Do you prefer 4/4 or 5/4 wood?

[Glenn Samuels]

If you need to get solid panels finished at .75", do you prefer to start with rough wood of 4/4 or 5/4? I realize that some woods are less likely to move compared to others. I use primarily walnut and cherry and I find that 4/4 that has been jointed and planed will sometimes drop to below .75" to get it flat. With 5/4, there seems to be a bit more leeway although the cost is higher. Would like to hear different opinions. Thanks, Glenn

[Danny Hamsley]

I sell all my hardwood lumber cut rough at 1 1/8" thick. In the hardwood industry, this is pretty much the standard for wholesale truckloads of hardwood lumber. There is never a problem with cleaning up to 3/4". Over 50% of my hardwood lumber will plane out both faces clean at 1", I estimate that 75% will plane out to 15/16", and 95% will plane out to 7/8".

A lot has to do with how the lumber was stickered to dry (stickers are the small strips of wood that separate the layers in lumber stacked to dry). I place my stickers on 16" centers. Lumber stickered on 24" spacing will not dry as flat as on a 16" spacing.

My 5/4 lumber is cut 1 3/8" rough sawn. That is a huge amount of waste to plane to 3/4" finished.

[Mel Fulks]

The "standard" way is to use four quarter. On a particularly important place sometimes some shorts of five quarter might be used to get desired grain type. Even when material is purchased pre dressed at 3/4 it is often glued up to make 3/4 panels. My
preference is to buy 4/4 in the rough, then face on jointer and plane thick as possible (13/16 or a little more) then match ,
joint and glue then size and surface.

[Rich Riddle]

I just planed an inordinate amount of maple and cherry for a friend to exactly 3/4". It started as 4/4 but some was ever so slightly thicker. There might have been a few boards out of the entire lot that didn't look great when done, but we ran the planer for nearly two full days to give you an idea of the quantity.

[Mel Fulks]

On panel work we were taught to face before planing but to look at each board and cut at bends and kinks and judge amount of bow that can be dressed out, not just by size
needed. In other words if you need some panels 2 foot ,4 foot ,and 6 foot ,cut the rough material 6 foot if it can be faced and flattened. If it can't then rough cut to a length that can be dressed flat.Then when you match up grain you have some latitude as to matching grain. I don't cut any rails or stiles until panels are glued up. And of course use the drops from panel cutting first. Then you don't end up with a pile of short pieces that "won't match up with anything".

[Cary Falk]

I buy my wood 4/4 rough or skip planed so it is easy enough to get 3/4" panels out of it.

[scott vroom]

I prefer rough 4/4 skip-planed to 15/16. Unfortunately in my area the dealers offer mostly 13/16 S2S with tearout...sux. I envy those who reside near the source.

[Matt Day]

For me it can depend on the length of the finished project. If I'm building an 8' long dining table, it's going to be harder to get a good 3/4" fully planed 8' out of 4/4 so I'd step up to 5/4. (Though likely in this example I'd be using thicker stock, the principle is the same).

[Prashun Patel]

5/4 is not only more expensive by sheer boardfeet. It is also less common that 4/4 and more work to get to 3/4. It sounds glib, but i prefer to buy wood close to final thickness and cherry pick them for the best probability for stability. If i cannot see them before purchase than i try to get 4/4 that Is truly 4/4+. You have to know your dealer.

[Rick Alexander]

Nearly all my solid stock is from a Woodmizer that cuts the lumber on site here. I definitely prefer 1 1/8 like Danny mentioned because it just gives you so much more flexibility with the lumber. I can if I select the right boards and cut as close to the length I need get perfectly 4-squared 1 inch boards if I want. I find with furniture I do that pretty often. If I want to resaw a 1 inch board to get book matched flat panels for doors that's no problem and I can plane the rough stuff to 1 inch to restack without stickers when it comes from the kiln and still have room to 4 square when the time comes to be used. I find that extra 1/8 inch doesn't seem to matter much when cutting the trees and the Woodmizer guy doesn't charge any different for that 1/8 inch. I also like to have the mill guy cut 3/4 inch boards as well for 1/2 inch drawer stock. So much faster if you don't have to resaw or plane so much lumber away that way. If I was buying it from a supplier it might would be different because I guess I would know more about what the project was going to be and I imagine they charge extra for the extra thickness of 5/4.

[Loren Woirhaye]

I use 5/4 for pantry door stiles because the extra thickness leaves room to tune out bowing. I normally buy hardwoods rough or skip planed and it's on the thick side. I also am selective.

If you need some longer straight pieces, make a template and take it with you to the dealer. You can lay it on likely looking boards and assess whether a kink or other distortion is going to mess you up.

[John Piwaron]

the lumber retailer I visit most often sells 4/4 maple or cherry that's really 13/16 to 7/8 inch thick. They skip plane it. I think they're looking for the fancy grain boards that they then sell for a higher cost. Because of that, I like to buy 5/4. Yes, it's a bit of a waste. But it also guarantees that I'll get the 3/4 inch thickness that I'm looking for in the finished part.

[Glenn Samuels]

Thanks for all of your responses. I will be going to a local saw mill and have them custom cut the lumber for me. If I have them cut to 1 1/4", it should be at 1 1/8" when dry. Then I have a little leeway to get to a very straight 3/4". At under $3.00 per board foot, the extra quarter inch won't hurt too much.

[David Kumm]

5/4 but for cabinets I always like 1 or 1 1/16" rails and stiles and 3/4" raised panels, no back cutting. To my eye looks better and different. Dave

[Myk Rian]

I prefer 5/4. It can be re-sawn into 3/8" panels if wanted.

[Scott T Smith]

Glenn, there are several factors that are at play here. The bottom line is that if the lumber is both flat and high grade (FAS), you can get by with a thinner board and have it clean up at 3/4".

Factors that affect how flat a dry board is include:

Stickering. Need consistent stickers, lined directly above one another, and spaced relatively close together (AKA Danny Hamsley's post).

Raw Lumber: Needs to be high quality w/o grain changes due to knots, etc. Boards will typically warp in areas near where a limb's pith entered the main trunk, and this creates depressions as well as high spots in the boards - preventing them from clearing up with only 1/8" removal from each side.

Next up is board width. The wider the board, the less likely it is to totally clear up from side to side and end to end. 6" wide boards milled green at 1-1/16" will usually clear up on both sides at 3/4". 16" wide boards will not.

If you have lumber milled, keep in mind that board shrinkage may be proportional to the orientation of the wood cells within the board. I work with a lot of oak, and flat sawn oak will shrink approximately 6% from green to dry, whereas quartersawn oak will shrink around 12%. If you buy a relatively narrow boule of oak lumber (12" wide or less) and it is all milled green at 1-1/16" thick, the flat sawn boards near the outer edges of the boule will dry down to 1", but the quartersawn boards in the center will dry to 15/16". This same boule, if FAS quality boards and stickered on 12" centers may still clean up at 3/4". However, if stickered on 24" spacing most likely it will not.

I think that you are wise to have your local mill shoot for 1-1/4" green; however the log quality and how it is stickered will have a substantial impact on the board quality.

[Clay Fails]

I too have had issues getting 4/4 to final thickness, so for the slight increase in cost i now purchase mostly 5/4. My time in the shop is too valuable to be worrying about stock thickness.

[Glenn Samuels]

Great information Scott. Thanks




Glenn, there are several factors that are at play here. The bottom line is that if the lumber is both flat and high grade (FAS), you can get by with a thinner board and have it clean up at 3/4".

Factors that affect how flat a dry board is include:

Stickering. Need consistent stickers, lined directly above one another, and spaced relatively close together (AKA Danny Hamsley's post).

Raw Lumber: Needs to be high quality w/o grain changes due to knots, etc. Boards will typically warp in areas near where a limb's pith entered the main trunk, and this creates depressions as well as high spots in the boards - preventing them from clearing up with only 1/8" removal from each side.

Next up is board width. The wider the board, the less likely it is to totally clear up from side to side and end to end. 6" wide boards milled green at 1-1/16" will usually clear up on both sides at 3/4". 16" wide boards will not.

If you have lumber milled, keep in mind that board shrinkage may be proportional to the orientation of the wood cells within the board. I work with a lot of oak, and flat sawn oak will shrink approximately 6% from green to dry, whereas quartersawn oak will shrink around 12%. If you buy a relatively narrow boule of oak lumber (12" wide or less) and it is all milled green at 1-1/16" thick, the flat sawn boards near the outer edges of the boule will dry down to 1", but the quartersawn boards in the center will dry to 15/16". This same boule, if FAS quality boards and stickered on 12" centers may still clean up at 3/4". However, if stickered on 24" spacing most likely it will not.

I think that you are wise to have your local mill shoot for 1-1/4" green; however the log quality and how it is stickered will have a substantial impact on the board quality.