Pics of New Tote for Disston #7 Handsaw

[Mike Allen1010]

I finally got around to sorting through the rusty old saws hanging in the rafters to restore a couple. I found a Disston #7, 8 PPI, with a great plate , but only partial tote too far gone to repair. Here's some pictures of making a replacement. After soliciting opinions for my fellow Neanders here in the cave, I decided to build a replacement out of some African mahogany and hang onto my precious stash of air dried apple.

I've made a few totes over the years, most of which turned out really horrible. I'm not artistic in the least (more of a technician woodworker), and shaping wood in three dimensions is definitely using a side of my brain that doesn't get much exercise. I've gotten a bit better over time, and wanted to share a few things that work for me:

I used to cut my totes out on the bandsaw, but find I can get a more crisply defined profile with coping saw. This is especially helpful for the crisp, fine details like the lambs tongue on this #7.



Since I have no "artistic vision", having a model to copy is an absolute must.

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I like to saw out tote blanks that are thicker than the finished 7/8" thickness I'm shooting for. This lets me shape the profile from one side and then saw off the chip out on the far side, before final shaping/profiling. As a bonus, your cutoff leaves a nice template for making what everybody needs – more saw totes!
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Here's the profile roughly done with guidelines penciled in for shaping the curved surfaces. The tools that are most helpful for me in shaping are TFWW saw makers rasp and 1/2 round Aireau (I'm sure I spelled that wrong), and some old half round Nicholson files I inherited from my uncle. Truthfully, I could do 90% of the work with the fine grit half round rasp. Cuts fast and leaves a surface that cleans up quickly with files and sandpaper.
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I drilled holes for the saw nuts before sawing the kerf for the plate to get less chip out. I've done these before with a hand drill, but a drill press is almost essential for me to get these halfway decent.
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Here's the original tote, the model and the new tote with holes drilled before shaping.
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It's easier for me to shape the rounded surfaces with the tote clamped to the benchtop filing vertically, rather than in a vice.
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[Mike Allen1010]

I start the lambs tongue with a "V" shaped carving tool, then use a knife to widen the shoulders of the groove. A knife-edge Japanese saw file comes in handy for me to clean out the tight spots.
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My favorite LV layout tool to draw the centered layout lines for the slot for the saw plate.
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I use a backsaw, sawing in from both sides to make the initial cut, and then the saw plate itself to get the final width and depth. I really used to sweat getting this slot in line with the tote, but find it's kind of like sawing dovetails - better to stand back and trust your alignment and saw straight through, rather than going stroke by stroke.
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Here's the tote with shaping complete and square mortises chopped out for the saw nuts on the show side, ready for finishing.
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The standard finish that works for me is Watco oil/ varnish, followed by Amber shellac and paste wax.
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Finally here's the finished saw next to my granddad's #7. If there's a fire, I'm definitely grabbing granddad's saw first!
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Thanks for looking,
Mike

[brad jansen]

Great job!

[Steve Voigt]

Very nice job as usual, Mike. I have a 7 with the lamb's tongue and really love it.
Have you thought about getting one of those Liogier handle-maker's rasps? I've been thinking about it myself, but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

[Stew Denton]

Hi Mike,

Beautiful job! The way that turned out, I would suggest that the next time you make one of those totes you might consider using a little of the apple. It's hard to see a better use than to restore one of those beautiful old Disston handsaws.

Put your initials on the saw, and make sure a grandson or other family member inherits it.

Stew

[Cody Kemble]

You did a wonderful job. How long do you let the watco dry before applying the shellac?

[Cory Waldrop]

Mike,

great job. I just posted my handsaw restoration of a saw my grandpa had. Your handle is more complex and looks like a fun design. Great way to give a new life to that saw.

[Mike Allen1010]

Very nice job as usual, Mike. I have a 7 with the lamb's tongue and really love it.
Have you thought about getting one of those Liogier handle-maker's rasps? I've been thinking about it myself, but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

Steve, I'm really enjoying your coffin smoother build! Beautiful work - I really appreciate your close up pics and excellent, clear descriptions of the build process. Between you and David, I think I've learned enough to give a a one -piece plane a try-maybe. Please keep the posts coming!

I have a "saw makers" rasp from TFWW, and it does make shaping the curves, especially inside the cut out, much easier. For me a tool I don't regret buying (something I can't always say about some of me more impulsive decisions:)).
Cheers, Mike

[Jim Koepke]

Great job Mike.

I usually do not use a filming finish on my saw totes as I am always tweaking them a bit to improve the fit. When it gets to the point of not feeling anything in my hand it is done and then I might finish it. Usually I just give them a wax & oil coat after adjustment and that is what they end up having.

jtk

[lowell holmes]

I'm using a "saw makers" rasp to carve the curves in the top of a crown rail for a rocking chair.
I like the radius the rasp leaves. It really is a nice tool.

[Matthew N. Masail]

Beautiful job Mike!

I also have the curved handle makers rasp from TFWW, it has made making totes much more fun and simple, well worth it IMO.

[Randy Reitz]

Nice work. I love the lines of the old #7s with lambs tongue. That's one of the things I have trouble walking away from when I find one in a stack of $2 saws at a flea market.

[Mike Allen1010]

You did a wonderful job. How long do you let the watco dry before applying the shellac?

Hi Cody, I let the Watco oil/varnish dry overnight. This African mahogany is fairly soft and absorbent so reapply the Watco (or BOLO) couple times. Or better soak in a Ziploc plastic bag and then reuse the finish).

Cory, very nice job with your Grandfather's saw restoration! Thanks for sharing.

Mike

[george wilson]

The saw handle looks beautiful.

[Pat Barry]

I agree with the numerous comments above. It really does look great. WHat I'm curious about is that the tote doesn't match the template you started with and the handle doesn't match your granddads either. It seems you made some decisions to change the design a bit, changing for example the relative angle of the handle to the saw plate - ie ganddads looks to be oriented a bit more vertical and actually looks a bit odd by comparison. I am curious if your less vertical angle was intentional or just the end result? No matter - I'm sure it will work well.

[lowell holmes]

I guess you are referring to hang angle. I'm not sure if the saw with the larger teeth is a rip saw, but I suspect it is.

The hang angle could very well be different. I don't see what you are talking about.

Cutting the slot can change the hang angle, and it is difficult to cut exact. It is easy for a tote to turn out a bit different as it is worked. The wood might not co-operate like you expect.

I think Mike did a great job.

[Pat Barry]

I guess you are referring to hang angle....The hang angle could very well be different. I don't see what you are talking about..

Here is what I was trying to describe. See the angles defined by the handle and the tooth line. This angle difference would result in less or more downward force during the saw stroke. I was just curious if Mike made it this way for a particular purpose.

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[Mike Allen1010]

Pat you are 100 %right the hang angles are different. Definitely not a grand plan, I just didn't align the tote with the plate the same when I marked the holes. It works great.

For me, hang angle is more relevant for joinery and fine pitch crosscutters.

Cheers, Mike

[David Weaver]

Agree with that sentiment, mike. The little bits of difference in those two saws can easily be handled by rake angle (which itself is often talked about in absolutes on here, but better decided by someone who is using the saw day to day to decide "it has too much bite" or "it doesn't have enough bite and I have to try to influence it".

Nice handle, btw. Anything with a lamb's tongue is a big pain. I think you made the right decision saving the apple - there is going to be some point where you want to use it, and if it was quartered, this might be it, but since it's flatsawn, I'd do the same - wait until something really speaks to you about its use.

[Mike Allen1010]

The saw handle looks beautiful.

Thanks very much George for your kind comment. Coming from you I couldn't hope for any higher phrase. I'm like the thousands of others here on the Creek who have been inspired and educated by your fantastic work and helpful insights and comments. Thank you very much for sharing your experience and expertise with all of us on SMC. I consider your presence here to be one of our communities greatest assets.


{Quote= David Weaver] "I think you made the right decision saving the apple - there is going to be some point where you want to use it, and if it was quartered, this might be it, but since it's flatsawn, I'd do the same - wait until something really speaks to you about its use."

Thanks David for your advice. I really appreciate your insight and expertise on all things related to hand tools, particularly shop built tools.I really enjoyed your post about the coffin smoother builds - great work and super helpful instruction and build insights!

As I mentioned in a post about a copy of a Disston #9 back saw I just built from parts from Ron Bontz, I recklessly acquired parts for three more shop built back saws. I may try and use some of the Apple for an open tote dovetail saw. The Apple's air dried and I'm hoping the smaller scale/size of the tote (as compared to a larger, closed toed), will reduce the risk of warping that could cause bends in the tooth line.

Just like you mentioned in your post "I hate saw Kits", I find shop built back saws to be among the most challenging tool building projects I attempt. Keeping the tooth line and plate perfectly straight, while still getting it solidly mounted to the tote is still kind of a mystery for me. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't - I really have no idea why in either case.


If I decide to use the Apple on as a tote for the dovetail saw all try and post some build pictures – not that I'm sure would really help anyone.

All the best, Mike

[David Weaver]

I think that's a good idea. An open handle saw will have small cheeks. Plus, you'll have it in your shop, so it probably has limited movement potential compared to making saws in one spot and shipping saws all over the world.

I think that a special setup with a sled against a fence and a low-set bandsaw blade would probably make cheeks better than can be hand sawn, and the brass backs if folded would need to come from a back that was chamfered and cleaned up, and then folded. My recent backs have been cut or sheared and they still have some scuzz at the edges and then they get folded together and that scuzz gets pinched in the backs. You and me and every other normal person has no easy way to get that stuff out, especially when it's brass cuttings that is still hanging on.

My first two saws came with backs that were finished and stamped "wenzloff and sons", chamfered and all. I have no idea why Mike was so generous on those backs, but they went together well and straight, but both saws had big english handle types and the handles influenced the plates a little bit (I cut them by hand, too), so they still are not perfect.

It's probably nice to get process down when saw making and have made a hundred or two hundred and really get everything set well. For the average person using only hand tools, it's pretty difficult to make a perfect product. I still can't carve a decent lamb's tongue that is uniform around the bottom of the handle and then tapers nicely and perfectly around the curve until it thins out to the tip.

It's nice to have threads about these things, though. Thanks for posting your builds and fixes!

[george wilson]

When we made all those saws,I had a special,extra thin bandsaw blade I used to slot the back saw handles. Our usual blades were much thicker. It worked quite well. Our usual blades were .032" thick + set. The thin blade was .025" IIRC. More like the type of blade you'd use on a small bench model home shop bandsaw,except it was on a Delta 20" bandsaw.

For the .015" thick dovetail saws I did saw all of them by hand.