Confused: Jointer vs Planer

[Scott Brandstetter]

I posted earlier that my jointer quit and going to buy a new one. Doing a lot of research and keep seeing things like, "buy the 8inch vs 6inch", "you will outgrow the 6 inch".

This confuses me and I'm sure I am going to show my ignorance. I use the jointer for edge of boards and my planer for the face of the boards. What am I missing?

[Mike Cutler]

Scott

I don't know what you're specifically missing, but if whatever you're doing is yielding a 4S board, that's pretty cool.

Ordinarily the initial face is "joined" on the Jointer, and it becomes the "reference face" for the Planer, or the face initially fed through the Planed opposite of the cutter head. Ultimately the board exits the planer a uniform thickness, and flat.
The wider the jointer, the wider the material you can initially "Face Joint".


I hope I kept my "joint, joined, and join", straight.:eek:

[David Eisenhauer]

Folks first use their jointer to flatten one face of the board, then run it through the planer to get the opposite face cut down and parallel to the original jointed face. If you run a board with a horizontal bow (concave or convex) in it through the planer first, the planer may exert sufficient pressure on the board to temporarily flatten out the bow (some anyway), do some cutting, then allow the bow to spring back up after the board passes through the planer. Joint one face first, using minimal "down" pressure on the board as you push it across the jointer, then flip it over and run it through the planer. Alternate sides through the planer to get more or les an equal amount taken off both sides to get to final thickness. And yes, you will outgrow a 6" jointer if you work primarily on larger furniture pieces. That does not necessarily mean that you have to spend the $ on an 8" over a 6", as that is a financial decision that only you can make when considering income, debt, family obligations, etc.

[Charlie Velasquez]

Scott, the jointer and planer have two different functions. The jointer makes something straight and true. The planer makes a face equidistant from its opposite face.

If you have a board that has a twist in it and put it through a planer the rollers will apply enough pressure to deform the board and remove sufficient material to duplicate whatever irregularities were on the face.


So first we need to flatten a face. We use the jointer for that. When we have one flat face, and we are still at the jointer, we might as well use that to square one edge. Now we have a flat face and a straight edge perpendicular to that face. We go to the planer to to make the other face parallel to the first, then to the table saw (or radial arm) and make the other edge parallel to the first.

** I see I type too slowly, David has already answered.

[Earl Rumans]

As others have stated the normal procedure with a jointer and a planer is the jointer is used to flatten one side of the board. This gives you a flat reference for all the other procedures. After you have the piece flat and true, with the face portion of the jointer, you put that flat piece on edge against the fence of the jointer and run it through until the edge is flat. You now have a flat face and a flat edge that is exactly 90° to the flat face. Now you can take the board to the thickness planer and plane the opposite side of the board. You now have a board with 2 flat faces that are parallel to each other and one 90° edge. You can now take it to you table saw and place the flat edge against the fence. Your next procedure is to cut it the width you want and you will have a board with 2 flat faces and 2 flat 90° edges.

[Matt Day]

The above reasons are why they make jointers 8", 12", 16", 20", and 20"+ wide. The width of your jointer determines the size rough material you can use, generally speaking. There are tricks to use material wider than your jointer but some are tricky and/or time consuming.

[Myk Rian]

With the planer ;
Banana in, banana out.

Joint it first. No banana.

[Peter Quinn]

With the planer ;
Banana in, banana out.

Joint it first. No banana.

LOL....this. Exactly. All of woodworking, even curved work, is predicated on square 90 degree corners, perpendicular faces. You won't get these from the lumber yard. You make them. And the jointer is the tool most use to 'peel their bananas". Otherwise you are working like a monkey.......sorry, couldn't help the bad pun.....my son is doing a sticker project with scratch and sniff banana stickers. Bananas on the brain. Or bananas for brains?

[Mike Henderson]

Assuming you don't do a lot of flattening, you can flatten one side of a board by hand, with hand planes and winding sticks. You don't even have to get it really smooth. Then take it to your planer and plane it with the processed (flat) side down. After the upper side is completely planed, turn it over and lightly plane the side you did by hand.

While flattening a board by hand is a fair amount of work, it can save you the price of a wide jointer. It's all in how much flattening you do.

And unless you get a really wide jointer (20" or so) you'll run into boards that are too wide for your jointer - so knowing how to flatten by hand is a valuable skill.

Mike

[Charlie Velasquez]

Scott, all that said, I get by ok without a jointer. If you can keep the twisted board from compressing flat through the planer, the planer will do its job and remove the high spots. But you still need a flat reference for the planer to work. Google planer sled to see how people do this. It also helps address the problem of jointing boards wider than your jointer.

[Jason Roehl]

Scott, all that said, I get by ok without a jointer. If you can keep the twisted board from compressing flat through the planer, the planer will do its job and remove the high spots. But you still need a flat reference for the planer to work. Google planer sled to see how people do this. It also helps address the problem of jointing boards wider than your jointer.

^^^This.

It may take more time, but you can flatten a board that has a cup from edge to edge in a planer (but not end to end). I've done it by taking off about 1/32" at a time, then flipping the board after each pass. If it's a rough-sawn board, the visual result after a pass on each side if you're doing it correctly is that one side will have a smooth stripe down the middle of the face and the other side will have smooth stripes down the face next to each edge of the board. Lather, rinse, repeat.

[rudy de haas]

Two notes:

1) Europeans often call jointers, planers. If this is part of the confusion, just keep in mind that American usage differentiates the two machines by usage: one flattens one side, the other makes the opposite side parallel.

2) 6" versus 8" depends on what you do and how efficiently you want to do it. Most (not all) 6" jointers have less power and precision than 8" units and are harder to work with even for boards under 6" wide. Most importantly, when you find yourself with a 7" board, you can't easily paste another inch on the side of your 6" jointer, but you can joint a 5" board on an 8" jointer. Basically the extra money buys you a better, more flexible, machine that places fewer limits on your future choices.

[David Eisenhauer]

8" jointers usually have longer tables than 6" jointers as well.

[Scott Brandstetter]

Thanks to everyone. I have learned a ton. I have just recently started buying "rough" 4 sided wood and obviously, using the banana theory, I kept making banana's. LOL.

Thanks for keeping me from going to small like it seems many have done in the past. Will keep my eyes on craiglist and will get an 8 inch planer.

[Kevin McCluney]

+1 to having a long (enough) table. Not hard to find with an 8" or larger, but the 6" ones tend to be too short IMO (of course, it depends on the length of stock you need to joint). I've been happy with a 6", though I eventually upgraded to the Powermatic model which, at the time I got it, had the honor of having the longest table available (may still be the case).

[Rod Sheridan]

Thanks to everyone. I have learned a ton. I have just recently started buying "rough" 4 sided wood and obviously, using the banana theory, I kept making banana's. LOL.

Thanks for keeping me from going to small like it seems many have done in the past. Will keep my eyes on craiglist and will get an 8 inch planer.

That's why many of us bought combination jointer/planers, to get a 12 or 16 inch jointer and plathe same cost and space saving package.

I have a Hammer A3-31, you should look at those and the MiniMax line of machines, money well spent..................Rod.

[Curt Harms]

That's why many of us bought combination jointer/planers, to get a 12 or 16 inch jointer and plathe same cost and space saving package.

I have a Hammer A3-31, you should look at those and the MiniMax line of machines, money well spent..................Rod.

True, but at a substantial uptick in the budget. Hand plane, planer sled, learn the 'joint an 8" board on a 6" planer trick', 12"+ jointer/planer. A few ways to defur the feline, pick one that suits.

[Rod Sheridan]

True, but at a substantial uptick in the budget. Hand plane, planer sled, learn the 'joint an 8" board on a 6" planer trick', 12"+ jointer/planer. A few ways to defur the feline, pick one that suits.

Curt, if you can show me how to joint an eight inch board on a smaller jointer without removing the guard, I'm all for it.

A planer sled works, however it's painfully slow.

A hand plane, use them all the time however for most people the hand plane isn't practical.

Regards, Rod.

[Dave Cullen]

Thanks to everyone. I have learned a ton. I have just recently started buying "rough" 4 sided wood and obviously, using the banana theory, I kept making banana's. LOL.

Thanks for keeping me from going to small like it seems many have done in the past. Will keep my eyes on craigslist and will get an 8 inch Jointer.

Sorry... had to do that. :)

I have a Taiwanese 6" jointer that works very well, but the beds are shorter than I'd like and sometimes I buy 8" stock which requires me to hand plane one face. If you can afford it, and have room, and can deal with mega heavy cast iron... go for the 8".

[Frank Drew]

Curt, if you can show me how to joint an eight inch board on a smaller jointer without removing the guard, I'm all for it.

The guard needs to be removed, but the board you're face planing entirely covers the cutterhead so it, in effect, becomes your guard. Not difficult, not, IMO, nor particularly dangerous assuming the operator is paying attention, etc.


A planer sled works, however it's painfully slow.



True, on both counts.

[Curt Harms]

Curt, if you can show me how to joint an eight inch board on a smaller jointer without removing the guard, I'm all for it.

A planer sled works, however it's painfully slow.

A hand plane, use them all the time however for most people the hand plane isn't practical.

Regards, Rod.

There was no mention of not removing the guard ;). People do it, I didn't endorse the idea. Frank has a point, the work covers the cutterhead completely. Just make sure that when the cutterhead exits the work all your appendages are well clear. I used the 'remove the guard and face joint a full width pass' when I had a 6" jointer. I could never get the second pass to match the first. I started using long narrow strips of plywood sort of like a planer sled. Joint one strip flat, lay that area on a strip of plywood and run the board through the planer. I didn't take heavy passes so the board didn't want to bow toward the unsupported edge. Once the opposite side was flat, flip the board over and plane the remainder of the partially face-jointed side away. This worked pretty well as long as the unjointed strip wasn't very wide. Usually it wasn't more than and inch or two. And yeah it was still time consuming.

[Jim Neeley]

Two notes:

1) Europeans often call jointers, planers. If this is part of the confusion, just keep in mind that American usage differentiates the two machines by usage: one flattens one side, the other makes the opposite side parallel.

2) 6" versus 8" depends on what you do and how efficiently you want to do it. Most (not all) 6" jointers have less power and precision than 8" units and are harder to work with even for boards under 6" wide. Most importantly, when you find yourself with a 7" board, you can't easily paste another inch on the side of your 6" jointer, but you can joint a 5" board on an 8" jointer. Basically the extra money buys you a better, more flexible, machine that places fewer limits on your future choices.


+1

They call our jointers planers and

our planers are call thicknessers.

Jim

[Myk Rian]

It is not difficult to joint/flatten a board that is wider than the jointer. The explanation is longer than the process.

[Chris Fournier]

True, but at a substantial uptick in the budget. Hand plane, planer sled, learn the 'joint an 8" board on a 6" planer trick', 12"+ jointer/planer. A few ways to defur the feline, pick one that suits.

If you have a hand plane you can lose the planer sled, hand plane one face and edge then through the planer it goes. A scrub plane makes quick work of nasty jointing duties.

[Mike Heaney]

When I described what a planer and a jointer do to my wife, she commented that the jointer name made sense, but the planer should be called a "paralleler". In our shop it has been so named ever since!
but I do like the banana analogy too!

Mike

[Rod Sheridan]

When I described what a planer and a jointer do to my wife, she commented that the jointer name made sense, but the planer should be called a "paralleler". In our shop it has been so named ever since!
but I do like the banana analogy too!

Mike

Interesting, when I think of a plane, I think of it a straight surface. That's also what a hand plane produces.

A planer (in North America) doesn't produce a plane, it produces a parallel.

So Planer best describes a jointer, and thicknesser best describes a planer.

Regards, Rod.

[Frank Drew]

I used the 'remove the guard and face joint a full width pass' when I had a 6" jointer. I could never get the second pass to match the first.

You won't, the side face-jointed that way will always be a little irregular where the two cuts meet but that's okay because all you're after is a face flat and straight enough to provide a reference surface when you put the board through the planer, where a little irregularity on the face down won't affect anything; once the top face is planed to your liking, you turn the board over and clean up the face-jointed side.


It is not difficult to joint/flatten a board that is wider than the jointer. The explanation is longer than the process. Quite right; there's probably a youtube video showing just how to do it.