horizontal slot mortiser

[Jaromir Svoboda]

I like to get horizontal slot mortise. I only find Felder, Grizzly and Laguna, are there any other out there?
Thank you.

[Thomas Hotchkin]

Jaromir
I have a JDS Multi-Router works very well for all my woodworking needs. Tom

[Jeff Duncan]

Bini and Bacci are 2 Italian made slot mortisers that will both be better quality than what you have listed and can be found on the used market. Griggio is still making them I believe? I'm sure there are others as well.

good luck,
JeffD

[Peter Quinn]

Paolini has one too, as does Royjek, much like a hammer machine. The high end Laguna is a Griggio.

one of the import brands makes one too, maybe invicta?

[Larry Edgerton]

I just finished the second kitchen in a row with mortice and tenon face frames and I am thinking there has to be a better way, I really do not like my morticing machine so much right now, my shoulder hurts.

So.... Is there a machine that will put round tenons on the end of rails, not router based? For less than the price of a small car?

Larry

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Actually Larry, these don't usually cost a ridiculous amount.

[Mike Heidrick]

Larry, do you not like the noise of the router?

[Bruce Wrenn]

So.... Is there a machine that will put round tenons on the end of rails, not router based? For less than the price of a small car?

Larry Why do ends have to be rounded? It's the glue on the face that's holding everything together. Four in one rasp will round corners on ends for less than the cost of a dinner at Applebee's. Cut tenons on band saw. Without removing stop, shift table to 45, and clip off corners.

[Alan Bienlein]

I just finished the second kitchen in a row with mortice and tenon face frames and I am thinking there has to be a better way, I really do not like my morticing machine so much right now, my shoulder hurts.

So.... Is there a machine that will put round tenons on the end of rails, not router based? For less than the price of a small car?

Larry

Yes there is it's called a kreg pocket hole jig.

[Alan Bienlein]

I like to get horizontal slot mortise. I only find Felder, Grizzly and Laguna, are there any other out there?
Thank you.

Have you ever thought of just making one? I made mine for about a $30 plus dollar investment.

[Scott Reed]

I made one. I'm a firm believer in loose tenon joinery. I designed a horizontal mortiser with a router that has worked extremely well for me. My latest project has around 42 m/t joints, with some on odd shaped pieces that I do not possess the skills or tools to do by hand. the time my machine saved me is incredible. It was super fast and my joints are way more accurate than ever.

[Larry Edgerton]

Yes there is it's called a kreg pocket hole jig.

Not in my lifetime.......

Larry

[Rick Lizek]

Why do you need round tenons? For 30 years I've used square loose tenons in loose tenon joinery. Look at old metalworking hand mills. They can be had for the price of scrap metal. Ideally a machine that runs at 3000 to 5000 RPM and using high-speed steel End Mills is your best bet.

[Jeff Duncan]

I just finished the second kitchen in a row with mortice and tenon face frames and I am thinking there has to be a better way, I really do not like my morticing machine so much right now, my shoulder hurts.

So.... Is there a machine that will put round tenons on the end of rails, not router based? For less than the price of a small car?

Larry

Forget about rounding the tenons and go with loose tenons instead. A very good quality slot mortiser new will run you in the neighborhood of $5-$6k. You then can make use of loose tenons which are much quicker and easier to do and offer almost the same strength as what your now doing, (in reality WAY more strength than is actually needed in that situation). A used machine can be had for under $2k. And if your shoulders are really getting tired than you could even look into something like a used Maka which is an automatic mortiser;)

They do have advantages over most router based setups, for one you can also do larger mortises for passage doors. You have a larger heavy stationary machine that your working with instead of a bench top version. And they're quiet so you can work them without the screeching router whaling away:D

good luck,
JeffD

[Stephen Musial]

Do you have a radial arm saw? http://woodworker.com/radial-saw-mortising-attach-mssu-889-372.asp?search=mortiser&searchmode=2

[John TenEyck]

I too made my own horizontal router mortiser. https://sites.google.com/site/jteneyckwoodworker/current-projects/horizontal-router-mortiser It cost me about $50 out of pocket, and I've cut hundreds and hundreds of mortises with it over the past 3 or 4 years. It's as accurate as you could possible want. It works as well as a JDS MultiRouter in 2 axis, and you save over $2500 in the bargain. Personally, I use pocket screws for face frames, but if I wanted to use mortise and tenons I would use the router mortiser to make them.

John

[David Werkheiser]

Have you looked at the Festool "Domino" 500 or the 700? I had the JDS Multi-Router and it was a great machine that could do tenons and before that Grizzly horiz. boring machine (it was not machined very well) and both machines had tables that moved side to side which made it hard to control a 6'6" bed rail boring into end grain. With the Domino you take the machine to the work, for $800-1200 it is as they say "a game changer"
David

[Peter Quinn]

Larry, richline has a machine that is router based but is professionally built for commercial use and will make round tenons on rail ends. I just use loose tenons personally, for face frames I'm using dominos. Very strong, very quick, cost effective.

http://richlinemachines.com

[Loren Woirhaye]

I'll point out that a "real" slot mortiser runs at a much slower speed than a router and can run special cutters with up to 4" or maybe more cutting depth. They are out there but they are really factory grade tools. I've seen a few on Craigslist and at auctions and they get snapped up. Some are two-sided with a mortising table on both sides so two workers can use the machine. There are also round-end tenoners with two work stations. I have never seen one in operation but I think you set up one workstation, and cut the tenon while another worker sets up the other table.

I use a Wirth machine to cut tenons. It's similar to a Multi-router but runs on an induction motor driving a spindle. Cutters are changed like on a milling machine. It's kind of like a pin router turned on its side with an x-y table and then the spindle pivots to get z axis travel for following templates. It will cut mortises too.

[Jaromir Svoboda]

No,I do not.
Do you have a radial arm saw? http://woodworker.com/radial-saw-mortising-attach-mssu-889-372.asp?search=mortiser&searchmode=2

[Michael Mayo]

John,
How do I download your Sketchup drawing for the mortiser? Says I don't have permission?

[Brad Seubert]

I too made my own horizontal router mortiser. https://sites.google.com/site/jteneyckwoodworker/current-projects/horizontal-router-mortiser It cost me about $50 out of pocket, and I've cut hundreds and hundreds of mortises with it over the past 3 or 4 years. It's as accurate as you could possible want. It works as well as a JDS MultiRouter in 2 axis, and you save over $2500 in the bargain. Personally, I use pocket screws for face frames, but if I wanted to use mortise and tenons I would use the router mortiser to make them.

John

Thanks for this! I have been thinking about building the woodgears slot mortiser for awhile now, but think I will give this a try. It looks much simpler and cheaper.

[Larry Edgerton]

Larry, richline has a machine that is router based but is professionally built for commercial use and will make round tenons on rail ends. I just use loose tenons personally, for face frames I'm using dominos. Very strong, very quick, cost effective.

http://richlinemachines.com

Well Peter, if its good enough for you I will try it. I just traded an old tablesaw for a Domino a bit ago, the smaller one. I like my old system in that I do not have to do any aligning as I make all the tenons spot on and tight, but I will do a few test pieces with the Domino. Most of my work is inset fronts and I like a 1" rail between drawers, so there is not much to work with. But so far I have not really found that the Domino is any more accurate than my Lamello, but I will give it a shot.

The system I have been using is very accurate, but I need to cut some time out of my cabinets for the current gig I have going. Not as much money in it but if it works out I will seldom have to leave my home/shop complex. Unless the fish are biting.......

Larry

[nicholas mitchell]

Why mess around?


http://youtu.be/E2Kk8wD-D7A?t=15s

[John TenEyck]

John,
How do I download your Sketchup drawing for the mortiser? Says I don't have permission?

I don't know why that is. I just checked it after signing out of my Google account and it let me down load it. I'll send it to you in a PM. If anyone else has a problem downloading it let me know and I'll send it to you as well.

John

[Peter Quinn]

Well Peter, if its good enough for you I will try it. I just traded an old tablesaw for a Domino a bit ago, the smaller one. I like my old system in that I do not have to do any aligning as I make all the tenons spot on and tight, but I will do a few test pieces with the Domino. Most of my work is inset fronts and I like a 1" rail between drawers, so there is not much to work with. But so far I have not really found that the Domino is any more accurate than my Lamello, but I will give it a shot.

The system I have been using is very accurate, but I need to cut some time out of my cabinets for the current gig I have going. Not as much money in it but if it works out I will seldom have to leave my home/shop complex. Unless the fish are biting.......

Larry

the small parts guide is a good investment for 1" rails, or you can make one, but something needs to steady the tool on narrow stock. You still have to do layout like for biscuits, we used to use ff biscuits on narrow rails then chop out the extra and cover it with bead on insets, works fine but the domino gets you tenon strength in less time, I usually make rail slots tight and stile slots loose and stack the frames using gauge blocks or clamp them to layout marks if that's too much depending on how complex the frame is. But you could run the both tight if your layout is spot on. I only set up the slot mortiser for big and deep holes.

[Chris Fournier]

283474283475Mine runs off my MM jointer planer and I like it alot. I made a Euro beech kitchen and the upper cabinets doors were rail and stile with glazed 1/4" safety glass (chromed wire mesh in glass). I wanted a strong joint as the doors were a bit heavy and the joinery required a fair bit of room in a crowded joint. Attached is an image of the smallest rail used in a corner cabinet bi-fold door. The mortiser is so solid that the mortise is perfection. I love this machine but a run will give me a neck ache!

[Rick Fisher]

There are two styles.. On the lower end ones, ( mostly ) .. the table moves and the motor stays put.

On the higher end machines, ( other than the double ender's ) .. The table stays stationary and the head moves.

Felder, Griggio, Paoloni, Houfek and the Laguna which is made by Stomana all have moving heads. There is probably more.

Fixed head mortiser's can be cheaper .. Hammer, Laguna etc. but not as useful for big stuff.

I would look at Martin USA.. They sell the Griggio and seem to always have them on sale.. Seemed cheap.

[jack forsberg]

There are two styles.. On the lower end ones, ( mostly ) .. the table moves and the motor stays put.




Personally i like the fixed head machine better then the walk away ones and in particular the German Bauerle with its massive bearings. probably the best slot mortiser ever made for custom work. I real nice lump of iron.

283556

http://holz.fordaq.com/fordaq/srvAuctionView.html?AucTIid=17905288

[Jaromir Svoboda]

I bough Rojek VDA 316 today.:)

[Peter Quinn]

Contrats! My Laguna is a chinese copy of the Royek, it gets the job done! Enjoy that machine.

[Rick Potter]

Let us hear how you like it Jaromir. We don't hear much about Rojek.

Rick Potter

[Greg Hines, MD]

I would like that too.

[Jim Andrew]

How about a review of the Rojek?

[Frank Drew]

There are two styles.. On the lower end ones, ( mostly ) .. the table moves and the motor stays put.

On the higher end machines, ( other than the double ender's ) .. The table stays stationary and the head moves.



On mine, an Italian CM72-TG, the head moved in and out and the table right and left. It was 3hp, 3ph, and it made me a total horizontal slot mortiser fanboy. You occasionally see them on machinery auction sites, but in my next life I might look for a Bauerle!

[jack forsberg]

On mine, an Italian CM72-TG, the head moved in and out and the table right and left. It was 3hp, 3ph, and it made me a total horizontal slot mortiser fanboy. You occasionally see them on machinery auction sites, but in my next life I might look for a Bauerle!

You stop looking after you get the Bauerle:p

[Edward Oleen]

Go to Woodgears.ca - Matthias Wandel's site - and look at his horizontal mortiser, and then at his panarouter. The horizontal mortiser does mortises quite nicely. The panarouter does mortises, tenons, and a whole bunch of other stuff.

He built his out of plywood. A metal version is available.

[Joe Calhoon]

We had a Kolle like the one on Woodgears and regret selling that one. It replaced a old SCM cast iron mortiser on a J/P. I can say the type where the head moves is far better and more versatile than the movable table type. If you like the old iron here is a nice one.
Joe

286899

[mreza Salav]

I am for now past the jobs (making many doors) that need such a machine but considered seriously getting an attachment for my Minimax J/P, then a dedicated slot mortiser machine, and then consdiered Festool 700.
I know these bigger machines can do slightly longer and wider mortises but comparing to Festool 700, how many applications are there that Festool falls short in terms of strength?
The space it takes, how verstaile it is, ease of use on large pieces (moving a small machine vs. a large piece) and the price point, seems it should be a clear winner in most cases.

[jack forsberg]

Mo I think if you after square work the festool will do but if you do complex angles that are not generally held to a fence plate or your slot is not hidden by shoulders in the joinery than a slot mortiser is the tool.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaWq-OcTwPg



I am for now past the jobs (making many doors) that need such a machine but considered seriously getting an attachment for my Minimax J/P, then a dedicated slot mortiser machine, and then consdiered Festool 700.
I know these bigger machines can do slightly longer and wider mortises but comparing to Festool 700, how many applications are there that Festool falls short in terms of strength?
The space it takes, how verstaile it is, ease of use on large pieces (moving a small machine vs. a large piece) and the price point, seems it should be a clear winner in most cases.

[Peter Quinn]

Mo I think if you after square work the festool will do but if you do complex angles that are not generally held to a fence plate or your slot is not hidden by shoulders in the joinery than a slot mortiser is the tool.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaWq-OcTwPg


Agreed, there are cuts where its much easier to jig up a slot mortiser, but that particular cut above looks like it could easily be jigged with a quick wedge on the fence using the festool. Am I wrong? I wanted a machine with angle capability, like the griggio or felder units (or at least they used to have) for louvering capacity, but truth is its something I rarely need, but I imaging it could come in real hand for some people .

[jack forsberg]

two wedges i would think as its is center line too and in this case there is no shoulder on the joint member of the Wagner chair so the slots and bit size are paramount in this one . but that was not my point. the point being that the piece is clamped and more accurate than a festool .

[Albert Lee]

I have a horizontal mortiser that came as part of my combination machine. never used it though. its faster to use Domino.

[mreza Salav]

Jack, if you can secure that piece (as in the video) to a table then you can use Festool on it easily. I can imagine odd angels in which a slot mortiser could be easier than Festool...
But Domino is easier/faster to use (at a fraction of the space/price). I have the little one and wish I had bought the 700 for all the doors I made.