Curly maple table top - trying to learn from a master

[William Earnest]

Greetings. I'm ignorant about finishing and have been reading through posts here to figure out how to finish curly maple. Almost ten years ago a forum participant, Donnie Raines, posted pictures of a fine curly maple table top he had done with dye and Pratt and Lambert 38. Here's a copy of a pic in his thread
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?12710-Curly-Maple-Table

286138
In the thread he said he "used Moser Brown water dye..that was "thinned" out for a softer color. For the top coat I used Pratt and Lambert #38 varnish....which I thinned out to 75% varnish to 25% mineral spirits to make a wiping varnish." I p/med him to ask which of the Moser Brown dyes he had used -- Amazon has several different ones -- and how much he had thinned it but have not received a response. Can anyone here figure out the answer? If I could get in the ballpark I'd be satisfied.

[Peter Keen]

Can't even guess, and the dyes may have changed names / range of colors in the 10 years since he did that.

I've done something like this for a couple of pieces of furniture, following the directions in Fine Woodworking's "Pop the Curl in Curly Maple" article. I ended up ordering several dyes, and playing with them until I got the right finish. I started out with a full strength mix, tried that, then split the dye into two - kept one at full strength, and played by thinning the other until I got what I wanted. The colors wouldn't work out until I ended up mixing two dyes together to get what I wanted.

[William Earnest]

Thanks for giving it some thought. I've ordered a range of six Moser dyes from Woodworker.com. I'll experiment and report back.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

William,

for some reason, Donnie Raines lost his privileges to post here. I suspect you won't hear from him.

[Loren Woirhaye]

Russet amber maple is a sweet dye from Moser. It would not surprise me if it is that one.

[Tai Fu]

Maple stains terribly... unless the curl is extreme (in which a very light colored dye can be used to pop the grain), I would spray a toner over the sealed wood rather than try to stain it. You'll get a more even color that way.

[William Earnest]

Tai, thank you for bringing that up. I found a Wood Whisperer vid (http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/articles/blotch-control-to-rule-them-all/) (http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/articles/blotch-control-to-rule-them-all/) that highly recommended Charles Neil's conditioner (www.cnwoodworking.com (http://www.cnwoodworking.com)) and have ordered a quart.
Loren, it looks like I bracketed Russet Amber by picking Golden Amber and Medium Amber Maple.

[David Eisenhauer]

I use Trans Tint dyes all the time and quite frequently lay on a coat of amber first, then my desired color(s) coats on top of the amber. The Amber underneath can help impart a "glow" to the upper colors. Like the difference between"Oak" and a "Golden Oak" colors. As said above, prep (same as you intend to do the prep on your project) some actual wood scraps from your project and start mixing up strengths of the colors. Sometimes I use three different colors to get the tone I am looking for. You will need to lay on your topcoat over your test dye scraps to get the true look of your test pieces.

[Kent A Bathurst]

How about something like this?


286572

Notes from my project files:

1. Dark Vintage Maple Transtint, 2 oz liquid to 1 pt water.
2. Flood. Wipe dry. Wait.
3. Pretty thorough sanding with 3M 216u 600g.
4. Seal with 3/4# ultra pale shellac. Padded on 3 coats. Brought out the curl even more
5. Final finish with Behlen's Rockhard.

[Jim Matthews]

How about something like this?


286572



Wow.

That's spectacular.

[Michael Mahan]

How about something like this?


286572

Notes from my project files:

1. Dark Vintage Maple Transtint, 2 oz liquid to 1 pt water.
2. Flood. Wipe dry. Wait.
3. Pretty thorough sanding with 3M 216u 600g.
4. Seal with 3/4# ultra pale shellac. Padded on 3 coats. Brought out the curl even more
5. Final finish with Behlen's Rockhard.

I'll try this for sure ,
BUT what about the Behlen's RockHard ? ?
My research has show it's not the same now as it was back in 'o4
they changed it's whole formulation
it's Now a Poly
any idea of a replacement ? WaterLox maybe ?

[Kent A Bathurst]

I'll try this for sure ,
BUT what about the Behlen's RockHard ? ?
My research has show it's not the same now as it was back in 'o4
they changed it's whole formulation
it's Now a Poly
any idea of a replacement ? WaterLox maybe ?

all true.
unfortunately.
Go w'lox, is my advice.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Wow.

That's spectacular.

Thanks, Jim. Very kind. I got a kick out of these [there is a pair]

Ebonized white oak base. With the alchemist version - steel wool in white vinegar for an iron solution, and also quebracho bark tea. Tried a version with eye of newt, but that didn't seem to help.

And - you can't see it from this angle, but floating top.

Out-of-body experience for a dyed-in-the-wool Stickley/Arts&Crafts guy. Just started making stuff up as I went on the construction - limited design and just let 're rip.

I had been wanting to do something like this for a few years. Wife said "go right ahead, but it won't be in my house." One evening over wine I was whining to a neighbor about the lost opportunity, and she said "I'll commission that from you. But only if you will do 2 of them."

Bingo.

[Michael Mahan]

all true.
unfortunately.
Go w'lox, is my advice.
ThanX Kent !

I thinking small table Top with Panama rosewood legs & frame .
I've been buying alot of Curly & Tiger Maple as I love the look
Just looking for Ideas & finishing methods ;)

[William Earnest]

Is Waterlox a rough equivalent to the Pratt and Lambert 38 Raines used?

[Kent A Bathurst]

Is Waterlox a rough equivalent to the Pratt and Lambert 38 Raines used?


I don't think so. W'lox has a much more amber tint, AFAIK.

[William Earnest]

It turned out that Golden Amber Maple, mixed at about 1/4 strength (i.e. 1/4 oz to a quart), was a close approximation to what Raines achieved.
I found that it was difficult to get a smooth finish using the 3:1 P&L38/mineral spirits mixture. Brushing it on worked well, however.
Thanks for all of your advice!

[Mike Konobeck]

Do some searching on waterlox in the finishing forum here on SMC. I used waterlox on our dining room table. It takes a bit of time and patience to get right but is not bad. I brushed the table in the following link and didn't to a great job. Not terrible but could do better now. Sprayed the chairs and it goes ok but I wouldn't recommend it. Pain to clean up the gun. I am going to wait for the little monsters to grow up and then apply another couple coats of Waterlox and buff out to a really nice finish. That is the beauty of the finish. It adheres to itself even after it has cured.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?172208-Waterfall-Bubinga-Table-Finish

[Harlan Barnhart]

Some waterlox formulations have changed as well to be be voc friendly. Still a great product.

[Scott Rychnovsky]

Thanks, Jim. Very kind. I got a kick out of these [there is a pair]

I had been wanting to do something like this for a few years. Wife said "go right ahead, but it won't be in my house." One evening over wine I was whining to a neighbor about the lost opportunity, and she said "I'll commission that from you. But only if you will do 2 of them."

Bingo.

Why didn't your Wife want it in her house? It is gorgeous!

Scott

[Kent A Bathurst]

Why didn't your Wife want it in her house? It is gorgeous!

Scott

Mid-20's bungalow.

Full of Arts & Crafts furniture. Some original Stickley antiques, and some original pieces from other lesser-knowns from back in the day.

Plus, some modern-day Stickley pieces that are the same designs as forever - we moved in, needed furniture faster than I could build it.

And then - a variety of Stickley repros I have made, and some Stickley-style pieces that he would have made had he only thought to ask me first. Still in the queue - a couple of Limbert repros.

All the above are a deep reddish-brown. The stuff I make is from A-1 veneer-grade QSWO with killer grain. $$$$.

The curly maple floating tops on ebonized QSWO bases simple did not fit the program. Or so I was told.

Best phrase I ever learned: "Yes, dear. You're right, dear."

I was happy to get the chance to make them - completely outside my standard design-cue envelope.

Plant the flag. Claim victory. Move on.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

The last curly maple top I made I used waterlox.... looks great.