Buying houses... Brian was right :-/

[Dan Hintz]

Elfert was right, what a royal pain this has been. Although SWMBO and I have discussed moving to a new place in passing many times over the last few years, I suddenly got a burr up my butt a couple of weeks ago. So we looked on Zillow, did a little market research, and took a long drive to see what was out there. Scary!

Frankly, we need more space... we're at something like 2,200 square feet right now (75% of which is finished), give or take, in an early-70's house. I want a bigger workshop, we'd both like a separate home office, and the munchkin could use a bigger bedroom. The munchkin is going into middle school this year, and while the local elementary and high schools are highly rated, the middle school is, well, in the middle. So, off to looking we went.

I expected to find something with more space and in a nice neighborhood for the $500-600k range. LOL! No. Okay, what about bumping it up a bit to $600-700k. Not really. The houses are nicer (but used... generally 15-20 years old, or more), but the square footage is about the same. After all is said and done, we're looking at houses starting in the $850k range (BASE!), which essentially jumps to a cool $1mil when you add in the large lot fees (1 acre) and "upgrades" (i.e., stuff you should get anyway at those prices). These things are huge, with 4,500+ square feet of finished space, huge unfinished basements, etc.

Honestly, I'm not a happy camper. What bugs me the most? There's little to no middle ground. You either get something that's a bit newer for twice the price, but nothing else, or you swing the pendulum the other way and get way more than you want for three times the price. Honestly, I would drop 1,000 square feet in a heartbeat for $200k off of the price. I think I'd drop 2,000 square feet for $400k off if it still came with the basement! I don't need that much "living" space.

Sadly, I have a feeling the $1mil direction is where we will end up heading... not sure how I feel about this :confused:

[Scott Shepherd]

Dan, head south :p This is $459,000 in this area.....notice it's on 5 acres....

293603

[Bruce Volden]

Dan,
I suppose you're limited to "where" you want to be more than what you want to spend? I like looking at prices and spec's on acreages and have found them to be quite affordable here in the midwest. My place is just under 14 acres, 36 x 60 shop, older home in good shape $145K. I've seen larger acreages, newer homes ready to move into in Missouri much cheaper! +1 on what Scott said.

Bruce

[Dan Hintz]

Dan, head south :p This is $459,000 in this area.....notice it's on 5 acres....
And thank you, once again, Steve, for tightening my spiral into depression. ;)



Dan,
I suppose you're limited to "where" you want to be more than what you want to spend? I like looking at prices and spec's on acreages and have found them to be quite affordable here in the midwest. My place is just under 14 acres, 36 x 60 shop, older home in good shape $145K. I've seen larger acreages, newer homes ready to move into in Missouri much cheaper! +1 on what Scott said.
Unfortunately, I'm very limited. With the type of work I do, I have to remain within a certain radius of the groups that do such work, which basically means anything farther than 15-20 miles is unreasonable. To top that off, we have to stay semi-local because of the munchkin (dual custody being what it is, and all of that). We found a place for a bit over $600k... built in '87, on 2 acres, 4B/4B, 5k square feet... but it appears to be an anomoly for the area, which is concerning. I believe SWMBO is working on getting us a tour, but we have so many other things going on right now, I'm not sure if it will happen before we have to make other decisions (and I'm not overly impressed with how they used the space they have, nor the 80's style interior).

[Brian Elfert]

It must be nice to be able to afford an $850,000 house! I could probably get a mortgage for a $400,000 house, but I couldn't really afford it without cutting all my other spending to the bare bones. If I was willing to spend $400,000, or even $350,000 I could probably get the house of my dreams. Existing houses in the $300,000 to $400,000 price range in the area I am looking at tend to be fairly new, but also two story with way more space than I need. If I wanted to spend that much I would have a new rambler built on a nice lot.

I am thinking I might have a new house built and give up on the other house that needs major work. The bad thing about the lot I would build on is it is too wet for a full basement. The builder can do a split level, but I hate those. I'm going to talk to the builder about building a rambler on a slab. The thing I don't like about that is running duct work through the attic. It also reduces future resale value as everyone expects a basement in Minnesota.

[Scott Shepherd]

And thank you, once again, Steve, for tightening my spiral into depression. ;)


My pleasure Dan! That's what I'm here for :p

[Mark Bolton]

I know the middle school was a concern and I'd imagine there are other factors but heck, for those numbers you'd think a heck of a remodel/addition would be on the table. Wouldnt solve the shop but...

[Dan Hintz]

It must be nice to be able to afford an $850,000 house! I could probably get a mortgage for a $400,000 house, but I couldn't really afford it without cutting all my other spending to the bare bones. If I was willing to spend $400,000, or even $350,000 I could probably get the house of my dreams. Existing houses in the $300,000 to $400,000 price range in the area I am looking at tend to be fairly new, but also two story with way more space than I need. If I wanted to spend that much I would have a new rambler built on a nice lot.

I am thinking I might have a new house built and give up on the other house that needs major work. The bad thing about the lot I would build on is it is too wet for a full basement. The builder can do a split level, but I hate those. I'm going to talk to the builder about building a rambler on a slab. The thing I don't like about that is running duct work through the attic. It also reduces future resale value as everyone expects a basement in Minnesota.

If you have a place to stay right now, building is a great way to go, as long as you're willing to act as your own GC and wait a year or more for it to be finished.

I never want to play on the edge, living paycheck to paycheck, as I know many do to get into those big houses and keep up with the Joneses. I've never been a "keeping up with the Joneses" kind of guy. If it was just the one mortgage, I'd be okay with things... but until we get out of the current house, into the new one, and sell the current house, that's two mortgages to deal with. We wouldn't be living paycheck to paycheck, but I would voluntarily tighten the family belt until that second monkey was off of our backs. I also need to do some quick fixer-upper things to the current house so I would feel comfortable putting it on the market (not to mention getting our Zillow listing updated with current info... for example, the square footage does not include any of the basement, so I have been finishing parts of it to include in the "livable space" number). Seeing as how the new house hasn't been built yet, I have a little time.

Trust me, I'm not happy having such a limited selection of homes to work with, but around here they're snapped up as fast as they can build them.

[David Weaver]

What are the property taxes on an $800K house? Around here, they'd be $1500 a month or so, and they're only going to go up as the local tax base ages and the local school district workers age and have higher (active and retirement) benefit and compensation costs.

Having a kid in the "top school" is a bit of an overrated thing, in my opinion. Above average with good AP options in high school is plenty, the rest is up to the parents (in building good habits) and genetics. People around here spend all of their money to get their kids into more or less three different districts, and then get taxed to death, and a lot of them have kids that are average or only slightly above average, and they need better parents more than they need better schools (in terms of focusing the kids academically).

I'd personally rather leave the difference in cost to my kids when I croak (you're talking about numbers like $500k difference, and whatever that would accumulate to), but the issue of needing office space for two different people *and* a shop does put a pinch on 2200 square feet. Presume the zoning and permitting is pretty tough in columbia, and would make it difficult to figure out how to turn your SF into something like 3k sf and everything finished for another $150k? I grew up not far from there and went to western PA strictly because the influx of gov. contract money into the suburbs of that area is going to make it so that the average person is going to stretch to afford their houses.

[Brian Elfert]

If you have a place to stay right now, building is a great way to go, as long as you're willing to act as your own GC and wait a year or more for it to be finished.


I have a place to stay as my house was sold in May. I would be using a builder as banks won't give a construction loan to be your own GC generally unless you make your living as a GC. There was a company that helped you be your own GC and saved you money, but they went under about 2009 due to lack of business. The builder has told me 10 weeks to build which I doubt although I saw a house get built in 10 to 12 weeks just recently.

[Matt Marsh]

Funny, the drastic range in real estate prices over the country. Here is a right nice 4,447 square foot lake home near me in Northern MN on 1.6 acres listed for $519.900. http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/30512-County-37-Laporte-MN-56461/115006657_zpid/

[Jim Matthews]

I don't envy anyone in the OP's age bracket in tight housing markets.

There will be a glut of nice houses, in about ten years when your kid
is already out of school and people my age find the maintenance too much.

We were in a similar position, two years ago on discovering that the local middle school
was contaminated by PCBs and classroom sizes were edging toward 30 kids in each.

I looked within a 20 min driving distance to SWMBO office, and found it would cost
us $275,000 (over the anticipated life of the mortgage) to move and send our kids to
a nominally better public school district.

Our solution was to bite the bullet and pony up serious money for parochial schools.

Getting a bigger room for a growing kid sounds good, but in my house, that just means more piles of kid crap.
I'm finding my shop space adequate, as I reduce the number of tools used down to a more basic kit.

Have you considered a modular building on your property, to make shop space?

Good luck in your search, there's probably a very good compromise in the mix.

When I bought my first house, I drove around until I found a promising neighborhood
and asked if anyone was considering selling.

I found it during the annual neighborhood yard sale.

[Wade Lippman]

Dan, head south :p This is $459,000 in this area.....notice it's on 5 acres....

Is that a "normal" price, or is there something seriously wrong with it? I thought our prices were the cheapest in the country, but that looks very reasonable if it is reasonably updated.
What would taxes be?

[Scott Shepherd]

Is that a "normal" price, or is there something seriously wrong with it? I thought our prices were the cheapest in the country, but that looks very reasonable if it is reasonably updated.
What would taxes be?

That's in a rural county. I'd say that's a fairly normal price for that size house. Most houses regular people live in are in the $150K-220K range.

It's showing the taxes for it at $3,600 per year for 2013.

There are many others like it on Zillow. Go to zillow.com and enter "Hanover, VA".

I live in a surrounding county. I couldn't afford to live in the mother-in-law suite in that size house :)

[Brian Elfert]

There will be a glut of nice houses, in about ten years when your kid
is already out of school and people my age find the maintenance too much.


I have the same thought that the housing market will crash once baby boomers all start selling their houses and downsizing. My parents are in their late 60s and plan to sell in the next four or five years. I tell them to sell now because my dad wants to build a model railroad layout. Stupid to build a layout and tear it down a few years later. He also wants to remove parts of walls that would have to be replaced when they sell.

[Wade Lippman]

That's in a rural county. I'd say that's a fairly normal price for that size house. Most houses regular people live in are in the $150K-220K range.

It's showing the taxes for it at $3,600 per year for 2013.

There are many others like it on Zillow. Go to zillow.com and enter "Hanover, VA".

I live in a surrounding county. I couldn't afford to live in the mother-in-law suite in that size house :)

Around here the taxes on that house would be $12,000. One county over (where Rochester is) they would be $20,000.

I always thought our taxes were sky-high because our values were so low, but our average house price is probably $150,000, so the discrepancy is not large.

Our income tax is about the same as yours, but our sales tax is higher. Gotta get out of NYS!

[Chris Padilla]

Well, here in SILLY-con Valley (SF Bay Area), I can understand Dan's plight. Real estate here is pretty crazy as well and homes get multiple bids. I recently received a personal hand-written note (snail mail) from someone wanting to know if I'd sell them my house. They even put a price in there that was about 25-50k more than I think my house is worth! I showed it to my wife and she immediately tossed it in the recycle bin. Sure, we could sell our house and walk away with 100%+ equity (purchased in 1999) but our mortgage would go up (i.e. monthly cash flow would decrease) finding a new place. I outgrew my 2-car garage-ma-hal workshop 10 years ago and I'd LOVE to get a place with a 3 or 4 car garage but I'm not sure I want it THAT badly. Our daughter doesn't go to the best middle school but it isn't bad and they've improved their rankings/scores every year. Her eventual high school also isn't the best but it is reasonable and not so bad that I want to pay to send her elsewhere. I'll pay for college but I'm already paying for public school via 7k/yr in property taxes. I guess when we retire we might finally sell but then we'd have to leave the area and we would never be able to afford to get back into it...and that might just be fine. 15-20 years to go...ugh!! :)

[Steve Peterson]

If you see a house that you really like, you need to act fast. The good houses get sold really quick and get taken out of the MLS system, while the problem houses stay on the market for years. It skews the average quality of the houses in the MLS system. If you only look at the new listings, you have the best chance of finding a good house before it is gone. It is frustrating to look at all the old listings of problem houses.

Steve

[Jerome Stanek]

If you see a house that you really like, you need to act fast. The good houses get sold really quick and get taken out of the MLS system, while the problem houses stay on the market for years. It skews the average quality of the houses in the MLS system. If you only look at the new listings, you have the best chance of finding a good house before it is gone. It is frustrating to look at all the old listings of problem houses.

Steve


That sounds like real estate talk around here there are a lot of houses that are a good value and have been o the market for a while. Neighbors house was for sale for 10 months and sold because they had a new house built and couldn't afford 2 payments.

[Brian Elfert]

That sounds like real estate talk around here there are a lot of houses that are a good value and have been o the market for a while. Neighbors house was for sale for 10 months and sold because they had a new house built and couldn't afford 2 payments.

I think Steve is right. I see good houses sell within days. There was a house that looked perfect for me by looking at the MLS listing. I asked my agent to set up a showing and it was already sold after just a few days.

If a house has been on MLS for 30+ days I start to wonder if it is overpriced or something is wrong with it.

[Shawn Pixley]

Dan, I feel for you. I have followed the other thread without commenting. I'd like to suggest some things.

The question you may need to ask is, "how scarce is what I would like relative to the general market?" If the house and property that you are looking for are common, you have a reasonable chance of finding one for a reasonable price. If, on the other hand, you are are looking for a property that is a fraction of 1% of the general market, you will be looking forever and still not finding it at a reasonable price.

While at the end of the day you'll write one check for a house and the land it sits on, when shopping for houses knowing the fundamentals of land valuation can help you to determine whether what you are looking for is viable or not. For instance, in my neighborhood a 3,500 square foot lot goes for $750 without a building. (No, I didn't pay near that). For several of the first generation houses from the sixties, the houses are actually liability relative to the land value (the 1000 sf house and land going for less than $750K. If I wanted any property of an acre or more in size, I would need to move 20 miles further away from where I live (I am already 20 miles from my employer).

Everything in real estate is about location and timing. Property in rural Iowa has a very different value than land in Southern California. Cheap land in Iowa doesn't help me much. An just because I would like a 4,000 sf house on the beach in Malibu for under a million dollars, doesn't mean I could ever find it. When I am looking for land / buildings for my job, I have found that a comprehensive understanding of the market (commercial real estate for my job) can help you detemine whether what you are looking for is viable in the area you are considering.

We looked for 3 years to find the house we are in now. It was very frustrating. We toured probably 100 homes before getting this one. Was the house perfect? No. But is satisfied enough of the criteria that we bought it. A week doesn't go by without someone encouraging us to sell our house and move to a bigger, more expensive one. I am not interested in that at all.

Good luck in the search. I am pulling for you.

[Bob Rufener]

Reading your thread makes me smile. We live in SE Wisconsin. We have 18 acres, a pond, a 2300 sq ft house (built in 1975 with a lot of my sweat) a basement shop and walk out basement. We pay $4000 for taxes and our local school is a good K-8 school that feeds into a nearby high school with a great technology department. I deer and duck hunt in my back yard. For $500K I'll walk out tomorrow and leave the furniture. I guess it is all about location, location, location. People around here who complain about their property taxes should read the replies to your thread and be happy for what we have.

[Brian Elfert]

Property taxes even from one county to another can vary dramatically. Where I was living I was paying $4,800 in property taxes per year and the next county over a similar house valued the same is $2,800 to $3,000. The county I was living in includes the city of St Paul, Minnesota so the county had a lot of extra costs for social services.

[Scott Shepherd]

Around here the taxes on that house would be $12,000. One county over (where Rochester is) they would be $20,000.

I always thought our taxes were sky-high because our values were so low, but our average house price is probably $150,000, so the discrepancy is not large.

Our income tax is about the same as yours, but our sales tax is higher. Gotta get out of NYS!

Come on down, Wade! Just leave the crazy taxes at the state line :)

[Rick Potter]

Dan,

Is it possible to find a smaller house with a lot big enough to add what you want? That way you can get the improvements the way you want them, not someone else.

Rick Potter

[Mark Bolton]

Reading your thread makes me smile. We live in SE Wisconsin. We have 18 acres, a pond, a 2300 sq ft house (built in 1975 with a lot of my sweat) a basement shop and walk out basement. We pay $4000 for taxes and our local school is a good K-8 school that feeds into a nearby high school with a great technology department. I deer and duck hunt in my back yard. For $500K I'll walk out tomorrow and leave the furniture. I guess it is all about location, location, location. People around here who complain about their property taxes should read the replies to your thread and be happy for what we have.

That is my reaction but of course obviously neither of us has the location based needs for professions, children/visitation, and so on.

I live in a area of the country where major incomes are hard to come by for the average joe (WV). I own 115 acres with a house on it that I paid 50K for the land and have very little in the home (my profession). My tax bills for a few properties and personal property just landed this week. The taxes on the property and residence are 440.80/year. Same as you, good K-8 in town and decent highschool but its a good bus ride away for the kids. I also own a commercial building (my shop) which I hate to even say what I paid for it, lets just say less than a decent used car, but its 4K+sq' and right on the main drag and my taxes on the shop and land are 226.24.

All that said, there are a lot of accommodations that one must appreciate to live in the country. Its nothing against Dan in any way but people shopping for million dollar homes just arent going to live here.

[Dan Hintz]

For all you guys who can get a sweet house for a few hundred $k... I hate you ;-) Being midway between the Baltimore and D.C. beltways (about 20 minutes without traffic... which never happens, of course) has its advantages... a lot of jobs in the surrounding areas. But an obvious disadvantage is housing will not be cheap. I look at it as a long-term investment... the housing costs more than in most areas of the country, but I make more, too, so all of the money I put into the house will (hopefully) be available sometime down the road. If I move to a cheaper area, I can still get a sweet place and possibly have a little retirement money left over.


What are the property taxes on an $800K house? Around here, they'd be $1500 a month or so, and they're only going to go up as the local tax base ages and the local school district workers age and have higher (active and retirement) benefit and compensation costs.

Having a kid in the "top school" is a bit of an overrated thing, in my opinion. Above average with good AP options in high school is plenty, the rest is up to the parents (in building good habits) and genetics. People around here spend all of their money to get their kids into more or less three different districts, and then get taxed to death, and a lot of them have kids that are average or only slightly above average, and they need better parents more than they need better schools (in terms of focusing the kids academically).

Proprty tax in this county is $1.014/$100 of valuation. If you add in fire, garbage, sewage, etc., taxes come to a round $1.30/$100. On a $1mil home that's around $1,100/month... not wonderful, but a tax I'm willing to pay for a nice area. I don't think ours would be quite that much because it's well water and septic systems, so that's a small savings.

Our munchkin is a smart cookie, but I know she'll fall behind if we don't keep her interested (she's like me that way). We have already gotten a poor feeling for how her first year would go in the local middle school, whereas she would be in some quality advanced programs in the new one. She'll either be an engineer or an artist... I'm hoping both. :D


Dan, I feel for you. I have followed the other thread without commenting. I'd like to suggest some things.

The question you may need to ask is, "how scarce is what I would like relative to the general market?" If the house and property that you are looking for are common, you have a reasonable chance of finding one for a reasonable price. If, on the other hand, you are are looking for a property that is a fraction of 1% of the general market, you will be looking forever and still not finding it at a reasonable price.

While at the end of the day you'll write one check for a house and the land it sits on, when shopping for houses knowing the fundamentals of land valuation can help you to determine whether what you are looking for is viable or not. For instance, in my neighborhood a 3,500 square foot lot goes for $750 without a building. (No, I didn't pay near that). For several of the first generation houses from the sixties, the houses are actually liability relative to the land value (the 1000 sf house and land going for less than $750K. If I wanted any property of an acre or more in size, I would need to move 20 miles further away from where I live (I am already 20 miles from my employer).

Everything in real estate is about location and timing. Property in rural Iowa has a very different value than land in Southern California. Cheap land in Iowa doesn't help me much. An just because I would like a 4,000 sf house on the beach in Malibu for under a million dollars, doesn't mean I could ever find it. When I am looking for land / buildings for my job, I have found that a comprehensive understanding of the market (commercial real estate for my job) can help you detemine whether what you are looking for is viable in the area you are considering.

We looked for 3 years to find the house we are in now. It was very frustrating. We toured probably 100 homes before getting this one. Was the house perfect? No. But is satisfied enough of the criteria that we bought it. A week doesn't go by without someone encouraging us to sell our house and move to a bigger, more expensive one. I am not interested in that at all.

Good luck in the search. I am pulling for you.

No way we could really put any sizeable addition on the house here, the lot just isn't big enough to support it, not to mention the surrounding area would not provide a high enough value buffer... houses around here are going for $250-$350k, and we're already near the top of the mark with that range. It was a starter home for SWMBO when she first got married, but now that I'm in her life and she has moved up in the world a bit since the original purchase, it's time to stop living in an area that doesn't offer us the life we think we should become accustomed to ;) Land alone has often gone for $600k/acre in this general area, so I don't feel like I'm being taken... I just wish it wasn't that way. When new houses are built, there's practically a line out of the door to purchase... the fact that there's still a lot left at all says we're already lucky, I just have to decide if that luck is something we wish to make us of.

[Brian Elfert]

Proprty tax in this county is $1.014/$100 of valuation. If you add in fire, garbage, sewage, etc., taxes come to a round $1.30/$100. On a $1mil home that's around $1,100/month... not wonderful, but a tax I'm willing to pay for a nice area. I don't think ours would be quite that much because it's well water and septic systems, so that's a small savings.


Jobs must pay way, way better out there than in Minneapolis, MN. I consider myself pretty well paid, but nowhere near enough to pay for a $1 million house with $1,100 a month in taxes. Heck, some of the houses I've looked at the mortgage without taxes and insurance would only be $1,100 a month. Most of the houses I'm looking at the taxes could be paid for with two months of what you might be paying.

It seems like a private school might be a lot cheaper if your main reason to move is for your child's school.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

These are all what I call "first world problems."

[Mark Bolton]

but now that I'm in her life and she has moved up in the world a bit since the original purchase, it's time to stop living in an area that doesn't offer us the life we think we should become accustomed to ;)

Wow.. I guess maybe that just read bad,.. but with that I guess I'd just increase your budget to 2-3 mil... ;-)

[Roger Feeley]

I heard a teaser (didn't hear the piece) on NPR that Zillow will be making their US database available in Mandarin.
Here is the link to an article in the Washington Post. (http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/07/15/the-chinese-are-coming-and-theyd-like-to-buy-your-house/)

My point here is that there may (emphasis on 'may') be an influx of new buyers in the US real estate market.

[Dan Hintz]

These are all what I call "first world problems."
No argument here about that... but I worked hard all of my life so I didn't have to worry about 3rd-world problems in my own life. As long as my family is fed, clothed, and a roof over their heads, we're good... but why live on roadkill, wear rags, and live in a lean-to?


Wow.. I guess maybe that just read bad,.. but with that I guess I'd just increase your budget to 2-3 mil... ;-)
I ran through the finances and went into the bank with a very specific limit in mind... I will not budge over that limit, and I would prefer to stay below it. By staying below that point, I feel I can live without stress of where the next paycheck is coming from to make the house payment, as well as still saving for future toys, vacation, etc. I'm also making sure my 401k and Roth are fully stuffed to get that tax benefit.

Guess I'll have to engrave a few extra glasses this month ;)

[Steve Peterson]

That sounds like real estate talk around here there are a lot of houses that are a good value and have been o the market for a while. Neighbors house was for sale for 10 months and sold because they had a new house built and couldn't afford 2 payments.

I guess it really depends on the local market. I have seen the effect a few months ago in the Sacramento area. It was different two years ago when there were few buyers and houses were not selling. All of a sudden, the market picked up and minor bidding wars started. It may change again since the recent price increases have brought out a lot more sellers. The best houses still sell fastest. It only becomes a problem when the market is hot and there are more buyers than sellers.

Steve

[Dan Hintz]

As we get deeper into the search, it looks like every place being built now is going to be well/septic, so my earlier thread about such systems has provided a huge amount of useful systems. That said, I can take comfort in the fact that the law of numbers kicks in... there simply can not be any real problem with such systems if so many of them are being used, particularly on $1mil+ homes. It also guarantees a good-sized yard :)

Bot wow, my opinion on cost of everything certainly hasn't changed. No matter how many houses we look at, the middle ground is almost non-existent.

[Brian Elfert]

I was looking today at lots sold in the last two years in the city I want to be in. 18 months you could get a lot for literally half the price of what a lot sells for today. Of course, houses were selling for a lot less than too, but not half.

[Dan Hintz]

I was looking today at lots sold in the last two years in the city I want to be in. 18 months you could get a lot for literally half the price of what a lot sells for today. Of course, houses were selling for a lot less than too, but not half.

Lots are going for up to $600k/acre in the surrounding area... the builders are getting them in packages for $4-500k/acre.

[Brian Elfert]

Lots are going for up to $600k/acre in the surrounding area... the builders are getting them in packages for $4-500k/acre.

About the most expensive land you'll find around here is maybe up to $400,000 an acre excepting waterfront land. More typical in areas without septic/sewer, but still in metro area, is under $100,000 an acre. I think a 1 acre lot for $60,000 is expensive when they sold for $30,000 not that long ago. I have a $209,000 home plan ready to build, but I don't want to spend over $250,000 and not able to find a $40,000 lot that is really buildable.

I'm in the process of buying a $150,000 house with a 3 acre lot though I might cancel the deal due to the rehab costs.

[Myk Rian]

I never want to play on the edge, living paycheck to paycheck, as I know many do to get into those big houses and keep up with the Joneses. I've never been a "keeping up with the Joneses" kind of guy.
Which is what got this country in the shape we're in now. People embraced the "Look at ME" attitude, and bought huge homes they couldn't afford, or even furnish.
Now, I'm paying for the stupidity of others. I spent wisely, paid the mortgage off, and saved my pennies for the retirement I am now enjoying.
I feel sorry for my Great Grand children.

In this area, homes are being sold within 1 week, although it seems the prices are more reasonable than pre-2008. We've had 5 homes sold on this street alone in the past 2 years. Only 1 was a foreclosure, and surprisingly it took the longest to sell. Several months.
You have to be ready to act right now when looking for a home.

[Dan Hintz]

In this area, homes are being sold within 1 week, although it seems the prices are more reasonable than pre-2008. We've had 5 homes sold on this street alone in the past 2 years. Only 1 was a foreclosure, and surprisingly it took the longest to sell. Several months.
You have to be ready to act right now when looking for a home.

Yep, stuff is moving VERY fast, especially since the area is nearing a complete moratorium on building... as it is, the county has said 'no' to quite a few builders at this point. I put a deposit on a specific lot a couple of days back, but we're still looking. A couple of interesting options have presented themselves (at least partially), so I'm paying close attention to how they pan out. We may have to get our current one ready for sale more quickly than I thought, but we'll see...

[Clarence Martin]

If you want a less expensive home, move out to the country far away from SPRAWL !! Bank Owned homes can be a real deal. Might have to spend time and money fixing them up, but you are likely to get more acreage and square footage. A lot of people drive 30 to 50 miles each way to work. The longer drive time is offset by knowing you live in an area that has less houses and fewer neighbors to deal with.

[Dan Hintz]

If you want a less expensive home, move out to the country far away from SPRAWL !! Bank Owned homes can be a real deal. Might have to spend time and money fixing them up, but you are likely to get more acreage and square footage. A lot of people drive 30 to 50 miles each way to work. The longer drive time is offset by knowing you live in an area that has less houses and fewer neighbors to deal with.

Not an option... the ex-husband must have reasonable access to his offspring, and with the 50/50 custody we have, picking her up/dropping her off from school would be painful (the school systems are significantly better out where we'd be moving to).

And I've had enough of 45-mile, one-way commutes... it's a horrible sink on your time (the biggest drawback), and you spend quite a bit of that "saved" money in gas and car upkeep.

[Brian Elfert]

If you want a less expensive home, move out to the country far away from SPRAWL !! Bank Owned homes can be a real deal. Might have to spend time and money fixing them up, but you are likely to get more acreage and square footage. A lot of people drive 30 to 50 miles each way to work. The longer drive time is offset by knowing you live in an area that has less houses and fewer neighbors to deal with.

Bank owned houses aren't necessarily a great deal unless you have cash to buy a house outright and cash to do the repairs yourself and want to spend all your free time fixing up a house. The house I am buying is $150,000 for the house plus another almost $100,000 for a contractor to do repairs. I am getting a bank loan and they probably wouldn't give me a regular mortgage due to the condition. They will loan the money to fix it up if a contractor does the work. I probably wouldn't want to do windows and such myself anyhow since I live alone and I don't know how to install them properly anyhow.

I will end up commuting about 26 miles each way which means 45 to 60 minutes in traffic. I could be looking at two to four hours on a snow day in the winter. I have to factor in the cost of extra gas although I may start taking the bus from a park and ride.

[Clarence Martin]

I guess I just look at things from a different point of view. I have seen enough of the City and heavy traffic , that I know I don't want any part of it. Where I live now, it's a 35 to 40 mile hike to the Malls, Doctors and Hospitals are 30 to 35 miles away. 1/2 an hour to get to a good grocery store. It's true, living further away costs more in time and gas, but it's worth it!:)

[Brian Elfert]

I guess I just look at things from a different point of view. I have seen enough of the City and heavy traffic , that I know I don't want any part of it. Where I live now, it's a 35 to 40 mile hike to the Malls, Doctors and Hospitals are 30 to 35 miles away. 1/2 an hour to get to a good grocery store. It's true, living further away costs more in time and gas, but it's worth it!:)

Some of us still have to work in the city. The house I am buying is further than I would like from shopping. I tend to do lots of home and auto repairs and most all the stores are 8 miles away in two different directions. There is a hardware store maybe four miles away.

[Clarence Martin]

That's walking distance compared to one job I worked on ! LOL Had to rebuild a burned out house that a Man bought up on the shores of Lake Ontario. 70 Miles EACH WAY !! Worked on that all Summer , Fall and through the whole Winter. 980 miles put on the truck each week just for that one job! The fun part of that job came during the Winter . The Harbor would freeze over solid and the house is on an Island . The only way to get building materials to the worksite, was to walk them across the frozen harbor once Winter came.