Scored some apple...

[Scott M Perry]

Not sure how I'm going to get it out of the truck, though.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7200/13994618721_dd032b4c12_z.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/scott--/13994618721/)
Apple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/scott--/13994618721/) by Scott -- (https://www.flickr.com/people/scott--/), on Flickr

They're about 22-28" diameter, a little more than 2' tall each. Dropped my springs about 6"...

[David Weaver]

Wow...I'd rive that into quartered bits and see how straight the grain is. If you're lucky enough for them to pretty much run vertical with no twist, I would religiously visit the riven or split bits daily gluing any cracks that begin to form. It goes without saying that you should seal whatever you split.

I have no idea what the base tree would've been that branches would've been grafted to (the universal case is that edible apples come from grafted trees because the odds of a good tasting apple from a tree grown from seed only are very low), but if it's anything like some of the better apple I've used, then it should make great tools and tool handles.

I got my apple blanks wet - they checked like crazy and I had to visit them with CA glue daily to stop cracks - the same was true of a very wet cocobolo blank I had.

[Scott M Perry]

Thanks, David. First order of business is getting them home without them sliding forward into the cab of my truck. Then getting them off-loaded.

The tree was very large, and very old. And the wood is almost dripping. I can't wait to break into it and see what I've got. Tool handles, boxes, you name it. Use the off cuts in the smoker. All good.

[Pat Barry]

Just have everyone stand clear an roll em off

[Frank Drew]

I had some apple that size long ago, sadly before I got into bowl turning so they went for firewood.

Apple can be an absolute bear to split, though. Coat the endgrains ASAP, if you haven't done so already.

[Scott M Perry]

Got 'em off the truck, easy peasy. The boy helped me roll them out of the way. Need to get them sealed.

[Chris Griggs]

Nice score man...way more exciting the fallen red oak I just took from my inlaw's property...though I was able to quarter it up which makes it more appealing.

Seems like that will take up way too much shop space. You should probably drop one of those off at my place ;)


So are you planning to saw this up and dry it or is it going to be cut into turning blanks? Both?

[Scott M Perry]

Chris, next time you find yourself up this way, stop by and I'll hook you up with some.

I'm planning on riving it to manageable pieces and letting it dry. There are a bunch of small projects I've always wanted some apple for. Not planning on turning it. Don't have the right gear for that.

[Chris Griggs]

Cool! That will make for some very nice stock when you rive it. Hopefully it will dry nicely. Make yourself at least one saw tote with it...that'll be sweet!

[Chris Fournier]

You'd best break those out instantly regardless of sealing. Apple is incredibly unstable. I helped cut down and process a VERY large apple tree once. We sent one of the logs off to be sliced into veneer and one we broke out into lumber. The veneer was spectacular, the lumber really didn't make it. Crazy gluing your drying apple is simply going to cost you a fortune and yield some pretty iffy billets that will most likely tear themselves apart as you begin to machine them.

I did enjoy carving spoons out of apple billets and the pecky veneer made cherry look drab. Good luck!

[David Weaver]

You'd best break those out instantly regardless of sealing. Apple is incredibly unstable. I helped cut down and process a VERY large apple tree once. We sent one of the logs off to be sliced into veneer and one we broke out into lumber. The veneer was spectacular, the lumber really didn't make it. Crazy gluing your drying apple is simply going to cost you a fortune and yield some pretty iffy billets that will most likely tear themselves apart as you begin to machine them.

I did enjoy carving spoons out of apple billets and the pecky veneer made cherry look drab. Good luck!

Probably cost ten bucks in glue for both of those logs (a 4 ounce bottle of CA glue at the very most, but probably not that much). The key is to catch the cracks right away. I just cut a cocobolo blank apart that I did that to (one that was dripping wet) several years ago and none of the surface cracks went deep like they have on vintage billets that I've used (where deep cracks make you throw away half of the wood. It was a pain to follow a couple of sopping wet blanks with CA glue, but the total cost in glue for me with two large blanks was probably a buck or less. Every crack that I glued stopped where I glued it, the only mistake I made was leaving it go for a couple of weeks early on and some of the cracks got larger than I'd wanted them to do. I can't rememeber how long it was before those surface cracks stopped - probably a month, and then you don't have to do anything to it.

If there's a better solution, I'd like to see it. It's not something I'd do on something common like cherry, but when you're saving something uncommon and very nice.....apple is just a bear to dry, but it's one of the few woods worth the effort. Beats watching checks an inch deep developing.

[Chris Griggs]

Isn't it less likely to check if he cuts it into 1"-2" thick QS stock, as opposed to just letting the quartered chunks dry? Won't it dry more evenly that way? I don't heads or tails about drying and sealing stock, so just curious.

[David Weaver]

Given what I've seen with it drying before, I'd give stock an extra inch of thickness for any plane billets. if it doesn't crack, it will twist some or move unexpectedly.

I've had three different apples - one was a very waxy feeling wood, about as hard as maple, but wouldn't break out in any direction - you could rasp back against it and it wouldn't splinter out - it felt like it had been infused with wax. I sent the last bit of it I had to george (of course, it was the worst cracked stuff but that's all that I have left). It's still the nicest wood I've worked of any kind. The grain looked great on it, but it didn't have any of the behavior you'd normally associate with grain direction - it worked great in every direction.

The other two have been different - less uniform in color and more like maple, hard and dry feeling. I didn't like those nearly as much. I have no idea what is commonly used for grafting, but those two types are entirely different. Most of what I've seen commercially dried (primarily at hearne) looks more like the latter.

No clue how much of it was the difference in wood vs. the difference in drying.

[Steve Voigt]

Isn't it less likely to check if he cuts it into 1"-2" thick QS stock, as opposed to just letting the quartered chunks dry? Won't it dry more evenly that way? I don't heads or tails about drying and sealing stock, so just curious.

I think so. If it were mine, I'd probably split it in eighths, or split in quarters and then bandsaw. Then coat the ends. The smaller you can get the pieces, the better your chances of success.
The other thing is to dry it outside for at least a year, protected with roofing tin or something, but stacked for maximum air circulation.

[Chris Griggs]

I think so. If it were mine, I'd probably split it in eighths, or split in quarters and then bandsaw.

That's exactly what I did with the green fallen Black Oak (e.g. red oak) I just took home. Split it into quarters before loading it into the car and, got as many good 5/4 QS cuts out of each quarter as I could, and then stickered it (though in the basement not outside).

What do you guys seal the end grain with? I know turning blanks are typically dipped in wax. I didn't coat the ends of the stuff I cut up as I assumed QS oak would be stable enough to dry without major checking problems, but I did gob a bunch of paste was onto the ends of the pieces I didn't saw up into boards. Imagine either shellac or just about any way would be okay for sealing the end grain?

[David Weaver]

paraffin wax.

[Steve Voigt]

…and then stickered it (though in the basement not outside).


I don't mean to be a bummer, but I think it is highly likely that you will have problems with surface checking. Stickering inside is not at all the same thing as air drying outside. The real point of air drying is that the wood dries during the day, but then at night, because of lower temps and condensation, the wood reabsorbs some of the moisture it lost during the day. This back-and-forth cycling keeps the differential between surface dryness and internal dryness from becoming too great. If you are drying inside, even in a basement, the differential just keeps growing until the surface moisture reaches equilibrium with the room. But long before you get to that point, a piece of oak will likely tear itself apart. I say this from bitter experience; oak is nasty.



What do you guys seal the end grain with?

Anchor seal is what's always recommended, but it's a little pricey and hard to find locally. I use latex paint. It works great. I would paint the ends of every single piece, including the ones you sawed.

[Chris Griggs]

Not a bummer at all. Good advice. Thanks!

Latex paint I have plenty of, so that is what I shall do. As far a drying it outside. Well I guess I'll need to either take my chances inside or find something to house them outside. They are all shorties (2" or less) split and sawn from sawed up sections of a fallen tree, so its not the end of the world if it doesn't work out. I figure once dried they'll make nice runners, drawer sides or small boxes, but its really just and experiment to see if I can get some use out of the fall trees on my laws property. They often have tree's fall.

I'm surprised to hear that quartered it is so prone to tearing itself apart. How does Peter Follonsbee get away with making all that stuff out of still green quartered red oak?


I don't mean to be a bummer, but I think it is highly likely that you will have problems with surface checking. Stickering inside is not at all the same thing as air drying outside. The real point of air drying is that the wood dries during the day, but then at night, because of lower temps and condensation, the wood reabsorbs some of the moisture it lost during the day. This back-and-forth cycling keeps the differential between surface dryness and internal dryness from becoming too great. If you are drying inside, even in a basement, the differential just keeps growing until the surface moisture reaches equilibrium with the room. But long before you get to that point, a piece of oak will likely tear itself apart. I say this from bitter experience; oak is nasty.



Anchor seal is what's always recommended, but it's a little pricey and hard to find locally. I use latex paint. It works great. I would paint the ends of every single piece, including the ones you sawed.

[Steve Voigt]

Hey Chris,
The issue isn't how stable the wood is; as you point out, QS oak has relatively little shrinkage compared to some other species. The issue is the "safe drying rate," which is the maximum amount of moisture loss that should occur per day (if you want the wood to be usable). Oak and beech (and apple, I think) have very low safe drying rates; for example, the safe rate for soft maple is 6 times higher than the rate for white oak. So, for most species you would be fine in the basement. With oak or beech, you are taking a chance. It may work out fine, but if possible, I'd rather take precautions. I've never lost a piece of soft maple, but I've lost plenty of oak to surface checking.
I don't know what Peter does; I was under the impression that he air dried after riving, but maybe that's wrong.
If there's somewhere outside you can stack the lumber and cover it with a piece of roofing tin, so that rain won't get to any of it, that would be the best way. I would put down a couple cinder blocks, then stickers on the blocks, then my first layer of wood. Then stickers between every layer of the oak, and weigh the whole thing down with bricks or blocks on top of the roofing tin.

[Chris Griggs]

Very interesting Steve. All new info for me. I think PF lets his wood air dry for a couple week before he carves it so it won't get "fuzzy". I don't know what he does after that though. Maybe he leave the completed pieces outside to air dry more.

Anyway, all great info. Yeah I have space outside. I guess I can get myself something to make a little shelter for it. Since I went through the trouble to saw it up, I might as well play it safe and get something out of it.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

I'll have to pick through Peter's book and blog again, because reading this, now I am curious about how the drying of the wood figures into things. But aren't a lot of the pieces he builds basically hanging out at the Plimoth Plantation museum where he does a lot of the work? For all intents and purposes, some of those buildings have got to be pretty close to "outside" - fairly drafty compared to modern buildings, dirt floors, no heat/ac, etc. I remember him talking about how the museum basically captured a very specific point in time in the settlers lives, and how they had to deal with some things (like moisture/insect rot on the bottom of pieces placed on dirt floors) more regularly than the settlers might have had to, because eventually they would have upgraded to houses with floors, etc.

[Jim Foster]

I don't know if it helped in the end, but I had a gallon of old glue that I mixed with some water and used to seal the edges of some apple I had. Of course after I got the glue on, I painted a bunch of old latex an top of that... After sitting stickered in my shop for a year, a lot of it made it without too much splitting. Most of the pieces that split look like they should have anyway. For the original poster, I suggest splitting the wood into the smallest reasonable pieces you can before stickering it. I stored mine in the garage and then the loft(shop) above the garage. I loved the smell of the drying apple-wood, everyone else in the house hated it and made sure to let me know every day until the smell went away. If you have not experienced working with Apple-wood and your still a novice hand tool user (like me), the apple will get your blade sharpening skills in order very quickly. I've only hand planed a few surfaces so far to see what it is like to work with (too many other projects going on) and the wood demands very sharp blades.

[george wilson]

I agree: Don't try putting the green billets in a heated house to dry. It will dry too fast and will crack to pieces.

I don't know if this could be applied to apple or not,but I know that many years ago,old timers would sink walnut tree stumps full of highly figured gunstock wood,into a pond for a few years before even sawing it into stock blanks. The soaking in water stabilized the figured wood so it wouldn't crack so much when air drying.

Logs used to be anchored inline in flowing rivers too. The water pressure would gradually force the sap out,helping the subsequent safer drying of the wood.