sharpening plane blade issue

[Adrian Anguiano]

So I flattened the back of the blade then turned it around and ground a primary bevel of 25 degrees then using my veritas jig turned the knob twice to make a secondary bevel and did a few strikes and a small secondary bevel arrived. But no burr formed on the back of the blade. So I did more strokes and more strokes, the bevel grew but still no burr. I took a pic Of the blade.

It seems no matter how much I do pull strokes I can't get a burr but when u use a magnifying glass on the tip of the blade there is always a small sliver near the tip that won't go away.

Any clues?

[David Weaver]

What grit of stone are you using for your secondary bevel?

[Adrian Anguiano]

1000 shapton pro

[Sean Hughto]

Was there a burr when you ground the primary bevel? If not, perhaps you have simply not brought the two planes of the blade (back and bevel) together yet.

[Adrian Anguiano]

I didn't go all the way with the primary bevel. Got close then started making a secondary to save time.

The only other thought I have is that this is an old plane and iron. Old Stanley. Maybe the metal is soft and the micro bevel from the veritas jig only makes a 1-2° micro bevel and maybe its drawing the iron outward and not up.

[David Weaver]

did you raise a large burr when you ground the primary bevel? It looks like the primary may have come short of the edge- is the smooth spot at the side of the bevel on one of the pictures where the stone is contacting the primary? The shapton pro 1k will raise a healthy burr.

What's the surface of the shapton like, is it fresh and clean? recently lapped?

[Adrian Anguiano]

The spot on the side was the only spot that didn't get touched when I made the primary bevel. But since it was towards the heel I said screw it. The tip was freshly profiled.

[David Weaver]

A stanley iron should raise a nice fat wire edge on a shapton. Softer irons of a given type of steel will raise a bigger wire edge. What are you using to grind the primary bevel?

[Adrian Anguiano]

Ill try going to the edge with the primary bevel first. Maybe since its only a 1-2° bevel its not severe enough to make up the difference in me not going to the very edge with the primary bevel.

[Adrian Anguiano]

I was doing the primary on the shapton. Was just getting tired after about an hour of sharpening the back and primary.

[David Weaver]

What's the chance that you can track down some 80 grit sandpaper at home depot? 3m or norton 3x or whatever they are choosing to carry for high prices these days?

You need something a bit coarser to grind the primary bevel. Either a norton crystolon oilstone or sandpaper if you don't want to use a grinder (norton crystolon - a new one, not a vintage one - will easily grind stanley blades fast.

[David Weaver]

Portable belt sander will work, too, and if you don't force it, won't have much chance of burning the edge of the iron.

[Adrian Anguiano]

Yeah I will go take a look tomorrow.

[David Weaver]

If you don't have something flat, get yourself a cheap flat polished piece of stone flooring. Should be a couple of bucks. That'll be plenty flat for bevel grinding.

[Steve Friedman]

From the pictures, it looks like the old secondary bevel is at a higher angle, which is why the edge isn't getting touched by the stone. I would just re-set the blade in the jig to 30 degrees and hone the secondary bevel on the 1000 grit stone at the higher angle. If it still isn't hitting the edge, bump it to 35 degrees. Should take less than 20 strokes.

As David said, getting the primary bevel to 25 degrees is easy with 80 grit sandpaper. Not so easy with a 1000 grit stone. But, there is no reason to do it all at once. Just live with a 30 or 35 degree microbevel for now. Over time, as you resharpen the blade, you'll be removing some steel from the primary bevel, making it easy to reduce the angle of the microbevel over time.

By the way, a 30X loop is great, but a Sharpie is indispensable. With a Sharpie, you can see whether the stone is hitting the edge with just a couple of strokes.

Steve

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

By the way, a 30X loop is great, but a Sharpie is indispensable. With a Sharpie, you can see whether the stone is hitting the edge with just a couple of strokes.


Plus on that . . . a few lines helps a lot.

I had a similar problem years ago using the Veritas jig. Turned out I *started* in the microbevel position, and then went back to the standard bevel position at the end, and was wondering what was going wrong . . .

[Adrian Anguiano]

Joshua no worried there. That was the first thing I checked. : )

[Adrian Anguiano]

Well I sharpened the primary bevel the entire way and that sliver of metal did go away. Still no burr that I can feel but I think its due to crappy metal and a small 1° microlevel

[Doug Bowman]

Any time I do not go through and raise a burr on my coarsest sharpening media I am wasting my time going to finer media. I try time and time again and always wind up going back and raising a burr. It is fundamental for me and I keep trying to short change it.

[Tony Shea]

You still need to get that burr especially if your working with a Shapton 1000. As David said this stone should create a healthy burr. It is not about the micro bevel being steep enough, you need to get that burr on the primary bevel before you can switch and focus on the micro. You are just not getting the bevel to meet up with the back plane if you are not getting a burr. To be sure you get that situation you should bring your primary all the way until you feel a burr and grinding the primary on a 1000 grit waterstone is not going to be a fun job. You need something a lot coarser.

[Scott Rud]

So I flattened the back of the blade then turned it around and ground a primary bevel of 25 degrees then using my veritas jig turned the knob twice to make a secondary bevel and did a few strikes and a small secondary bevel arrived. But no burr formed on the back of the blade. So I did more strokes and more strokes, the bevel grew but still no burr. I took a pic Of the blade.

It seems no matter how much I do pull strokes I can't get a burr but when u use a magnifying glass on the tip of the blade there is always a small sliver near the tip that won't go away.

Any clues?
Have you used that jig with success before? I ask because it appears that you secondary bevel is not even across the blade. I had the same experience with that jig when using that knob to create the micro bevel. This was happening to me on a shoulder plane iron where have the cutting edge square is pretty important. To create the micro/secondary bevel with the Veritas honing jig, I keep the roller in the same position and reposition the blade/iron.

Before anyone asks, yes, I had the clamp screws tightened equally and I rechecked the position of the iron about 20 times to ensure that it had not moved. When I moved the roller back to it's original position, things where square with the world again.

It's my opinion that the micro bevel adjustment on the roller is worthless so I use it in it's original position at all times. For most of my honing, I've gone to the cheap $14 jig and Lie Nielsen and numerous other places, sell. Simple and reliable...

[Adrian Anguiano]

Tony I know I'm hitting to the very edge. I use black marker and its definitely getting to the end. Which made me think brittle metal.

Scott I did have success with the jig with my lie Nielsen block plane and the edge was perfectly parallel. I just did a chisel last night and the micro bevel wasn't perfectly parallel but I think that is due to it being in the holder slightly in parallel. The way toy get the blade parallel seems a little less accurate but I'm not sure. I usually don't care to much on the parallel reveal, just that I have 1/16 or so of edge across the entire edge.

[Adrian Anguiano]

Ill take another picture of it of where it is now.... ive been shapening all my stuff this past week, Ill see where its left off last