Another question for the computer/wifi/tech savvy...

[Mark Bolton]

I have been struggling for the past several weeks with brutally slow wireless speeds at my shop. Speed tests frequently come back with pings of 90-125ms or better and download speeds of like .6 megs. I have a 3 meg account with Frontier. I take the laptop home to my GF's house at night and with her faster connection get speed tests of perhaps 17megs or better.

Thinking this was something on Frontiers end I caught one of their tech's next door (they have a switching building 10' from my shop) and he came over with his laptop and over wireless got 3.5 megs on his speed test. For the heck of it I hard wired my laptop into the router and also got 3 megs. Back to wireless and Im pokey-joe.

So Im now piddling away at this again and scratching my head....

Thinking:
1. Laptop is several years old, wireless adapter going bad? But that doesnt make sense given the speeds at GF's house...

2. Some issue with my laptop/malware/etc? Have run several scans with Spybot Search and Destroy, AVG, and so on all coming up clean..

3. Thought perhaps deleting that network connection and re-setting it up may help,.. no dice.

Oddly today when I got in, immediately after starting up the computer I ran a test and got nearly 3 megs wirelessly but then it soon petered off. This got me wondering if the Frontier Tech's test was a fluke as well as he just walked in, tested, and walked out.

Anyone have any guesses?

[Bryan Rocker]

There are a couple of issues that could be hurting your connection.

1. Interference such as 2.4 megaherts cordless phones
2. Physical issues between you and your router,
3. A mismatch between your signal types.

What type of router do you have and what is the signal you are using?

[Robert LaPlaca]

Brian offered some good suggestions, one other suggestion is make sure that the driver for your wireless adapter in your laptop is update to the most current version that your wireless adapter vendor or your computer hardware manufacturer offers, you would be surprised at the junk that Microsoft supplies with their OS..

A Router/Access point firmware update might be a good second place to try if the wireless driver update doesn't make the issue any better..

[Mark Bolton]

Thanks Bryan,
The phones and physical issues are not there. No wireless and router is in the same room as the laptop.

The router is a router/modem supplied by Frontier. Gigaset SE567 I believe.

The odd thing is this comes and goes which again makes one think of the ISP however tablets, phones, and so on, dont seem to be affected. I cant honestly say I have had another laptop in here for a prolonged period of time... perhaps thats a next step.

[Dan Hintz]

Are the pings just slow, or are they being missed, too? Missed/unanswered pings generally mean a weak connection. If they're not being missed but are slow, that's an entirely different matter and is caused elsewhere... a higher-power connection isn't going to solve that.

[Stephen Tashiro]

I don't know what software you are using to do ping, but the version I use in Linux reports an error rate, which is helpful. There are also commands to trace the various hops a packet does between source and destination. I don't know what Windows commands are available.

[Dave Sheldrake]

tracert at the command prompt

cheers

Dave

[Robert LaPlaca]

tracert at the command prompt

cheers

Dave

Holly molly, 90 -125ms is a lot of latency, wonder where in the heck we are pinging to Los Angles?

[Jim Matthews]

I recently upgraded to the latest AC spec router from Netgear.
With an adapter for the remote laptop, we're right at the limitation
from our provider - no induced lag.

http://www.netgear.com/home/products/networking/wifi-adapters/a6200.aspx

You'll need a dual band router to make the most of the connection,
but it's sensitive, fast and a USB connected device.

If you upgrade your laptop, it can be easily installed.

My suspicion is the laptop's internal modem is running flat out,
and no longer has the juice to keep up.

[Curt Harms]

How reliable is your power? When it comes to electronics, too reliable is not good IMO. Removing power, waiting a minute and plugging it back in can cure a multitude of ills. If your laptop wifi hardware were a problem, I wouldn't expect it to work well at your G.F.s house. That your laptop works as expected when connected via ethernet says Frontier seems to be doing their part. Here is what I'd try:

1) Unplug the router and power down the laptop. Wait a minute or two and restart both. No help?

2) Do a hard reset on the router. There's typically a small recessed button on the back that you push with a pen or something. You may need to hold this for a few seconds. CAUTION: This will reset the router to the state it was in when you received it. Make sure you know any usernames, passwords, special settings before pushing the button. Encryption may be disabled and your wifi connection will have a different name after it restarts. Check the connection again.

3) Try to refresh the drivers for your onboard wifi adapter. I think you could do this via control panel/device manager. When I reinstall Windows, I typically just download the driver for the wifi device and avoid the manufacturer supplied Utilities. Less complexity is better.

4) The next step might be a little complex depending on your router's user interface. You could try disabling N speed, typically done while logged onto the router. Oftentimes there's a 'wireless' tab with settings for speed(b,g,n), encryption type(none, WEP, WPA, WPA2) etc. G speed is 54 mb./sec., more than adequate for your broadband speed.

5) Buy a USB wifi adapter and install that. You can find perfectly functional adapters for less than $20. I've had good luck with Tenda W311MI and Edimax EW7811UN. Both are small and don't stick out more than 1/2", more like 1/4" for the Edimax.

Unless your wifi signal is pretty marginal, you don't need the latest 802.11AC wizbang for a 3 Mb. connection.

[Matt Meiser]

That sounds like the poor service I regularly saw from Frontier. One minute I would get what I was supposed to (close to 6 at first then they re-provisioned me at 3 because of "problems") then it would get similar speeds. Part of the problem was that they way oversold capacity here but part of the problem was somewhere out on Frontier's network. Toward the end I was seeing frequent outages where the modem reported I was connected at full speed to the local terminal meaning the problem was out beyond that. Our fastest speeds were early morning. There's 3 or 4 local businesses on the same terminal and once they got in things slowed. When the kids got home from school, more, and in the evening when everyone was on it would start breaking down.

Another thing--Frontier likes to use their internally hosted speed test because it hides the problems that exist out on their network. What are you using and what did the Frontier tech use?

If rebooting the router does the trick, you might consider trying it on a UPS. Perhaps the voltage fluctuation starting machines is problematic.

[Ole Anderson]

I struggle with some of the same problems. Wired I get 57 down, wireless, 15 feet from the router, I get 50 sometimes, other times 20 and sometimes I get a "page won't load" message. Right now I am getting 5.01 down 11.76 up. When is the last time you saw twice the speed on up vs down? Very frustrating.
291119
a minute later wired up: 291120

Edit: I called Comcast and he verified that my wireless was working properly, but he changed the channel it was transmitting on and when tested it was now working at 38 down, a subsequent test hours later showed it had slowed to 16, still not bad but still not right.

[Dave Sheldrake]

Remember most isps have contention ratios, if there is 500 meg available over XX number of users the speed will be affected by how many people are using it and at what distance from the exchange.

cheers

Dave

[Curt Harms]

I struggle with some of the same problems. Wired I get 57 down, wireless, 15 feet from the router, I get 50 sometimes, other times 20 and sometimes I get a "page won't load" message. Right now I am getting 5.01 down 11.76 up. When is the last time you saw twice the speed on up vs down? Very frustrating.
291119
a minute later wired up: 291120

Edit: I called Comcast and he verified that my wireless was working properly, but he changed the channel it was transmitting on and when tested it was now working at 38 down, a subsequent test hours later showed it had slowed to 16, still not bad but still not right.

I've gotten weird results from speedtest.net sometimes. For one thing, selecting different servers can yield much different results. Perhaps try this and see how your results compare:

http://speakeasy.net/speedtest/

While imperfect I find speakeasy more consistent than speedtest.net. I too have seen cases where the upload speed was equal to or exceeds download speed. We normally have 25 down 5 up. In my case it might have been a flaky speed test result or flaky wifi driver. This reminds me of why I prefer wired over wireless when practical.

[Matt Meiser]

You don't have an old 802.11b device on your network, do you? Unless you have a dual-band access point, you'll only get as fast as your slowest device.

[Mark Bolton]

Thanks for all the input guys. I have been so swamped with work I havent had a chance to peck away at this but today I am finally picking away at it a bit.

This seems to either be something with regards to my laptop, wifi adapter, but the perplexing part is still the laptop performing well other than when at this location.

To re-cap some of the questions off the top of my head...

- I have done the unplug the router (power and so on) with no gain
- I recently did a hard reset on the router and input all data from scratch (with frontier support)
- Power issues dont seem to be an issue
- Speed testing using Ookla (speedtest.net)
- I also downloaded the Ookla app on my Galaxy S5 and it consistently shows 3megs or better but for instance a test while im writting this showed a 16ms ping (location in my state) and finished with a 1.35meg average. Test immediately following that on the phone showed 3.09

I had leaned towards Matt's conclusion that its a Frontier issue but I have a suspicion its something to do with my laptop though I dont have another laptop to try at this location.

Sorry for the delay in responding, being busy isnt fun at times :o

[Mark Bolton]

My latest results as of today..

So I checked into the modem/router firmware update, frontier doesnt allow that. There is a firmware version listed but no way to update. Checking on the net for the unit I have this seems to be the general conclusion.

All day the speeds/access have been pitiful on my laptop though the speed tests on the phone remain relatively consistent (good). This is with data shutoff on the phone (wifi only). I still just find it odd as the phone seems to be able to run on the modem without issue.

I have been searching for new drivers for the wifi adapter on the laptop (a broadcom 4322AG) but the ones I find specific to the machine windows says I have the current driver but still looking.

So here at the end for the heck of it I tether my S5 to the computer via cable and get 1.8 or so on a speed test. Then I set the phone up as a wifi hotspot and consistently get 2.5 megs or better on the laptop.

I just swear there is something with "this" laptop at "this" location that is tripping things up and I dont think its signal/site based.

My gut feeling all along has been some sort of malware or software issue but today I ran the laptop in safemode with networking and had the same slow speeds via the frontier modem. I opened up the wifi cover and checked to make sure the antenna was seated well. But again, it runs flawlessly on wifi at my GF's and here via hotspot on the phone. Today I also ran CCleaner and corrected any registry issues, ran spybot search and destroy with only cookies/cache being cleaned, AVG scan comes back clean.

Out of desperation I even tried changing the SSID on the modem/router and setting up a new location on the computer and nothing changed.

Now whats a bit funny is as I am sitting here writting this (on large external monitor) I have the "connect to network" dialog box open on the laptop screen and that connection (my shop) periodically drops off the available wireless connections list. At just a few seconds ago the shop connection popped back up but say "the capabilities of your network adapter do not match the requirements of this network", which has since changed to "security-enabled network". Gets me wondering if the router/modem is the problem but I just dont see it on the phone because im only on it briefly and additionally I have smart switch on the phone which supposedly optimizes data between wifi and cellular.

Its becoming quite the challenge to figure out.

I have a frontier switch building right next to me and Im about ready to ask one of the guys if he will just swap out my modem as a trial but not sure whats possible without a work order... we will see.

[Jerome Stanek]

It could be the laptop wireless adapter is bad. If it is a B, G, N and the G is bad and you router is B, G and your GF is N

[David Masters]

Just going through the pieces of information you've given so far.

1. At GF's house the laptop gets speed tests of perhaps 17megs or better.

This tells me that your laptop wireless hardware and drivers are fine.

2. Hard wired my laptop into the router and also got 3 megs.

This tells me that the problem is not in Frontier's network. It also points me to a problem in the router's wireless settings or interference with a neighbor's router. I'd look for one of the free stumbler utilities and do a scan of available wireless networks around your shop. If your neighbor's router is using channel 6, I'd change your router to use channel 1 or 11. The stumbler utility should also show you the signal strength that is coming off your router, which should help with #6.

3. Have run several scans with Spybot Search and Destroy, AVG, and so on all coming up clean.

Doesn't sound like a malware problem to me given that the laptop performs well when cabled to the router and while at your GF's house.

4. Galaxy S5 consistently shows 3megs or better.

Was the Galaxy using the cellular network or WiFi from router and in the same location? If the Galaxy was not using the cellular network and you did the speed test from the same location as the laptop, I would look at the MTU parameter in the TCP settings for the wireless network adapter, and match that to the MTU setting in your router. The default MTU size for Windows is 1500, but if the laptop's MTU setting exceeds the MTU setting for the network, performance will degrade as every TCP packet will have to be split. I assume that the MTU setting in your router's Ethernet settings is compatible with Frontier's network, since you are getting good performance there. Try a setting less than 1500 in your laptop wireless adapter settings (maybe 1365 as a test) and see if performance increases.

5. Changed the SSID on the modem/router and setting up a new location on the computer and nothing changed.

SSID doesn't effect performance. It is just a way to identify the wireless network.

6. Connection (my shop) periodically drops off the available wireless connections list. At just a few seconds ago the shop connection popped back up but say "the capabilities of your network adapter do not match the requirements of this network".

Would like to dig here a little more. Where is the router in relation to the laptop? I can't tell from your note whether the router is in the shop or a different part of the house. What would you judge the distance to be? How does this differ on the relationship between the router and the laptop when you're at your GF's house? I ask because your laptop Wi-Fi antenna might be limited. You could be at max distance or the signal might be weakened enough as it passes through building materials. You might also check router's antenna configuration for problems. I find that if a router is placed on a higher floor and nearly overhead, the antenna is not optimal to broadcast in that direction. Depends on the router. Look for that stumbler utility and see what the signal strength is from the laptop (and if possible see if there is a utility for the Galaxy).

Last, Matt is correct that a 802.11b device will slow all devices on a 802.11g network. However, 802.11b is rated at 11 Mb, which is still faster than the 3 Mb you're trying to achieve.

Dave

[Mark Bolton]

David, First, thanks for taking so much time. The wonders of SMC... I have noted in your text below....


Just going through the pieces of information you've given so far.

1. At GF's house the laptop gets speed tests of perhaps 17megs or better.

This tells me that your laptop wireless hardware and drivers are fine.

Speed test sitting here prior to writing this at GF's comes in at 18megs

2. Hard wired my laptop into the router and also got 3 megs.

This tells me that the problem is not in Frontier's network. It also points me to a problem in the router's wireless settings or interference with a neighbor's router. I'd look for one of the free stumbler utilities and do a scan of available wireless networks around your shop. If your neighbor's router is using channel 6, I'd change your router to use channel 1 or 11. The stumbler utility should also show you the signal strength that is coming off your router, which should help with #6.

Will look into this. There are only two neighbors at the shop (three counting the Frontier switching building next to the shop) but none of them ever appear as an available network on the laptop in the office. Occasionally if I am at the far end of the building I will get one neighbor popping up on my phone.

3. Have run several scans with Spybot Search and Destroy, AVG, and so on all coming up clean.

Doesn't sound like a malware problem to me given that the laptop performs well when cabled to the router and while at your GF's house.

4. Galaxy S5 consistently shows 3megs or better.

Was the Galaxy using the cellular network or WiFi from router and in the same location? If the Galaxy was not using the cellular network and you did the speed test from the same location as the laptop, I would look at the MTU parameter in the TCP settings for the wireless network adapter, and match that to the MTU setting in your router. The default MTU size for Windows is 1500, but if the laptop's MTU setting exceeds the MTU setting for the network, performance will degrade as every TCP packet will have to be split. I assume that the MTU setting in your router's Ethernet settings is compatible with Frontier's network, since you are getting good performance there. Try a setting less than 1500 in your laptop wireless adapter settings (maybe 1365 as a test) and see if performance increases.

When I did the speed tests with the Galaxy I shut off cellular data thinking it would test across the wireless connection. My thought was if it was an intermittent issue with frontier I may have never seen it via the phone because normally my cellular data is on and I have smart switch enabled which I assumed causes the phone to optimize data from the best source.

Will do on the MTU as soon as I get to the shop.

5. Changed the SSID on the modem/router and setting up a new location on the computer and nothing changed.

SSID doesn't effect performance. It is just a way to identify the wireless network.

Just a monkey beating on a transmission with a whiffle ball bat attempt at a fix :)

6. Connection (my shop) periodically drops off the available wireless connections list. At just a few seconds ago the shop connection popped back up but say "the capabilities of your network adapter do not match the requirements of this network".

Would like to dig here a little more. Where is the router in relation to the laptop? I can't tell from your note whether the router is in the shop or a different part of the house. What would you judge the distance to be? How does this differ on the relationship between the router and the laptop when you're at your GF's house? I ask because your laptop Wi-Fi antenna might be limited. You could be at max distance or the signal might be weakened enough as it passes through building materials. You might also check router's antenna configuration for problems. I find that if a router is placed on a higher floor and nearly overhead, the antenna is not optimal to broadcast in that direction. Depends on the router. Look for that stumbler utility and see what the signal strength is from the laptop (and if possible see if there is a utility for the Galaxy).

The shop is a commercial building, the router is in the front office room which is where the laptop/desk is at the moment. Same room, 15' apart, no obstructions. At GF's its a small house, laptop works anywhere in the house, second floor, first, outside, router/modem is in kitchen. Separated by a wall or two and a single floor at most.

Last, Matt is correct that a 802.11b device will slow all devices on a 802.11g network. However, 802.11b is rated at 11 Mb, which is still faster than the 3 Mb you're trying to achieve.

Dave

Second speed test prior to reply @ 17.9

Will see what I get at the shop.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

Do you know what channel your wireless router is using and what else is using that same channel? On my Android phone, I use something called "Wifi Analyzer" that will show me the wireless routers using specific frequencies. Might be useful to see if there is interference

Note that you may be connecting on 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz

Are you able to ping your wireless router? If pinging your wireless router is slow that will be instructive. Also, as already mentioned, the trace route command is useful to show you where the connection is slow since it should show you each hop.

[Mark Bolton]

MTU is at 1500 for wireless, lan, and bluetooth.

Loop back pseudo interface 1 is at 4294967295

Router/modem is on channel 1. Ive not clearly found how to set the channel on the wireless adapter at this point

[Mark Bolton]

Wow,
I dont want to speak too soon, and we'll see how it goes for the remainder of the day, but...

I downloaded the WifiAnalyzer app to my phone and while standing over at the router (by the front door to the shop) I could see only my signal, very strong, 2.4 Ghz on channel 1. I had the laptop cabled to the modem and couldnt get anything higher than .3 megs or so on the speed tests via wifi and most would just time out. Cabled was still getting high 2's. Couldnt seem to find anything. Then on the phone for a brief second popped up another frontier signal which I can only assume is the frontier switch building at the end of the shop (perhaps 120' away). I barely saw it but it and then it disappeared. It was also channel 1. For the heck of it I went into the router config and changed the channel to 3. Im now sitting at my desk and the last three speed tests have been right at or just below 3 megs over wifi.

Astounding.... Fingers crossed.

[Ole Anderson]

I feel guilty complaining about not getting the full 57 mbps bandwidth on wireless when Mark is struggling to get 3 mbps. But I got so frustrated with the inconsistent wireless speed, and often no speed, I called Comcast and they returned and installed a new router, same Docsis 3 model. Tested good when the tech left, later it was back to its same old tricks. I would start loading an important page, it would freeze and I would carry my laptop over to the router and plug in a short Ethernet cable to finish loading the page. So I bit the bullet and fished a Cat 5e cable to my kitchen table where I sit with my breakfast and laptop. It wasn't easy, I had to remove my DC filter and downturn elbow in my tight DC closet to get access to the finished ceiling basement joist area beyond. Thank goodness for my 12 foot fiberglass electrical "fish pole". But I now have an Ethernet wall outlet in the kitchen/dining area next to my laptop. And my connection is rock solid at about 58 down/12 up on virtually every test. Did the same and eliminated the wireless bridge to my BluRay used for streaming Netflix. That one required drilling through the brick in 2 places and running 60 feet of cable beneath the deck. Hoping my wife is happy enough with her signal in her knitting room that I don't have to fish a cable there too.

Sorry for the hijack.

292031

[Curt Harms]

Mark, I'm glad you were able to solve your mystery. That's not something that came to my mind. Ole I've developed a fondness for MoCA for the same reason. Wireless in great -- when it works. Our house has home run coax wiring and we have FiOS which uses MoCA. Any cable outlet can become an wired ethernet port with the purchase of a MoCA ethernet bridge (I think that's the right term), usually a used Verizon FiOS router which gives 4 ethernet ports.