight knife system.

Just my .02

[Danny Hamsley]

Yonak,

I have the GO453Z 15" with the spiral inserts. Had it about 4 years, have planed thousands of BF through it, and the inserts are still on the original side. The finish is still perfect. Planes a little slower, but that is OK. At this rate, I will not have to change the inserts for many years. One thing that I do, however, is steel brush every board before planing to get the grit and dirt and dust off the boards. But, I did that with regular knives, too. Keeping the wood clean is key, and a set of inserts will last you a long, long, time, and the finish is superior to regular knives in my experience.

I added the Grizzly GO544 20" planer early this year to do more production planing from the sawmill and kiln. It has a separate 5 HP cutterhead motor and a 2 HP feed motor. It pulls 37 amps. It was the largest planer that I could get without going to 3-phase power. It does a fine job, but it costs a couple of thousand dollars more than the GO454Z.

[Mikail Khan]

I have the 1033x for just over 5 years. Fantastic planer. Never rotated the inserts and I don't plan to anytime soon. I use mainly teak and mahogany.

My planer came with 10 extra inserts in case some got chipped. My Grizzly 12" jointer came with 5 extra. I chipped some inserts on the jointer with a screw embedded in a piece of wood, but was able to rotate about 6 or 8 of them to expose good faces.

MK

[Yonak Hawkins]

I added the Grizzly GO544 20" planer early this year to do more production planing from the sawmill and kiln. It has a separate 5 HP cutterhead motor and a 2 HP feed motor. It pulls 37 amps. It was the largest planer that I could get without going to 3-phase power. It does a fine job, but it costs a couple of thousand dollars more than the GO454Z.

Danny, y'know what's odd about that series of 20" planer like you got, it seems to me, is the wheel right where I would raise the boards to rest them on the top. Do you ever find it gets in the way ?

I'm used to working the planer from the right side. If I were to get that series of planer I think I'd have to re-position it and work it from the left side.

[Yonak Hawkins]

Thanks, everyone, for your responses. I've got lots to think about.

[Danny Hamsley]

Yonak,

You are right. Sometimes I hit the wheel when working from the right side. It is a little aggravating, but not a big problem as you learn to avoid it.

[Jim Andrew]

Danny, have you tried using the bit and sawblade cleaner that Grizzly sells on your cutterhead? I thought my cutters were getting dull, tried some cleaner on a spot, and found that using a toothbrush and scrubbing them a bit with the cleaner made them sharp again. It is the pitch in the wood that makes them seem dull.

[Jesse Busenitz]

I have the Grizzly G1033X and love it!!!! I had a little sticker shock, but got over it super quick! I plane a lot of rough lumber and just rotated the inserts for the first time, and I've had it for 4 years.... probably wasn't completely necessary but some wood would end up just a bit fuzzy nothing bad though.... good tip on the cleaner.

[glenn bradley]

Glenn, I don't understand where the cost savings is realized with inserts. The initial cost is $900 more, plus I don't see the savings in the long term, either. I appreciate Cary's observation about the inserts being carbide .. that's something I wasn't aware of .. but still, they can't be re-ground and must be replaced at a very high cost, after four re-mountings.

There are insert heads on the market that are taking advantage of folks excited about the idea of a spiral head but, still using HSS inserts so the extended life savings is moot. I would go through a set of knives (sharpen to extinction) about every 6 months or so. I ran the insert head for nearly two years before I rotated to the second edge. I have yet to rotate it again. My planer which is about 2 years newer is still on the first edge. There was a good write up on this in some magazine . . . ah, here you go: http://www.finewoodworking.com/tool-guide/article/bottom-line-on-segmented-cutterhead-cost.aspx

Doh! Just realized Matt already shared the article.

[Danny Hamsley]

Jim,

I intend to clean the inserts on both my planers. I bet that will liven them up!