My first plane need advise.

[Raymond Kong]

Hi, I'm new to the forums and new to woodworking. I been looking for a #5 stanley block plane on ebay and was wondering if anyone can look at the pictures and tell me if it's good to bid on or not. Thanks in advance.

[Jerry Thompson]

A #5 would be a jack plane. I have always stuck with Stanley-Baily planes. Read up on how to refurbish hand planes and go to Blood & Gore they have all the planes you could ever wanr described there.
It is a disease with no known cure.

[george wilson]

You can find them screwed to the walls of some folksy decorated restaurants as coat hooks. You can buy what's left of them for only $395.00 a pair(If I recall correctly!!!:)).

Email Patrick Leach and get on his mailing list. Also do the same to MJD auctions(but,don't count on MJD to REMEMBER your bid,and sell it cheaper to someone else,OR to pack it securely). Really,this is true.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I have also had one or two minor issues with MJD auctions, but I will say when I pointed out to Martin an error in his description, he was quick to refund all money I was out, including shipping. If I'm not mistaken, that problem was an A6 that had a hang hole drilled in it, but not evident in pictures and not mentioned in the text.

[Sean Hughto]

I ... was wondering if anyone can look at the pictures and tell me if it's good to bid on or not. Thanks in advance.

Yes. PM me any numbers and I'll give you my honest opinion.

[Mel Miller]

[QUOTE=
Email Patrick Leach and get on his mailing list. Also do the same to MJD auctions(but,don't count on MJD to REMEMBER your bid,and sell it cheaper to someone else,OR to pack it securely). Really,this is true.[/QUOTE]

I know both Leach and Martin Donnelly. Several years ago, after a big run in with Leach I said "no more Leach". You can do much better on Ebay looking for a common plane like a #5.
On the other hand, I have bought many things from Martin privately as well as thru his auctions, and never had a bad experience. That's why I'm gradually sending parts of my collection to Martin to sell for me.

[Sean Hughto]

I know both Leach and Martin Donnelly. Several years ago, after a big run in with Leach I said "no more Leach". You can do much better on Ebay looking for a common plane like a #5.

Mel, I have to object to you running down Patrick without any specifics. Everyone has their own experiences with folks, and I've no doubt you have your reasons for being dissatisfied. My personal experiences with Patrick over many many years have all been completely positive. He describes his tools accurately, will look for tools that he has but hasn't listed if you have a specific request, will send tools first and trust you to send the check when you receive it, and so on. He provided me with a beautiful users 7 and 5 1/2 almost twenty years ago now when I was just starting out with handplanes. He has sold me chisels, a great knuckle block, carving tools, and on and on. He is trustworthy and his prices are fair. While it may be that cheaper 5's can be found on eBay, that hardly says anything about his prices as a dealer who finds the tool and vouches for it's condition etc.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I have to agree with Sean, and over the past decade have gotten to know Patrick quite well and he has always dealt straight up with me. I have purchased from his list and I have also sent him my "wants/needs" and his prices have been very fair and condition honest. Now with that said, everyone can make a mistake and Leach offers no question returns on the goods shipped, if you don't feel they meet the described criteria.

The old tool market is very unique in that there are many dealers, such as Patrick Leach and Joshua Clark that ship tools to whoever on "Old Tool Terms". This means they ship you the tools and if you like to tool, you mail payment. If you don't like the tool, you return the tool.

[Mel Miller]

Mel, I have to object to you running down Patrick without any specifics. Everyone has their own experiences with folks, and I've no doubt you have your reasons for being dissatisfied. My personal experiences with Patrick over many many years have all been completely positive. He describes his tools accurately, will look for tools that he has but hasn't listed if you have a specific request, will send tools first and trust you to send the check when you receive it, and so on. He provided me with a beautiful users 7 and 5 1/2 almost twenty years ago now when I was just starting out with handplanes. He has sold me chisels, a great knuckle block, carving tools, and on and on. He is trustworthy and his prices are fair. While it may be that cheaper 5's can be found on eBay, that hardly says anything about his prices as a dealer who finds the tool and vouches for it's condition etc.

I'm not going to get into specifics in a public forum. Let me just say it was a whole lot more than dissatisfaction with a single tool.
I notice you didn't object to George's bad review of MJD?

[Sean Hughto]

I notice you didn't object to George's bad review of MJD?

Don't think I saw it. Was it vague and ad hominem, like yours? Cause if so, I would object to that too.

As far as MJD service and prices, I can't speak to it, as I've never bought anything from them.

I've never met Patrick and have no personal or financial connection to him.

[Jim Koepke]

Raymond,

Welcome to the Creek. Your location isn't indicated in your profile. You may live near a member who would be willing to let you spend some bench time with various planes so you know what they can do.


Yes. PM me any numbers and I'll give you my honest opinion.

I will offer the same as long as you remember it is just my opinion.

You might enjoy a few old posts:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?148076-Getting-Started-With-Hand-Planes

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?116419-Planes-and-a-Few-Things-to-Look-For

(even with everything in that thread there is still ways that some dealers will hide things.)

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?114373-Fettling-A-Plane-from-Junker-to-Jointer

And for when you really run out of reading material:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?103805-Neanderthal-wisdom-FAQs

jtk

[Raymond Kong]

Sean, helped me out by giving me great advice. Thank you everyone else.

Jim, I will have take my time looking through those links.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

First, decide what you are willing to spend money on and understand the cost, advantages, and disadvantages when purchased new. I was so overwhelmed and frightened by all that I had read when I needed my first hand plane (to fix a problem with a door), that I purchased the only thing that I could find at the time that I expected would work right out of the box; a lie nielsen #4 hand plane. For example:

This Lie Nielsen is $325. It will work out of the box, everything will be sunshine and lollipops, the adjustments will work well, and, although you can sharpen it a bit, you could use it as received.
http://www.lie-nielsen.com/standard-bench-planes/no.-5-jack-plane/

There, I just set an upper limit on what you should spend.

I will admit that I have never used a low angle jack plane, some people seem to love them, some people hate them, but, you can get a low angle jack plane here for $250.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=49708&cat=1,41182,48944

I can't comment on quality or setup on the Wood River brand, but, I think that there intent was to compete with the higher end products but without as much attention to detail, fit, finish, or usability. I am not saying that they are junk, just that they are not likely to be as well done or ready to go as the others I have mentioned so far $170.
http://www.woodcraft.com/product/2021170/29726/woodriver-5-bench-hand-plane-v3.aspx

So, what scared me about purchasing a new plane? It looked to me like I needed to "lap the bottom" of the plane to make sure it was flat. Well, OK, now I consider that to be lower on my list of priorities, but, if you want to try that, then you probably need to get a role of sand paper and something large and flat to affix it to.

The old used hand planes that I have purchased on ebay or have been given have been a mixed bag. The back of the plane blade has generally been in bad shape, so, you will need something that allows you to flatten the back of the blade. Many here use sand paper. You can certainly avoid some of this by simply purchasing a new blade and cap iron that is mostly ready to go for an extra $70. So, you roll the dice, see if the blade and cap iron are in really bad shape, and, if so, then just buy a replacement. If everything else works well, and if the price is low enough, then you spend the extra money and you can do less work (but lose more money).
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=66868&cat=1,41182

If you post in the correct place on the forum, you can say flat out, "hey, any of you members have one that you will sell me ready to go?". A member here will likely be up front as to what is good and/or bad about their plane. I know that I have had very good luck here anyway.

So, decide how much work you are comfortable doing yourself and how much you would need help with. If you were about 2000 miles closer to where I live (middle of Ohio), I would say "come on over and try a few to see the difference". My Lie Nielsen is very easy to adjust and use. My very old #5 is a bit persnickety to adjust just right to get what I want (but it cost me much less). A local expert once said something like "that is my special #4 that I have adjusted to exactly how I want it, the other guys in the shop know that they cannot touch or use it". I assumed, but did not ask, that the plane in question took some fiddling to get how he wanted it.

If you will be looking on ebay, then read some of the descriptions to see what they say. If a seller seems to be selling a lot of planes that he reconditioned and he has a bunch of good feed back and describes how he did it, odds are good that he knows what he is doing.... but these sellers usually charge a premium (they do have to recoup something for their time).

Perhaps you should ask if there is a creeker local to you who can guide you through the tune-up process. If push comes to shove, and you are simply unsure what to do with a blade tune-up (ie, you get stuck), since it is your first hand plane, I am willing to look at the blade / ship breaker for you, but you will lose more than a week mailing it to me, having me look at it, and sending it back.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

Yes. PM me any numbers and I'll give you my honest opinion.

And definitely take Sean up on his offer. Having a knowledgeable person offer their opinion, although not a guarantee, greatly increases the chance that you will not go wrong! <tip hat to Sean>.

[Paul McGaha]

I bought a 5 1/2 from Patrick Leach last year.

I'm happy with the transaction and I'd buy from him again.

PHM

[Zach Dillinger]

For what it's worth, I've had nothing but stellar service from MJD, Patrick Leach, and my personal favorite Lee Richmond. I wouldn't hesitate to buy from any of them at any time.

[Raymond Kong]

Are all these people that everyone is mentioning on this forum? How do I contact them? Do I just send them an PM or what?

[Jim Koepke]

Are all these people that everyone is mentioning on this forum? How do I contact them? Do I just send them an PM or what?

Some of them are listed in the first link I posted for you.

Some of them you may have to search with Google, Bing or whatever your favorite search engine might be.

There are a lot of good people who deal in antique/used tools. There are also a few charlatans who overcharge or misrepresent some have web sites, some use ebay.

When you look at prices for someone like Patrick Leach, remember they have to make a profit on what they sell. Just like many of us the scour yard sales, flea markets and whatever other source they can find. They spend a lot of time (and money) looking for items they can sell.

If you want it now, buy from a reputable dealer.

If you have patience study what you are interested in buying and bid carefully on ebay or inspect thoroughly in person at yard sales, antique stores and such.

With a bit of study and a practiced eye you will begin to notice the back end of a type 11 Stanley/Bailey plane sticking out from under a pile of debris.

You will also save a lot of money by not falling for a load of bull about how rare a #4 plane might be.

jtk

[Tony Zaffuto]

For what it's worth, I've had nothing but stellar service from MJD, Patrick Leach, and my personal favorite Lee Richmond. I wouldn't hesitate to buy from any of them at any time.

I would concur, but add Josh Clark/Hyper Kitten. Josh has tools that may be a bit closer to users than to collectors, but of any of the names mentioned, if you contact them, they may have and sell said item, those it is not listed on their websites.

Lee Richmond's site is "The Best Things" and I have bought as many new tools from him, as used. Terrific prices on new tools. I also have to add one I have never bought from and that is Jon Zimmer. For Father's Day, I received a Stanley #39 3/4" dado plane that, except for some honing marks on the blade, looks like the day it came off the assembly line, with 100% japanning and bright grinding. Wife said it was sold "used, showing wear", but there are many dealers that would have marked this as "as new".

[Andrew Pitonyak]

You asked about a #5, and this is not a #5, but, just the same, I assume that you do look here as well:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?218828-Stanley-4-1-2C-nice-55-plus-shipping

[Daniel Rode]

I bought a router plane from Jon a couple months back. We traded a couple of emails and it arrived exactly as pictured. No complaints here.

I'd been looking for a router plane on ebay for a while and the prices for the condition I wanted were way too high. Even so, I probably paid a bit more buying from a dealer but I got the tool I wanted in exactly the condition I needed without waiting weeks or months to find an eBay deal. Sometimes it's worth a couple extra dollars.

I also have to add one I have never bought from and that is Jon Zimmer.

[Winton Applegate]

gets hopelessly out of hand . . .
again . . .

:eek:

:)

:p

No don't bid on it.
Just get one of these

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=51870&cat=1,41182,52515

Shop time is too precious to fart around. Do you want to spend your time breaking and training the horse or do you want to get to town and go to work ?

I'm just saying . . .

[don wilwol]

http://timetestedtools.wordpress.com/tools-for-sale-2/