New Grizzley vs Old Timesaver

[Chris Stormer]

Given the choice between

Used Timesaver 137-2HD, there looks like there is a good one on ebay for 11.5k but with all used equipment it's tough to know how much work it might need

or

new Grizzly G0447

I know the Timesaver is a better brand.. pro's and con's.

[Gregory Stahl]

Neither--I would find an SCMI for used or cough up another $5k and get a new Butfering.

[johnny means]

Neither--I would find an SCMI for used or cough up another $5k and get a new Butfering.

Why SCMI over Timesaver?

[Chris Stormer]

Neither--I would find an SCMI for used or cough up another $5k and get a new Butfering.

Is there a specific Butfering you recommend?

[Peter Quinn]

Take a close look at the used market. Can you try the timesaver under power ? At that price point it's not a buyer beware as is situation IMO. I'm using a grizzly 37" single head now, it's accurate enough, belt changes are fairly easy, the digital power drive is nice, in fact everything about it is good except the motor.....desperately under powered. Have an extra .015" for a small part of a not so wide board? Thing starts screaming and studdering violently. You have to go very slow and baby it, the per pass capacity is 40% less than what I'm used to at its limit. It will take .015 at 120g , don't ask it for .020" even for a second. I have plenty of experience with wide belts, this is the first one I've encountered that is so easily stopped. Last one I used was a bought used 37" gemco, company is gone, sander was a beast, 25hp motor single head.

So take a close look at the hp rating and amp draw of what you are buying, because hp is often overrated, kW don't lie as easily. Do you thing 20hp is actually enough to power two heads?

[Gregory Stahl]

Why SCMI over Timesaver?
Nothing wrong with Timesaver--I like the smaller footprint of the SCMI and I feel overall the machine may be a bit higher quality, parts seem to be readily available through Parts Pronto as we'll. I'm not a fan of Timesavers Asian outsourcing, but the machines I am familiar with have been reliable. I have notice many Timesavers need to have the conveyor belt replaced for machines from this era--the SCMI belt holds up well--very thick.

If I were to spend $11.5k, I would spend a couple more and get a newer SCMI dual head machine or a new single head machine. There has been a couple nice SCMI sanders in Chicago area lately.

For $6-7k you should be able to find a 37" single head SCMI in good shape.

[Gregory Stahl]

SWT113K for the 37" machine.

[David Kumm]

Timesaver can be US, Korean, or Chinese. The AEM were very similar and the older gray ones were US before they were bought by Timesavers. Butfering have a good rep although they are now Asian sourced too. At least some of them. The 137-2 is a two head. Some are platen only on second head and you would want drum on first and combo on second. Dave

PS Don't forget Kundig. Maybe the pick of the litter until you get to Weber. Dave

[Gregory Stahl]

Butfering have a good rep although they are now Asian sourced too. At least some of them.

PS Don't forget Kundig. Maybe the pick of the litter until you get to Weber. Dave

I have not heard that regarding the Butfering machines. Going to Stiles showroom next week for the day--will definitely look into this--could be a factor. Any idea what the kundig 43" goes for?

[David Kumm]

Greg, didn't mean that there was anything wrong with the Butfering. Companies tend to want entry level machines for every price point and outsourcing is the way to get there. I would just ask what Butfering demands of their suppliers and how their machines differ from the others built in the same factory. I'm a used guy so a single head used kundig will go in the 8-12K range. If you find one with the optional platen etc it could go higher. I believe the Butfering series where the table is stationary are still Euro. I know a guy with a double head 25" Kundig for sale but it needs 92 three phase amps so it is a hard sell vs a 37" needing the same power. Dave

[Rick Lizek]

What is your primary sanding need. You can't beat a stroke sander in cost or versatility.

[Rick Fisher]

I believe the 1 series Butfering are made in China. The 3 series and up are still made in Germany.

I would buy a used Timesaver/SCM/Butferring or Kundig over a new Grizzly but that is just me. On power. I agree with Peter, 20hp is not enough to run 2 heads.

[Shiraz Balolia]

Given the choice between

Used Timesaver 137-2HD, there looks like there is a good one on ebay for 11.5k but with all used equipment it's tough to know how much work it might need

or

new Grizzly G0447

I know the Timesaver is a better brand.. pro's and con's.


Just so you know, our belt sanders are used in many production shops that use them at least 8 to 10 hours a day continuously.

Several major guitar factories here in USA use them for daily precision sanding of highly prized figured guitar woods. We also sell more belt sanders than just about any other company in North America, including companies that specialize only in wide belt sanders. Ours are made in Taiwan and we have been dealing with that factory for over 20 years.

[Jim Andrew]

I have the small Grizzly G9983 and like it very much. For a hobby shop, it is hard to beat. Actually, it would be ok for a full time shop if the production is not overwhelming. You might look at the model I have if you don't mind running wide panels through twice, as it sands 15" per pass, and you can sand a 30" panel by just reversing it and running the other side through. It will flatten a wide panel, sand a face frame, just about anything I want it to do, and it costs very little compared to what you are looking at.

[Albert Lee]

The NZ Butfering dealer told me Butfering has moved it's production back to Germany now. I was going to buy a swt113 from this dealer in Texas. It cost $20k USD for brand new. You may want to check it out.

http://www.twichell-new.com/machine_list.asp?brand=BUTFERING

[Rick Fisher]

One thing about Grizzly.. If you do have a problem, it will get resolved. Shiraz, you should come out with a constant pass-line sander :) Also an EPS infeed roller and platen. I will upgrade my SCM 25" one day and it will have a constant pass-line for sure. A used Kundig or perhaps a newest model Grizzly ?? :)

To me, the head moving is genius. The table always being the same height allows a huge amount of flexibility .. Totally worth it .