Anybody else ever wonder this?

[Joe Kieve]

Why contractors use torx security screws, (you know the ones with the little protrusion inside), in public restrooms. :confused:
I've noticed that most of the partitions in men's restrooms have these. What...are they afraid someones going to steal them!

Just my dumb curiosity I guess.

joe

[Charles Wiggins]

I've not seen Torx screws so much as one-way screws. The have raised ridges diagonally from each other so that they can be turned to the right to tighten, but not turned to the left and loosened.

My dad used to sell contract hardware like doors, locks, toilet partitions, etc. The main reason is to reduce vandalism. Kids will remove toilet partition doors and walls just to inconvenience folks thinking it's "funny."

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[Brian Elfert]

Aren't the tools to remove security torx screws sold at pretty much every hardware store? Security that can be defeated that easily isn't much for security.

This is almost as silly as the Indak keys used on lots of power equipment. The same key that is used on a $500 snowblower and a $1500 lawn tractor is also used on $20,000 Toro commercial riding mowers. I worked at a place that would park the riding mowers outdoors for part of the year where anybody with a generic Indak key could drive off with them.

[glenn bradley]

Vandals are mindless zombies that are on a constant search for really stupid things to do :D

[Brian W Smith]

Reminds me of a "wet paint" or,"please don't touch" sign....just sayin.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

The main reason is to reduce vandalism. Kids will remove toilet partition doors and walls just to inconvenience folks thinking it's "funny."



I owned a couple restaurants in a previous attempt at capitalism that I'd rather forget. Charles nailed it. BTW, you'd be shocked to know how old some of those idiot "kids" were.

[curtis rosche]

Aren't the tools to remove security torx screws sold at pretty much every hardware store? Security that can be defeated that easily isn't much for security.
.

most people wont bother if they have to take a tool with them

[Jerome Stanek]

Aren't the tools to remove security torx screws sold at pretty much every hardware store? Security that can be defeated that easily isn't much for security.

This is almost as silly as the Indak keys used on lots of power equipment. The same key that is used on a $500 snowblower and a $1500 lawn tractor is also used on $20,000 Toro commercial riding mowers. I worked at a place that would park the riding mowers outdoors for part of the year where anybody with a generic Indak key could drive off with them.

Also a $100,000 backhoe or dozer

[Dave Sheldrake]

The average zombie vandal is an opportunist, they are unlikely to carry anything with them past a cheap copy of a swiss army knife with it's attached chocolate screwdrivers. If their mighty IQ (of around 50) doesn't get a result in under 5 seconds they will lose interest and move on.

Safety screws buy time, they aren't designed top dissuade the professional scumbag.

cheers

Dave

[John Coloccia]

I'll tell you why. For several years, I worked on a project that lived out at Edwards Air Force Base (EAFB). Well, there's little part of EAFB where we test all sorts of whacky things called the Birk Test Flight Facility. It's not Fort Knox, but you don't get in to EAFB unless you have a reason to be there, and you don't get into Birk unless you have a reason to get THERE. It's a very serious place, you don't screw around, you mind your own business and you do your thing.

One day, I walked into the men's room and someone had shoved about 4 rolls of toilet paper in a toilet, pulled the handle a few times and flooded it. Absolutely juvenile thing to do and completely shocking to me. I just couldn't believe that someone at this level could be so incredibly immature, but it doesn't matter where you are. There is always some idiot that's going to flood a toilet, there's always some idiot that's going to loosen the top on a salt shaker, and there's always some idiot that's going to take apart a men's room stall.

Why? What the heck do I know why? We all start out with a head full of mush, and some of us never ripen I guess.

[Pat Barry]

Its called job security, plain and simple. WHo has ever seen a vandalized public restroom anyway?

[Joe Kieve]

Thanks Guys for enlightening me. I've seen plenty of filthy ones but I had no idea there was so much vandalism in public restrooms.

Thanks for your responses.

joe

[paul cottingham]

Its called job security, plain and simple. WHo has ever seen a vandalized public restroom anyway?
Seen plenty of them, in point of fact.

[curtis rosche]

Its called job security, plain and simple. WHo has ever seen a vandalized public restroom anyway?

about every dive bar lol

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Also a $100,000 backhoe or dozer

And all John Deere tractors and combines.

[Andrew Joiner]

shhhhhhhh
Somewhere there's a vandal reading this thinking ---"yeah, I'll buy special screwdriver NO an Indak key and use a dozer to RIP those partitions out!"

[Charles Wiggins]

I owned a couple restaurants in a previous attempt at capitalism that I'd rather forget. Charles nailed it. BTW, you'd be shocked to know how old some of those idiot "kids" were.

Good point. I was speaking more in terms of adolescent behavior more so than actual age.

[Rich Engelhardt]

shhhhhhhh
Somewhere there's a vandal reading this thinking ---"yeah, I'll buy special screwdriver NO an Indak key and use a dozer to RIP those partitions out!"

Too late......

I already read the whole thread ! :D LOL!

[Larry Whitlow]

Aren't the tools to remove security torx screws sold at pretty much every hardware store? Security that can be defeated that easily isn't much for security.

This is almost as silly as the Indak keys used on lots of power equipment. The same key that is used on a $500 snowblower and a $1500 lawn tractor is also used on $20,000 Toro commercial riding mowers. I worked at a place that would park the riding mowers outdoors for part of the year where anybody with a generic Indak key could drive off with them.

I always thought those were all about safety rather than anti-theft -- to keep random kids from starting the equipment and wreaking havoc with themselves or someone's property.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

The vandalism got so bad in parts of my workplace that they had to install the same badge readers in the restrooms that you use to get into other secure places, in the hopes they could narrow down the pool of idiots to the particular idiots who were destroying things.

When you've had too much coffee and really need to go in the morning, it's a pain in the rear to find out that the nearest ones shut down because someone thought it'd be funny to muck things up . . .

[Jeff Erbele]

I've not seen Torx screws so much as one-way screws. The have raised ridges diagonally from each other so that they can be turned to the right to tighten, but not turned to the left and loosened.

My dad used to sell contract hardware like doors, locks, toilet partitions, etc. The main reason is to reduce vandalism. Kids will remove toilet partition doors and walls just to inconvenience folks thinking it's "funny."

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+ 1 The only purpose of "Screwy Screws" is to reduce vandalism.

There is no way to fully eliminate this problem economically, legally and ethically.
One effective method might be, (with fair warning and legal consent), is if you touch the screws, they blow your hand off.
A most radical solution that makes the point of the complexity of the problem.

Cameras may help as do rest room attendants but at a greater on-going cost. Then there are the legal and privacy problems of placing cameras capturing private parts and private business, where the un-screwing of privacy stalls occurs; from the inside out.

Wells Fargo and Brinks armed guards with shotguns and .357's simply cost to much for the risk/reward/overhead, and simply are not well received.
*Other radical solutions, no matter how well justified; not acceptable or tolerated; thus we have "Screwy Screws" instead.

Why do people feel a need to write on indoor public, "outhouse walls", much less dismantle privacy screens, who does it and why? Don't know.

Vandalism by nature is a stupid crime, perhaps the stupidest. Theft makes more sense; not much but at least someone benefits. Vandalism simply makes objects of use, unusable to everybody.

On only a hunch, my guess is there are some greater mental or at a personal level, self-esteem issues that cause people to vandalise.

My guess is, it is the same category of people that tend to get in trouble otherwise, and for the factors of why they end up that way.

All I can do is set the example and pick a youngster or two, take an interest in them and mentor my heart out; which I do.

[Kev Williams]

You can remove those 1-way screws with a regular screwdriver if you're patient.

But you can't remove them with the tool of choice of most bathroom-wall vandals...

-- a dime.




..

[John Coloccia]

Vandalism by nature is a stupid crime, perhaps the stupidest. Theft makes more sense; not much but at least someone benefits. Vandalism simply makes objects of use, unusable to everybody.

When I was in South Korea, my Korean counterparts took me out almost every night....and I took them out some nights...LOL. Anyhow, my first night in the subway, I marveled at all of the stone carvings. Things like oil lamps carved out of stone..a soldier on his horse, for example. So I asked them, "Boy, it must take a lot of work keeping them in this sort of condition."

They looked at me like I had two heads. "What do you mean?". So I explained what I meant...graffiti, vandalism, etc.

"We're proud of our history and culture. Why would anyone want to do such a thing?? This is our home. I don't understand."

Good point.

[Alan Caro]

Joe Kieve,

I'm not aware of the cult of roving teenage bathroom disassemblers, but Torx hardware is quite common in non-vandalism situations- look at a modern car engine. I have a CD player with Torx fittings to the covers.

The way I think of Torx is as a screw masquerading as a bolt or perhaps an introverted bolt. Compared to a bolt or screw, there is proportionally far more surface area engaged between the tool and fitting and the tool is far more accurate fitting, probably as accurate or moreso than a socket. The advantages of the greater engagement surface is that more torque can be applied to a smaller fitting, the head can be smaller diameter than a conventional screw or hex bolt, and like a countersunk screw, a Torx may be flush to the surface. There are of course projecting Torx and again the idea is to allow the head to be smaller but still with more engagement surface. The round shape and the fact that the shaft of a Torx driver is thinner than a socket is also a space saver. This seems extreme but having the tool be an interior fitting is also important. With car assemblies such as engines transmissions there is often not room for even a socket thickness. Until the 1970's, you could do anything with an adjustable wrench, then I noticed I had to buy Snap On wrenches because the wrench end was thinner, then there was an age of only sockets, to sockets with thinner walls, and onto thin sockets on jointed extensions, and finally Torx. When working on a 1928 Packard, I could just climb in with engine. Today, opening a car hood, there appears to be an impenetrable single mass, flush to the top.

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No Torx fittings whatsoever

I'll bet there's a Neanderthal metalworking forum somewhere for people who only use rivets,...

Alan Caro

"No matter your wealth, power, or health, the cheapest things in Life are free."

[Mike Henderson]

Its called job security, plain and simple. Who has ever seen a vandalized public restroom anyway?

This post must be an attempt at humor. I've seen so many vandalized public restrooms that I couldn't even count them. It seems almost impossible to not have run into a vandalized rest room in your life.

Mike