re-sawing advice

[Joe A Faulkner]

I need to re-saw about 24 linear feet of cherry for a bookshelf. I can break the boards down to 3' in length before resawing. Two of the boards will be 1x10's. The others will be 1x8's. I don't own a bandsaw, and do not have access to one. I am considering a bow saw. For those of you who re-saw by hand, do you remember your learning curve? I really don't want to learn on cherry, so I likely will practice on some popular. Also, any recommendations for a bow saw?

The plans call for floating 1/4" panels in the sides, and ship-lapped 1/4" boards for the back. The shelf only stands 40" tall.

[Jim Matthews]

I just did it, in cherry for shop made veneer.

I use a gauge to scribe parallel lines, all the way around, so deep as I can.
I then use a steady chisel or marking knife to take out the material between them,
so that my saw will have a kerf starter.

I like to begin with a backsaw to get things started.

Remember that you're ripping, and choose your blade accordingly.
It's got to be sharp - you'll never get a clean finish with a dull blade.

You must cut the corners off first, and meet in the middle.
I have more difficulty keeping everything on the same plane, toward the middle
of the board. It's slow going.

Here's a montage of the method I use, by somebody that who gets the results we're after:

http://www.closegrain.com/2012/10/resawing-by-hand.html

Note that he's using a traditional Western ripsaw - that's REALLY sharp.

I only resaw when I've got three times the thickness to work with.
I need enough wiggle room to plane the shop veneer to thickness.

I've done this three-four times and it's getting better, but at 10" you'll be pushing a lot of steel through the kerf.

Steve Branam's article mentions the essential elements I glossed over the first time:
wax the blade, to minimize drag. Flip the board frequently.

At least have a mirror on the opposite side of the board to check your progress.

[Sean Hughto]

I urge you to make friends with someone with a bandsaw. Or maybe go to a local cabinet shop or woodworkers club with a shop.

Do you have a table saw? Do you have enough thickness to tolerate a 1/8th kerf? If so, let the table saw do as much as possible and then make quick work of whats left in the middle with a rip saw.

[Warren Mickley]

I have been resawing by hand for about forty years. At first I used a rip saw and sawed mostly in the 4 to 6 inch range. In 1980 I made a veneer saw, a 2 inch blade stretched between two solid arms in a frame. I soon was sawing in the 12 inch range.

As a beginner, I sawed the corners first as many recommend, and I sometimes sawed diagonally down alternate sides. With stuff in the 8 to 12 inch range, one can get an awful lot of bowing in the middle of the cut, so that one board is concave, the other convex. I found that sawing straight across gave a much truer surface in the middle of the board. I sometimes saw at a slight angle, like 10 degrees from straight across the board, but in any event keeping a constant angle seems to be best.

If your design will allow it I would consider cutting the 10 inch board into two 5 inch boards, which would be easier. Don't force the saw. If you get slightly off your line, just gently work your way back to the line. Putting a lot of twist on the saw in an effort to get back to the line quickly will make the saw bow in the middle.

[Doug Bowman]

I agree with Sean. Try hard to find a friend with a bandsaw. I have attempted some small scale hand redrawing and I cannot imagine trying 10" wide by 3 feet long.

[David Weaver]

You can build a saw like warren's either by mutiliating an old pitted rip saw (28 inches long) or buying one of the longest putsch rip blades, which aren't anything spectacular but they do work fine, especially once you have sharpened them.

If I were doing it, and I don't have a frame saw (thus would use a carpenter's saw), I would build a quickie fixture on a saw bench (you can build the nastiest saw bench you could think of out of a 2x12 in an hour and then cut a 1x8 slot right in the middle of it to resaw, and I would sit and saw with the saw blade toward me). Then I would plow the narrowest groove I could down the length of the boards on both sides and saw at about a 10 degree angle as warren says.

I've got several rip saws and I keep one of them at very aggressive rip only for very thick boards and resawing . I'd imagine I could probably resaw a 3 foot long 8 inch board in 15 or 20 minutes. I haven't resawn anything over 6 probably, but I can saw 3 feet of 8/4 with it in a minute and a half or two without hurrying, and I have resawn lengths of beech for blanks with no problem. Beech and cherry are both nice woods to rip.

I don't resaw as often as warren, though. i have an 18" bandsaw and I usually rip by hand for sport (as in exercise). There is something missing to me on a project that I don't have to hurry on if I don't rip by hand - a tactile appreciation for what is going on. Nothing spiritual or quacky, but something akin to striking a golf ball, or biting into something that has been cooked with perfect texture - and that's taken away when I just feed everything through the bandsaw.

[Edward Clarke]

Take a look at the Unplugged Woodshop. That guy posted a video a couple of days ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtmswWZ4Lvo#t=86

That kerfing saw that he's using makes the whole thing a lot easier.

[Winton Applegate]

I am Mr. Hand tool. I even ride my bicycle to work every day.
Human powered allllllll the way
but
when it comes to resawing.
resawing long stock especailly
resawing long wide stock even more
well
I got two things to say
#1

http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/Resaw.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/Resaw.jpg.html)

and
#2

http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaws

Trust me on that one.

I been here quite a lot
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0339_zps5bb16201.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0339_zps5bb16201.jpg.html)

http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0338_2_zps0770aa55.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0338_2_zps0770aa55.jpg.html)

But I recomend being here

http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/TenInches.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/TenInches.jpg.html)

[Shawn Pixley]

I like handtools as much as the next guy, but that just sounds like drudgery. I suggest finding someone with a bandsaw.

[Mike Allen1010]

I saw every thing with hand saws (especially since my BS has been 10-7 for some time) and re-sawing is a challenge. Check out Tom Findgens blog -really cool kerfing plane- I'm definitely building one just for this reason.

As Jim and David mentioned; Establishing the guiding kerf is key. Every other sawing task you can pretty easily saw right to layout line- except re-sawing.

Absent a kerfing plane, TS, plow plane, knife/Chisel, very tough not to wander on exit side. For me rip panel saw is more accurate,less wandering than a bow saw.

Cheers Mike

[Winton Applegate]

10" x 3 feet long actually isn't bad; it is the long planks that get silly. On the order of 8 feet and longer. You got to stand on something or have the board in a pit or bend over way too much while having the board way off the floor. I mean you either have to stand on the edge or clamp it in the vise. It gets . . . doing it by your self . . . you really need a second person on the other end of the saw for the long stuff . . . it gets . . .
silly.

[Winton Applegate]

I spent quite a bit of time with these guys
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/roc%20cuts%20wood/TheToothMeister.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/roc%20cuts%20wood/TheToothMeister.jpg.html)

and they are good for four or five inch wide and walnut etc.
When you get into 8" and 10" wide and harder wood it is really worth having the loooooong blade and much deeper gullets of the bandsaw blade I put in the frame saw and the two handles you can really start to get your legs and body weight into.

When resawing the wide stuff you start to gain an appreciation for the term HORSE power.
As in . . . a human ain't.

And following the line on the back side and as was mentioned flipping the board.
You just get tired of reorienting the plank to stay on track on long stock.

[David Weaver]

Winton, doesn't campy make something that hooks a bike to a reciprocating human powered bandsaw?

[Winton Applegate]

Hey,
It is off the subject but I ran into this YouTube
http://www.marthastewart.com/926570/toshio-odate-handcrafted-shoji-screen

While looking for Toshio resawing a wide board (not over three feet long though).

I have pics in a book is all. I was hoping for a YouTube of him resawing. He is amazing. Oh well. I VHSed this vid a long time ago. It is cool to see it online.
I thought someone else might like it.

Back to resawing.
Here is Toshio showing us how a BIG DOG does it. IMPRESSIVE !
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0834_zps0006be2f.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0834_zps0006be2f.jpg.html)


http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0835_zps3ecd43c4.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0835_zps3ecd43c4.jpg.html)


That's from this book
http://www.amazon.com/Making-Shoji-Toshio-Odate/dp/0941936473/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1396328332&sr=1-3&keywords=toshio+odate


And here is where I got my saw design from


http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0836_zps317543ff.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0836_zps317543ff.jpg.html)


http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/ImadeBobssaw_zps2b338e0a.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/ImadeBobssaw_zps2b338e0a.jpg.html)


He kerfs it with the table saw. May as well use a bandsaw if we are going to introduce a table saw.

That's from this book

http://www.amazon.com/Woodworking-Technique-Practical-Job--Choose/dp/0875967124/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1396328126&sr=1-1&keywords=woodworking+the+right+technique


And finally Frank Klausz and his brother fooling around for old times sake using a saw similar to my long frame saw.
This is the best way I have found. This way there are eyeballs on both sides of the plank watching the line.
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/TheOnlyWayToGo_zps59197614.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/TheOnlyWayToGo_zps59197614.jpg.html)

[Winton Applegate]

Winton, doesn't campy make something that hooks a bike to a reciprocating human powered bandsaw?

Yes. But you or I can't afford it.
Ha, ha,
have you priced that stuff lately.
At least they have a sense of humor.

They make satellite parts too. I wonder how many they sell when there are several companies placing bids.

The bike I ride everyday to work is most all Campy but working man's Campy from the eighties.

[Daniel Sutton]

I cut this 2ish x 7.5 inch x 2 ft piece of walnut by hand. I know that you're going to be sawing a lot more than this, but it can be done.

I marked two lines around the whole board referencing the same side, with the two lines being my max kerf width. I clamped the board at an angle and established a good kerf down each side of the board. I then vlamped the board straight up and down and sawed straight. It took a while, but I had no other option for cutting this board. I've been seriously thinking about building a big frame saw, but havent gotten to it yet.
http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w493/jaimechimie/20140331_185051_zpsb0ca1cc4.jpg

http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w493/jaimechimie/20140331_185032_zps681828c0.jpg
http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w493/jaimechimie/20140331_184952_zpsd169ff03.jpg

[Doug Bowman]

I am Mr. Hand tool. I even ride my bicycle to work every day.
Human powered allllllll the way


Is there a connection here. I know there are quite a few bicycle/woodworking enthusiasts. But is there a connection between hand tools and transportation cyclists, like myself and winton? I should probably start another thread.

[John Walkowiak]

This is close to a bicycle woodworker. http://blog.lostartpress.com/2014/03/14/the-motor-cycle-for-carpenters-and-builders/



Is there a connection here. I know there are quite a few bicycle/woodworking enthusiasts. But is there a connection between hand tools and transportation cyclists, like myself and winton? I should probably start another thread.

[Warren Mickley]

Is there a connection here. I know there are quite a few bicycle/woodworking enthusiasts. But is there a connection between hand tools and transportation cyclists, like myself and winton? I should probably start another thread.

My friend Daniel O'Hagan was a hand tool woodworker who resawed by hand and also used a pit saw. Years ago he rode his bike from Pennsylvania to North Carolina to teach hand work to guys like Drew Langsner and Peter Follansbee. Not sure you and Winton are in that category.

[Kees Heiden]

I ride a bicycle a lot too. From home to the railway station and in the city I have a second bike to get to work. For grocery shopping and for most other errands around town. But that's nothing special. Bicycles are the norm for around town transport overhere. To be honest I don't really like bike riding, much prefer walking during my holidays.

I've done a little bit of hand resawing too, but nothing large like that.

[Daniel Sutton]

I watched this video and copied his technique. I would rexommend angling the board more than bending over like he does several times. Make sure your saw is sharp and cuts straight before starting.Watch "Using a hand saw to rip boards to thickness" on YouTube
Using a hand saw to rip boards to thickness: http://youtu.be/c_fvnSwhJuM

[Christopher Charles]

Another biker-hand tooler here. On-and-off no-car owner. Two do seem to go together. And I miss the 80s campy stuff, now ride a cross bike with 'mano.

C

[Jim Matthews]

That kerfing saw that he's using makes the whole thing a lot easier.

I emulated just this idea with one of my backsaws.
So long as the first (kerfing) blade is wider, the other should follow the same tracks.

I've done it with, and without this prepping step and this way is MUCH better, in the end.
Less binding in the cut, less waste and less planing to final thickness.

[Joe A Faulkner]

Take a look at the Unplugged Woodshop. That guy posted a video a couple of days ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtmswWZ4Lvo#t=86

That kerfing saw that he's using makes the whole thing a lot easier.

Edward thanks for the link. I had seen another frame saw u-tube demo, but it didn't include the Kerfing Plane. If it weren't for due dates, the day job, and a few other obligations and opportunities, I'd be content to first build the kerfing plane, then then frame saw, then the bookshelf, but alas I just spent the past 4 months working on a bench in my discretionary time. If I don't make something for the household soon, well let's just say the long cold winter could extend well into spring. Of course I did ask for information on how to do this, and must say I'm impressed with the Unplugged Woodshop. If I can't find a bandsawyer to assist me, I likely will use a thin kerf blade on the tablesaw for deep kerfs, and hand saw the burried spine. I've done this before for ship lapped backs out of 6" oak.

[Kees Heiden]

That certainly is a usefull option too. The thin kerf saws are still about 3mm wide, and a handsaw only 1.2 mm. So it is a bit wastefull. But when you wander a lot in the cut with a handsaw, you quickly go over that 3 mm anyway.

[Bill Rhodus]

I ride a bicycle in endurance events and haven't yet seen where this helps me with hand resawing. Do you guys strap the saw to your feet? Sorry, I knew better than to do this but couldn't help myself. For the original poster, you can buy a saw blade from Isaac at Blackburn Tool very reasonably to make a fine frame saw for ripping. I bought a 4"x48"x3tpi that I use when I am only ripping a few pieces and I have a 24" bandsaw. Sean is right though, if you have to do a lot of ripping it quickly becomes a chore rather than an enjoyable old school exercise.

[David Weaver]

Well, if you guys could rig up a weighted wheel system, you could resaw with bandsaws (all of the sudden blade sharpness would become very important). figure that you can output about what, 200 watts for a period of a few minutes before getting pooped? Someone who is fit could, I couldn't.

If you had a blade speed of about 1000 feet per minute, I'd bet you could pedal it.

[Doug Bowman]

No, I was thinking more along the lines of motivation. One of the reasons for me riding to work all the time is that I can get to work "without assistance". Same thing with hand tools.

[Steve Voigt]

Is there a connection here. I know there are quite a few bicycle/woodworking enthusiasts. But is there a connection between hand tools and transportation cyclists, like myself and winton? I should probably start another thread.

It's probably just an all-around skepticism towards the common belief that everything we do has to be motor-assisted. Most people accept that without question.
I bike to work also. Recently, I mentioned to a work associate that I would be without a car for several weeks. From the look on her face, you'd think I had told her I was going to amputate my arm.

[Pat Barry]

It's probably just an all-around skepticism towards the common belief that everything we do has to be motor-assisted. Most people accept that without question.
I bike to work also. Recently, I mentioned to a work associate that I would be without a car for several weeks. From the look on her face, you'd think I had told her I was going to amputate my arm.

Riding a bike gives a great sense of freedom and accomplishment no doubt. It can also speak volumes about how much one cares about health and the environment.

[Bill Rhodus]

I agree with you Doug. I get a very similar satisfaction from both.

[Winton Applegate]

connection to bike
I just ment that I prefer non motorized means to an end if I can comfortably feniggle it.
Also if one is used to rowing or riding or other similar aerobic activities, you know, slow and steady phisical effort for a period of a half hour etc. then one is better prepared for the phisical demands of resawing.

Which in my case is the case.
and still, even though I am phisically capable of it I find hand resawing wide hard stock, oak for an example that we can all relate to, . . . I find that kind of resawing wastful of time, mental effort and wood.

Long, wide, hard stuff is where I draw the line and embrace 220 volts with alacrity.

[Winton Applegate]

endurance events and haven't yet seen where this helps me with hand resawing

Oh . . . ok . . . try the following regime for a a year or three then try the resawing in the big stuff with a two handled frame saw :


spend all your free time sitting on the couch (use elevators when ever possible when out and about if you absolutely need to go out).
while on the couch, and at all other times you can fit it in, smoke cigarettes.
since you no longer have to eat for your bicycle, eat lots more meat and cheese . . .PIZZA ! (I can't ride worth a darn on a high meat and or cheese regime).
what the heck . . . may as well throw in lots of beer and other alcoholic beverages in on top (see comment to #3)


NOW
Try the resawing again. A nice eight footer in oak shall be say 10 inches wide (I would say bubinga but I don't like to see people die before my very eyes).

Go ahead . . . I wanna see yah do it . . . and smile at the same time . . .
. . . goannn . . . lets see yah.

[Winton Applegate]

Lots of cyclists ! Good on ya.



I ride a bicycle a lot too. From home to the railway station and in the city I have a second bike to get to work. For grocery shopping and for most other errands around town. But that's nothing special. Bicycles are the norm for around town transport overhere. To be honest I don't really like bike riding, much prefer walking during my holidays.


Kees,
You are living my utopian dream come true !
But you don't like it.


Hey . . . want to trade ?


Here the only use they have for a train is hauling coal.
Why no passenger train ?
Passenger train ? What's that ?


The tracks are so bad the engineers are in constant fear for their lives and to get them remotely close to passable to carry passengers (some crazy stipulation the insurance agencies demand . . .huh . . . what do THEY know) . . . well that would "cost to much". Wait . . . we need jobs here, good jobs, that would make jobs . . . hmmmmmm.


Naaaaahhhhh
that would never work.
but they are doing it in other parts of the world.
Nahhhhhh
no really. I heard stories.
Naahhhhh ! ! !!
No . . . really . . . there was this guy in the wood working chat room. His name is Kees. Says they have passenger trains where he lives.
NO ! ! ! ! IT WOULD NEVER WORK IN THE WEST ! ! !


(oh. ok)


So . . . where was I . . . . Oh yah
Kees, you would love it here. Lots of big cars. I mean BIG CARS.
Ever see a Chevy Suburban ?
High lift pick up trucks with twin exhaust stacks, over size tires, belching LOTS AND LOTS of diesel smoke.


Ever see one of those . . .
while you are sitting at a stop light . . .
in your rear view mirror . . .
as they barrel along at forty mph (well of course they can drive over the speed limit. They are special. And big. That MAKES them special er)
Ever see them barreling down on you in your rear view mirror as you are siting at a stop light while they are texting on their cell phone oblivious to what is in front of them?

You are going to LOVE IT here !
Freedom.
Freedom to be an oblivious, selfish, consumer of the last remnants of energy and decent atmosphere on the planet.

Until the collision of course.
Exaggeration ?
Happened to my boss. Years later she is still in pain from it every day.
Other people I have worked with as well.
I take the side, side, side streets and am ready to dive into someones yard bushes as the behemoths blow by.
Works so far.

We used to drive all the time. Now with the cell phone conversations while driving, and the texting . . .

of course they voted and passed the right to add whacky tobaccy to the mix in the last year or two.

nah dude, nah

I want a passenger train all along the front range from Wyoming to Santa Fe New Mexico.

Yah
and people in hell want ice water.