Resawing with a Grizzly Bandsaw

[Glenn Samuels]

I have a 14" Extreme Model Bandsaw (G0555X) with the 6" booster so I can resaw up to 12" wood. The blade is a 3/4" with 3 tpi and it is a 3 HP unit. Lately, I have been resawing 8/4 african mahogany that is 10" wide. The pieces were approximately 72" long. Just put a new blade in but I still find it hard to push through and the blade seems to be wandering. The wood seems to be dragging across the metal bed. I have gone over all the setting so I think it is set correctly. Could I be asking for two much from this bandsaw? I am using a unit with magnets to try to keep the wood against the resaw fence. When I push, it actually starts to move the bandsaw on the floor. That is how much pressure I am using. I could at times cut the wood to 36" which would be easier to control but most times, I need the longer lengths. Please let me know your opinion. Thanks

[Rich Enders]

Glenn.

I recently resawed 7 1/2 inch African Mahogany (sapele) on a plain old Ridgid 14 inch using a 1/2 inch Wood Slicer blade. I don't know the HP, but it is probably less than half of what you have. My cut is 30% less than your cut, but mine was quite easy. You say your set-up has been checked, so I would increase the tension a bit, and if that does not work, then maybe try a different type of blade.

[Herr Dalbergia]

What kind of blade are you using? Manufacturer? Type?

Cheers, Alex

[glenn bradley]

Sometimes this is a matter of expectation. 1 or 2 inches per second of feed rate is pretty quick for 10" of cut. Are you trying for faster than this? Too much push can cause as many problems as a dull blade IMHO.

[Peter Quinn]

Are you using a fence? African mahogany can have a lot of tension in it, what thickness are you resawing? If its veneer I'm not sure what to tell you other than wax the table, recheck the set up. But if you are slicing thicker pieces out of 8/4 it could be bowing as it comes out which effectively makes the board thicker, so it pushes on the fence creating drag and in turn pushes back on the blade creating more drag, a rough cut and can make the blade wander off course. Carefully watch the kerf ahead of and behind the blade if the wood seems to be splaying out or pinching in behind the blade versus the regular kerf, it may be the wood. One solution is to use a unipoint fence so the wood can move after the cut, and you can make thin wedges or shingles to shove in the kerf to keep it open behind the cut as you go. This takes a bit more "english" or user input than simply holding a board tight to a fence, and it wont make the bowed or twisted stuff you can wind up with any more usable, but it solves the drag problem. I've had a board here and there nearly stop a 5HP minimax and a 3HP meber, so your saw is not the only possible answer.

[Andy Fox]

I am using a unit with magnets to try to keep the wood against the resaw fence. When I push, it actually starts to move the bandsaw on the floor. That is how much pressure I am using.

Maybe there is too much pressure here, which is causing too much friction? Is the stock thickness consistent? Maybe it widens or cups?

[Steve Menendez]

A dedicated resawing blade will have much lower set values than a "General Purpose" type of bandsaw blade. The lower set values will result in less resistance to cutting (less power required by the saw and less pushing power required by hand).

One of the Sawmillcreek site sponsors - sawbladeexpress.com offers an excellent resawing blade called the Xtra Edge. It is every bit as good, if not better, than the woodslicer blades, and is made in the USA. The woodslicers are imported, if that makes a difference to you.

In any event, a dedicated resawing blade is a bargain when considering the value of a piece of African Mahogany.

Steve

[Glenn Samuels]

This is the blade that I used: (T25045 Timber Wolf 105" x 3/4" x .025" x 2/3 TPI Pos Claw Bandsaw Blade (http://www.grizzly.com/products/105-x-3-4-x-025-x-2-3-TPI-Pos-Claw-Bandsaw-Blade/T25045) from Grizzly). Here is a continuation of the story. I was trying just to get (2) 15/16" boards from the 8/4 board. All 4 sides were rough. Probably should have jointed at least the bottom and maybe the side against the fence. I believe the fence is 6" high. I think I agree with Peter about the bowing. At the top of the board, I got a little variation but at the bottom, it was 3/4" and 1 1/4". Possibly the fence moved although I had a clamp next to it to try to avoid the situation. Obviously, I made some mistakes. Should I have jointed the 10" side? I would have had to hand joint it since my jointer is 8" wide. Let's see if these facts change anyone's opinion. Thanks,

[Peter Quinn]

Thats a good blade, bit too much for a 14" saw IMO, just because it fits doesn't mean the spring can give it enough tension, I used the 1/2" version when I had a 14" saw, but probably not the deciding factor in this equation. Rough boards against a fence for resaw is a no go, probably the source of much of your problem. You can flatten 10" on an 8" jointer using the rabbeting ledge, flatten the first 8", do the last 2" with a hand plane or jointing fence on a TS. Its actually pretty quick. At least you need a good edge to ride on, and in that case I'd mark a center line on the board and either resaw freehand or use a uni point fence, saw may have come with one, mine did, or you can make one easy enough using scrap plywood and a dowel. You should be able to resaw 10" of mahogany no problem on that saw. But honestly, unless you need a book match for some reason, or had the wood you needed to use, I'd skip the resaw and use 4/4 to begin with. Nearly impossible to split 8/4 for two useable pieces of 4/4 over much length on many boards. All that said, I've seen flattened and jointed 8/4 run against a fence release tension and stop a much bigger saw, so look out for that. African mahogany doesn't always behave very well, some has nasty interlocked grain with lots of tension trapped within, learning to read the boards and avoid the most likely to warp suspects is part of the game.

[Glenn Samuels]

This is excellent information. Thank you

[John TenEyck]

As mentioned, no CI 14" bandsaw can adequately tension a 3/4" wide blade. Actually, they can't even get a 1/2" wide blade up to the tension recommended by most blade manufacturers (18000 psi min.), but you can get enough tension on it to resaw well enough (around 12000 psi), if you use an Iturra spring. I regularly resaw 10"+ wide hardwoods on my 14" Delta with riser block using an Olson MVP 1/2", 3 tpi blade. A 1/2" wide Timberwolf blade should do pretty well, too, it just won't stay sharp near as long. I only have a 1.5 HP motor on my saw and it's more than adequate. As discussed, you have to start out with stock that's jointed flat on one face, and 90 degrees on one edge. Here's a photo of my simple set up with a 7" tall fence and feather board. I'm cutting white oak about 65" long into veneer about 0.090" thick.

292069

292070

The key to resawing with a fence is you have to get the blade to cut straight. For me, that means the wheels have to be co-planer above all else, and the blade has to be equally sharp on both sides and the set also has to be equal. With the blade centered on the upper wheel it should cut straight, but sometimes it takes a small tracking adjustment. If it won't cut straight with the fence set parallel with the miter slot forget it, you'll never get it to resaw straight and parallel with the fence even if you try to adjust for drift. Maybe some folks can, but it's never worked for me. Anyway, if the blade cuts straight you should have no trouble resawing most anything at a reasonable rate (maybe 5 - 10 feet/min) without having to push very hard. Pushing hard is a sign something is wrong and should be a warning sign because that's when something might go wrong and you get seriously hurt.

John

[Jim Finn]

I had this same problem with my GO555 when resawing 8"oak and maple. So I tried a 1/2" Woodslicer blade and it worked very well. It dulled quickly so I went to a 5/8" carbide blade I got from Grizzly. This blade works just as well and stays sharp 5 times longer. My saw has a 6" resaw fence and only one HP motor. I also resaw a lot of 8" cedar. I run the rough wood through the planer before resawing. I also joint the bottom edge.

[Thomas L. Miller]

Glenn,
I recently had trouble resawing domestic hardwoods (cheery and ash) with my 555x. I tried two 1/2 inch woodslicer blades and the saw would NOT cut straight. I almost screwed up a piece of 9" 8/4 cherry trying to make 1/8" drawer veneers . I've resawn 8" wood before and the saw did fine. I went through all the set up stuff I could find and to no avail. Long story short, I was in a "do loop" of adjusting the fence to the table and then trying to adjust the fence for drift. I finally sat and stared at the saw for about 30 minute and realized that the "reference surface" is actually the blade not the miter slot. I tracked the blade using Alex Snodgrass' method and then carefully squared the table TO THE BLADE. I then squared the fence to the table miter slot. The blade at the time was a 1/2 3tpi blade from Carter. I also reset my guides according to Alex's method. The results were fantastic. The saw cut beautifully with not even a hint of lugging. The cuts were almost jointer smooth and required only one pass over my jointer set at ~1mm cut depth. The resawn pieces were within a .002 of being the same thickness end to end and edge to edge. The pieces were 9" ash that was 50" long. I cut the veneers 3/16" thick. I think what happened in my case was I or someone else had grabbed the saw by the table to move it on the mobile base. The table became wonked enough to throw the whole thing saw set up off and I was just going through motions without really thinking about the problem. Hope this helps.
Tom

[Howard Acheson]

I'm a little confused. I have a Model #G0555X Grizzly bandsaw. It's called a 14" "Ultimate Model" and has a motor rated as a 1 HP motor. Do you really have a 3 HP motor on yours?

My saw does a a good and reasonably fast job when resawing. Even though the manual says the saw can use a 3/4" blade, almost all 14" band saws perform best with 1/2 wide resaw blades. You say you installed a new blade. Where you able to resaw effectively with your prior blade?

[Glenn Samuels]

Gentlemen, There is so much good information here that I don't know where to begin my thanks. I went back to basics and adjusted my table to be square with the blade. Then the fence to be square with the blade and parallel with the miter slot. I was slightly off co-planar but I made the adjustments. Cut a 42" long piece of 8/4 mahogany and it cut very straight. I should be good now.

[Curt Harms]

<snip>
African mahogany doesn't always behave very well, some has nasty interlocked grain with lots of tension trapped within, learning to read the boards and avoid the most likely to warp suspects is part of the game.

With misbehaving wood like that, would it be wise to use a fence whose outfeed ends at the blade? That way the sawn piece can go nuts without pushing the unsawn blank away from the fence. I suspect though I don't know that the 'carbide' blades from Grizzly are from Supercut. If so they're not Carbide in the usual sense in that they don't have brazed on teeth. They do work well and seem to stay sharp quite a while. Here's Supercut's resaw blades. I'm going to try one of the woodsaver blades next time I order a band saw blade. I haven't needed a new blade in a while. Did I mention that Supercut blades last pretty well? I have no idea how their prices compare to Grizzly.

http://supercutbandsaw.com/woodsaver.html

http://supercutbandsaw.com/hawcpro.html

[Glenn Samuels]

Opps, My error. My saw has a 1 1/2HP, not a 3. My last blade just dulled out and I didn't feel like sharpening all the teeth. I do sharpen my regular saws but this would be a bit much. No one at Grizzly told me that a 1/2" would be more appropriate. My last blade was also a 3/4" too and was listed as being appropriate in their manual. I think that my problem stemmed from moving and the bandsaw got jostled in the move. Now it is fine.

[Keith Hankins]

I'm coming late to the conversation, but I'll add my 2 cents. I've got the 17" griz, and I've used the timberwolfe blades They are great blades. However, once I stepped up to the laguna resawking it changed everything. They are very expensive but it's an entirely different beast. Also, call them and speak to someone in sales and mention you are a member here and you get a big discount. I had to learn a lot and had frustration in the beginning because I did not understand "drift" each blade is unique, so a set it once and forget it won't work. I suggest you go to their website and watch a great video on setting for drift. It was the best one I ever saw and their method works great. You also have to accept that some pieces of wood have a mind of their own and instead of using the high fience, I use the post method and guide the wood through to the line I mark with a scribe (usually for bookmatching). If I'm cutting veneers, I find the high fence and a well tuned blade for drift to work the best. The finish cut of the resaw king is the best I've experienced. They sharpen them as well. Best blade I've had. I've even purchased a second bandsaw and old 1934 Delta 14" i picked up for a couple hundred bucks. I keep a small blade on it for all my regular cuts and keep the 17" just for resaw because it's takes a while to get it tuned right so changing blades and doing all over is a PIA. Good luck and happy resawing!

My goal is to add the driftmaster fence to my BS that would be the ultimate!

[glenn bradley]

When I push, it actually starts to move the bandsaw on the floor.

Way too much feed pressure IMHO. If the drag is not being caused by the table not being slick and is actual cutting effort, the blade is shot; no matter how new it is, blades can be damaged. Just something to double check. Any time I feel the urge to lean into the stock in stead of simply feeding it through the operation I stop to see what is wrong. You present the material to the cutter and it cuts it. You continue to feed fresh stock forward and the cutter continues to cut. This should be pretty low effort unless a surface is rough or sticky. Leaning/forcing into a material feed operation is a recipe for an accident. The exception would be a very heavy piece of stock where sheer mass requires greater effort to move it, cutting or not. Again, just my approach to things.


This is the blade that I used: (T25045 Timber Wolf 105" x 3/4" x .025" x 2/3 TPI Pos Claw Bandsaw Blade (http://www.grizzly.com/products/105-x-3-4-x-025-x-2-3-TPI-Pos-Claw-Bandsaw-Blade/T25045) from Grizzly). Here is a continuation of the story. I was trying just to get (2) 15/16" boards from the 8/4 board. All 4 sides were rough. Probably should have jointed at least the bottom and maybe the side against the fence.

I have several of those blades as they are my usual resawing choice. I do run a 2HP, 17" saw and routinely resaw 8" to 10" walnut, maple, mahogany, pecan (murderously hard stuff), ash, etc.


That's a good blade, bit too much for a 14" saw IMO, just because it fits doesn't mean the spring can give it enough tension, I used the 1/2" version when I had a 14" saw, but probably not the deciding factor in this equation. Rough boards against a fence for resaw is a no go, probably the source of much of your problem.

I will use the bandsaw to rip material that is not face/edge milled when necessary but, I would never use a fence in this operation. The irregular reference surface tying to ride the nice flat fence causes difficulty. I always joint the face and one edge before resawing stock because I want a reliable reference surface for accuracy and agree with Peter's comments.

[John TenEyck]

All the 14" CI machine manuals say you can use a 3/4" wide blade, but in reality it cannot be tensioned adequately so it's worthless. As I said before, even the 1/2" cannot be tensioned close to what the blade manufacturers recommend, but you can get 10 - 12K psi on it which is adequate if you don't over feed it. I know this because I measured it.

292154

Of course, if the blade is dull nothing works.

John

[John TenEyck]

Accommodating blade drift may work, after a fashion, but I know you would be happier if you spent the time to adjust your machine and blade so there was no drift. It's not rocket science and everything just goes a lot more smoothly when the blade cuts straight. Then you could use a simple tall fence to resaw and cut veneer so straight and uniform you will be amazed.

John

[Peter Quinn]

With misbehaving wood like that, would it be wise to use a fence whose outfeed ends at the blade? That way the sawn piece can go nuts without pushing the unsawn blank away from the fence.


Yes, and also a fence whose infeed begins at the blade too. like this http://www.woodworking.com/ww/Article/Magnetic-Resaw-Fence-7228.aspx. I've made them using a piece of dowel rod, my 14" saw came with such a thing that quickly attached to the fence....course it wasn't the "ultimate" 14" BS, just the best.:rolleyes: Point is there are lots of ways to make such a fence, important feature is they touch the board just at the teeth of the blade, so the wood can move as it will. Not something I'd use for veneer, but excellent for splitting thick stock.

On the 3/4" blade, it may "fit" in the guides but the saw just can't crank it up tight enough to use it effectively. I like using a 3/4" blade on my 20" saw, but thats a whole lot more rigid frame. 1/2" seems to be the sweet spot on 14" saws.

On the adjust for drift vrs tune the entire saw to each blade method....I'm a drift man, but the saw is set up generally to be pretty close for the average blade I run. Suppose you throw on a 1" 2/3T resaw, align it properly on the wheels, tighten it up....it cuts a certain way. So now you adjust this to that, the table to blade, fence to table , moon to stars. Then change blades to a 5/16" 8T for cutting out plywood templates. And start over...table, fence, etc. With each new blade and tension requirement and wheel placement comes a new tuning. So how is that better?

[John Dougherty]

A lot of the cast-iron framed 14-inch saws are made in China and are very nearly identical regardless of branding. I have a Rigid that will accept Grizzly and Shop Fox accessories for instance. The differences lie chiefly in the motors and general fit, finish and pre-shipping detail work. I've resawn six-foot Honduran mahogany in 6-inch widths without trouble using a 1/2-inch 3 TPI Timber Wolf blade. Wider boards can lead to the blade heating and wandering so I tend to rip to width before resawing.

[Gus Dundon]

Do you have any references on what band speed to use for cutting wood? Speed range for cutting soft wood or hard wood? What about cutting Oak? Do you only use bi metal or carbide tipped blade for resawing?

[John TenEyck]

I don't have any references for blade speed, but do know that most 14" BS's run somewhere around 3100 fpm for wood cutting, while larger saws usually run at higher speed, say 3500 fpm. Industrial BS's run even faster. I have a multi step pulley on my BS, but leave it at about 3000 fpm for all wood cutting. I use Olson's MVP bi-metal blades for resawing. I'm not entirely happy with them; the cut is coarser than I'd like and two have broken prematurely. But they cut very well and I'll continue to use them until I find something better.

The problem with 14" wheels is you can't run a very thick blade; anything more than about 0.025" fails pretty quickly due to the stress caused by the difference in circumference between the side against the wheel and the outside. BS's with larger diameter wheels can run thicker blades with no higher bend stress. So a thin kerf blade would be a better choice on a 14" saw. You also would be able to achieve higher blade tension on a thinner blade which would help them track straight. Sounds good, but hasn't worked for me. I know the folks who make the Woodslicer blades claim they cut well, but my experience is they only work well in perfectly behaved wood, that is, wood that does not open or pinch at all as it is cut. In reality, most wood does move some as it's being cut, and I found the Woodslicer pretty useless when trying to resaw thick stock, and only marginally better cutting veneer. Too bad, because the cut quality was great. My take away is that thin kerf is nice, in theory, but in practical terms you need some kerf in order to let wood do what it wants to do because it's going to do it. Better to loose a little more in kerf losses than have the blade bind half way through a cut. So that leaves me back with blades using stock around 0.025" thick like the Olson MVP blades.

Carbide? I'm too cheap and sometimes cut wood that might have metal in it so I'd hate to trash a $150 blade. Plus, there aren't many made with 0.025" gage band stock, and none as far as I know in 1/2" width. With a cast iron 14" bandsaw a 1/2" x 0.025" blade is the largest that can be tensioned adequately. And remember, adequately means only about 12,000 psi, still far below the 18,000 psi minimum recommended by most blade manufacturers. The newer steel framed 14" bandsaws can adequately tension those 3/4" wide blades and I'd seriously think about a carbide tipped one if I owned one of them and was only cutting clear wood.

I hoped that helped some.

John

[Glenn Samuels]

Hi Tom,

I watched the video and found it quite interesting. The only problem that I found is that he likes the deepest part of the gullet to be centered on the wheel. When I do it, the back of the blade scratches the back of the channel that runs between the 2 wheels. I have to move the blade forward to avoid the scratching. Maybe that's why going with a 3/4" blade is too wide.
Thanks,
Glenn

[Thomas L. Miller]

Glenn,
I tried a 3/4 inch blade. I couldn't get it to work and now the widest I'll use is a 1/2 inch. The 555x seems to do great with that size blade. I've tried woodslicer blades, but they seem to dull rather quickly. Getting the blade gullet centered on the crown makes sense when you think about it. Like Alex said in the video, it doesn't seem like a good idea to have the teeth unsupported. I'm not going to get a larger bandsaw. I don't have the room and honestly don't use a bandsaw a great deal. It's nice when you need it though. I have a Sawstop ICS I use for most things like ripping and cross cutting. I will say, that ripping a big unruly piece of wood on a bandsaw is much easier than having it twist up on you using a table saw; even a Sawstop. I do like my 555x now that I've got the resaw issue fixed. I'm kind of embarrassed it took me some time and some ruined pieces of wood to figure out, though.

[Curt Harms]

Carbide? I'm too cheap and sometimes cut wood that might have metal in it so I'd hate to trash a $150 blade. Plus, there aren't many made with 0.025" gage band stock, and none as far as I know in 1/2" width. With a cast iron 14" bandsaw a 1/2" x 0.025" blade is the largest that can be tensioned adequately. And remember, adequately means only about 12,000 psi, still far below the 18,000 psi minimum recommended by most blade manufacturers. The newer steel framed 14" bandsaws can adequately tension those 3/4" wide blades and I'd seriously think about a carbide tipped one if I owned one of them and was only cutting clear wood.

I hoped that helped some.

John

Well, here's a well regarded carbide blade - Trimaster 1/2" .025" band 3 T.P.I. from Spectrum Supply. 'Tain't cheep though. I priced one for a Rikon 10-325 - 111" or 9' 4". $139 w/free shipping.

https://02c4de5.netsolstores.com/cart.aspx

[John TenEyck]

Well, here's a well regarded carbide blade - Trimaster 1/2" .025" band 3 T.P.I. from Spectrum Supply. 'Tain't cheep though. I priced one for a Rikon 10-325 - 111" or 9' 4". $139 w/free shipping.

https://02c4de5.netsolstores.com/cart.aspx

Thanks for that Curt. Maybe I'll give one a try after I finish with the Olson MVP blades. One nice thing about the Olson blades is that I can resharpen them myself. It's a rather tedious process, but not very hard. I use my chainsaw grinder and the blade cuts better than new afterwards. No joke. I had a brand new 1/2" MVP blade and it just would not cut straight no matter what I did, and it seemed like the teeth were not as sharp on one side as the other. In desperation I decided to resharpen the blade. It cut perfectly straight afterwards. So it's nice to be able to resharpen it; on the other hand, it would be even nicer if I didn't have to. Another reason I'm not in love with the Olson blades. Thanks again.

John

[Curt Harms]

Thanks for that Curt. Maybe I'll give one a try after I finish with the Olson MVP blades. One nice thing about the Olson blades is that I can resharpen them myself. It's a rather tedious process, but not very hard. I use my chainsaw grinder and the blade cuts better than new afterwards. No joke. I had a brand new 1/2" MVP blade and it just would not cut straight no matter what I did, and it seemed like the teeth were not as sharp on one side as the other. In desperation I decided to resharpen the blade. It cut perfectly straight afterwards. So it's nice to be able to resharpen it; on the other hand, it would be even nicer if I didn't have to. Another reason I'm not in love with the Olson blades. Thanks again.

John

You're welcome. Personally I don't see me ever buying one of those. They may make sense for someone that works with really hard or abrasive wood. I think my sweet spot is like yours, Bimetal. Supercut offers bimetal as well as their 'carbide' blades so I asked them which would stay sharper longer. Their reply was that it depends on what you're cutting. I didn't pursue it beyond the one question.

[lowell holmes]

Glen,

You can sharpen a bandsaw blade on the saw with a dremel tool in less than 15 minutes. You should try it, it can save your bacon at times.:)

Currently, my favorite blade on my 14" Jet is a 1/2" X 105" 3tpi skip tooth blade. The blade is from Highland Woodworking.

It is sharp, tracks well and has no vices.

[Glenn Samuels]

Glen,

You can sharpen a bandsaw blade on the saw with a dremel tool in less than 15 minutes. You should try it, it can save your bacon at times.:)

Currently, my favorite blade on my 14" Jet is a 1/2" X 105" 3tpi skip tooth blade. The blade is from Highland Woodworking.

It is sharp, tracks well and has no vices.


Hi Lowell,

I do need to pick up a dremel. I'm probably that last person alive who does not own one. What type of file like attachment do you use for the dremel? I have lots of hand files for my hand saws but the thought of filing all those teeth by hand gives my nightmares.
Thanks

[lowell holmes]

A small cylinder shaped grind stone (1/8"?) will do. You just sharpen the inside of the hook, only touching it with the stone. The hooks on the blade will be razor sharp.
Just rest your forearm on the table and present the stone to the inside of the hook. After you touch it, withdraw the cylinder, rotate the wheel to the next hook and repeat.
If you mess up a blade, it was already messed up, but I doubt that you will.

Safety glasses are a requirement for this exercise.

I have a pair of safety glasses that are bifocals like drugstore readers that I use every time I go into the shop, along with hearing protection.