A Panel Gauge I Made

[Chris Griggs]

I've been getting by doing handwork without a panel gauge for far to long, so I decided to make one this past week. Even when I rip on the bandsaw, I like to have a scored line to plane to so its a tool that has been sorely needed.

A fun easy little project, and you end up with a useful tool. I didn't document the build, but I'm guessing a lot of you have made these before, and if you haven't its pretty easy to figure out just by looking at pictures.

This one is walnut. One side has a pencil and for the other I made a cutter out of a piece of an old bandsaw blade. I also filed some ridges into the wedge and roughed up the surface with a cheap rasp, this seemed to make it a little easier to get the wedge to grip, and overall the tool works well.

Definitely, a tool worth making for yourself.

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[Dave Beauchesne]

Very nice Chris!
Love the color of the walnut - you will find it a useful tool I am sure.

[David Weaver]

Big fan of the triangular beam!

[Chris Griggs]

Big fan of the triangular beam!

HA! Yes, I took your advice on the beam. Was great advice!

[Jim Belair]

I'm getting ready to make one and am curious how you secured the cutter.

[Chris Griggs]

Hi Jim.

First I ground down the tip of a screw so that the tip would be flat. I then used the screws length to locate where the slot would be. I wanted the screw to be almost fully seated when it reached the cutter. With the cutter slot marked out, I drilled it out on the drill press with the smallest drill bit I had and then cleaned it up with a small very thin file. I then clamped the beam upright in my vise and used a hand drill to bore the hole in the end grain that the securing screw would go in. I cut the threads in the hole using a screw identical to the one I had ground down but that still had is pointy tip (just cause it was easier that way), and then screed in the ground down screw to secure the cutter.

Hope that all makes sense. If you blow up the 2nd picture you can see the screw that secures the cutter going into the end grain of the beam.

[william sympson]

Chris, a question on the wedge action given that I have one of these on my "to build" list. I haven't studied the tool but when mentally reviewing the design, I had assumed that the wedge would need to be perpendicular to the beam to avoid having the stock move when tightening the wedge. Your experience to date on moving the stock when tightening the wedge?

William

[Chris Griggs]

Yes it can and does move when you tighten it down, but its not hard to prevent. You just kinda need to pay attention and hold it in place so it doesn't. One often ends up dialing in the setting with a few taps on the bench anyway. Just make sure when you set it you error on the side that will tighten, not loosen the wedge when you make fine adjustments by tapping the beam on the bench. For example my wedge tightens when I push it towards the cutter and away from the pencil, so if I'm setting the gauge for the cutter side its better if I end up a little short, so then when I tap the beam, if the wedge moves it will only be tighter. Really though, its not hard to just set it right and then hold the setting has you are tightening the wedge...hand pressure gets it tight enough so you not driving the beam out of place, in the same way that setting a wedge on the plane can drive the iron deeper.

[Will Boulware]

Great work! Maybe this will motivate me to finally make one of these. Thanks for the description of the blade retention screw!

[Mike Holbrook]

Nice Chris, adding this project to my long list. So I am hoping you will keep us updated on any changes or upgrades you might come up with.

[Chris Griggs]

Thanks guys.

Well Mike, probably won't be any major upgrades. I guess I wouldn't mind have a thick piece of 01 for the cutter, but other than that its a pretty basic tool and there isn't much to upgrade (within the the realm of the basic wedged design anyway)

[Mike Allen1010]

Very nice Chris! The panel gauge is the neander equvilent of the TS rip fence. I use mine all the time for large glued up panels. After 2 versions I learned:

I like the round cutters from Lee valley because their self limiting depth of cutis less likely to follow the grain than the shop made blades in my first version.

Length of reference face is key! For laying out parrell side for large case size panels (+24"), a 12" reference fence is better for keeping the cutter parrell to the ref. Edge than an 8" fence.

IMHO anyone w/ a panel gauge has no worries about their neander qualifications!

Cheers, Mike

[Noah Wagener]

Fahrvergnugen.

[Chris Griggs]

I'm with you all the way on the round cutter Mike, but rather than ordering round spurs I just grind my not round-spur style marking gauges with a round edge. I find the rounded cutting edge cuts much truer and I'm also careful not set them too deep, as a light scoring passes are also much easier to keep accurate.

Here's a close-up if the cutter on my panel gauge, along with the cutter I rounded on a store bought marking gauge...not sure if you can tell from the 3rd picture but I even round the tip of my marking knife a little so its less likely to follow the grain.

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Nice tip for the wider gauge. Mine is about 8 inches. The beam is around 23 inches which gives me a max reach of about 20". I was going to make longer but its rare I need that much capacity so I figure I'll just make a second one if I need that capacity. I'm actually half tempted to cut the beam on this one down to more like 14"-16" which will cover 99% of my needs (and be less clunky) and then make one with something like a 30" beam for case sides and stuff...if I do that I'll be sure to make the fence a good 12" wide. Thanks for the tip!

[Noah Wagener]

Yes it can and does move when you tighten it down, but its not hard to prevent. You just kinda need to pay attention and hold it in place so it doesn't. One often ends up dialing in the setting with a few taps on the bench anyway. Just make sure when you set it you error on the side that will tighten, not loosen the wedge when you make fine adjustments by tapping the beam on the bench. For example my wedge tightens when I push it towards the cutter and away from the pencil, so if I'm setting the gauge for the cutter side its better if I end up a little short, so then when I tap the beam, if the wedge moves it will only be tighter. Really though, its not hard to just set it right and then hold the setting has you are tightening the wedge...hand pressure gets it tight enough so you not driving the beam out of place, in the same way that setting a wedge on the plane can drive the iron deeper.

have you ever tried a twist lock style? the tightening motion is parallel to direction of cut. I do not think you could have a rabbetted fence though.

[Chris Griggs]

have you ever tried a twist lock style? the tightening motion is parallel to direction of cut. I do not think you could have a rabbetted fence though.

Nope. Had never even heard of it. Had to Google it. Looks neat. I think the wedge works fine though, and its easy to make.

[Noah Wagener]

In browsing these things i see only Japanese ones with a rabbate fence like yours. I think that would feel real secure. They put the wedge on the side so that they can move the cutter tight to the fence and even notch it so they can go under the rabbett. That must be for mortising where yours is for marking ripping and would not need to mark so close to the edge?

Those twist ones look easy to make too but in casual researching i see things like split the parabola by the golden ratio and use Archimedes principle to....

I would think just an oval bar in an oval hole would suffice. Apparantely there is a patent on the actual fitting.

I see the German influence in yours as well. (^_^)

Is that avatar you? I always think of Kim Jong Il and Evelle from Raising Arizona

[Chris Griggs]

Mine is based entirely on pictures I found online. I don't know anything about panel gauges other than pictures I saw online. Google image "panel gauge". Every picture that comes up has a rabbet. I wasn't sure why, but I just did it because that's what I saw. Now that I've used it some I can say that it makes referencing easier.

No that avatar is not me. Its a charactor named Bubbles from the Canadian TV show "Trailer Park Boys"

[Noah Wagener]

I see. I was only looking at mortise gauges or generic marking gauges. Looks good. Slug bug walnut.

[george wilson]

The triangular beam is a good idea. It can't swing about any while scribing once the wedge is tight.

[allen long]

I too wondered about your avatar. However, I was a bit afraid to ask!

Back to the discussion about your most excellent gauge. I tried to find the twist lock mechanism mentioned in the discussion. What were the search terms used to Google it?

Many kind regards . . . Allen

[Chris Griggs]

I think this is what Noah was talking about. Correct, Noah?

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[Chris Griggs]

The triangular beam is a good idea. It can't swing about any while scribing once the wedge is tight.

Yeah, its very beneficial. I would have had no idea to do that, but thankfully I mentioned to Dave I was making a panel gauge and he made the suggestion and explained it to me. He's a bright guy.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Chris

I'm a bit late to the party, but want to add that I really like the triangular beam. On the other hand I am not fond of wedges for adjustment and holding. A screw onto a metal plate offers both easier adjustment and better clamping.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[george wilson]

In the 18th. C.they used wedges more often than screws for making small tools and planes. While I agree that screws are better,wedges will work if used carefully. Screws required expensive taps and screw boxes to make. Most people back then didn't have the money.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi George
Clearly wedges work. Indeed, the panel gauge that Chris has made is excellent, and I would be happy owning and using one like it. However - being critical for the purpose of discussion to decide the best design - if one were making a panel or cutting gauge, a screw allows for one-handed operation, and its variable pressure makes for easier adjustment. If those toolmakers of the 18C could have made a cost-effective screw, the wedge would not have had a look in.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Chris Griggs]

Thanks for your comments guys!

I do agree Derek that a screw is superior in terms of ease of use. I made mine with a wedge because I didn't have any hardware, and wanted to start using my gauge.

I also just kinda wanted to try making a wedging one. Wedges are cooler. :) There is just something neat about them and its very satisfying to carefully lay things out, take time to fit the wedge well, and then get to see it hold so well.

But anyway, yes, I agree that a screw is easier to use, and can potentially hold tighter. Your comments are well taken Derek. It was definitely worth bringing up and something one should think about in making a panel gauge.

I'd just rather be cool than practical ;)

(Honestly, even though I am very happy with the wedge, if I had had some hardware I probably would have made it with a screw)

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Chris

Not only is it cool, yours is altogether much nicer than the one I built. I was struck by the triangulation of the beam. It reminded me of the design used by Chris Vesper. Chris V does not actually use a triangular beam, but his beam, although square-looking, wedges in a similar manner (I cannot say how or Chris V would kill me). Yours is a more logical design. I'm going to copy it if I may.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[george wilson]

I can keep Vesper's secrets,but in turn,he has promised to keep my ergonomic long string for turning on my exhaust fan a secret.

[Chris Griggs]

Hi Chris

Not only is it cool, yours is altogether much nicer than the one I built. I was struck by the triangulation of the beam. It reminded me of the design used by Chris Vesper. Chris V does not actually use a triangular beam, but his beam, although square-looking, wedges in a similar manner (I cannot say how or Chris V would kill me). Yours is a more logical design. I'm going to copy it if I may.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Thanks Derek. Please copy away. It is the highest form of flattery!

I'm actually already very sincerely flattered that my little shop project generated so much interest/discussion...especially among the likes you and George.

[Chris Griggs]

Derek. I was just looking back at yours. It's quite nice looking. I took particular interest in how you secure the pencil side with a screw in the same way I secured my cutter. I'm actually not quite happy with how the "kerf, tightened down with a nut and screw, over the hole" works and like the single screw for my cutter better. Not sure why I didn't think to do the same thing with the pencil side, but I think I'm going to cut and inch off and redo the pencil holder to be like the cutter side of mine and like yours.

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[Noah Wagener]

Yeah that's it. I've seen some more rustic looking ones without those grooves as well. All the gauges i had ever seen were those rosewood/ brass ones or the round brass fence ones. Then a Japanese one somewhat like yours popped up on ebay i really liked it. I am glad you did not have any hardware. I like simple looking things. And the cam lock ones have one less moving part. Allen, i think cam lock is a better term to look up.


What are the principle uses of large gauges like yours?


I have to see that show to see if Bubbles is as sadistic as he looks to me.

[Chris Griggs]

I have to see that show to see if Bubbles is as sadistic as he looks to me.

Bubbles is actually the opposite of sadistic. He's like the one character in the show who is kinda a good person.

Wiki has a good description http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubbles_%28Trailer_Park_Boys_character%29#Bubbles

[David Weaver]

He's a bright guy.

That's funny :) I just know who to copy. For the life of me, I can't find a picture of the stanley gauge that gave me that idea, but it is a panel gauge version of the stanley 65 marking gauge. There was one hanging on a wall in fayetteville, pa at a tool shop for about $10 and I stupidly didn't buy it after thinking about why it was triangular.

Maybe 6 or 7 years ago now, walt quadrato sold me a rosewood stanley 85 gauge without markings on it for $25, so my gauge is still of the wobbly persuasion. It works fine despite that, but I'd make one triangular, too if I was going to do it again. But it would've been smarter for me to buy the one I saw.

Anyone know what number that might have been? (there are pictures of the stanley 65 marking gauge, but the 85 1/2 is the panel gauge that shows up everywhere).

[Derek Cohen]

Derek. I was just looking back at yours. It's quite nice looking. I took particular interest in how you secure the pencil side with a screw in the same way I secured my cutter. I'm actually not quite happy with how the "kerf, tightened down with a nut and screw, over the hole" works and like the single screw for my cutter better. Not sure why I didn't think to do the same thing with the pencil side, but I think I'm going to cut and inch off and redo the pencil holder to be like the cutter side of mine and like yours.

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No Chris, mine is crap. The best way to hold a pencil is in a slotted hole that can be tightened. The screw in mine will dig into a pencil if tightened too much. I don't know what I was thinking about when I made it!

Also bad is the position of the adjustment screw, which is at the side (like the Colen Clenton gauge behind it) and not on the top (where it would be close to the hand) ..

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Marking%20and%20Measuring/Panel%20Gauge/PanelGauge2.jpg

Better ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/CuttingGauges_html_7fbc86b0.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Chris Griggs]

No Chris, mine is crap. The best way to hold a pencil is in a slotted hole that can be tightened. The screw in mine will dig into a pencil if tightened too much. I don't know what I was thinking about when I made it!


I'm glad you commented on that. After I wrote it I started wondering if the screw digging in would be a problem. The slotted hole does actually work well, but I may still redo mine (with another slotted hole). I located the bolt and nut a little to low so it doesn't squeeze as well as I would like, I haven't really had any issue with the pencil moving in use but I can pull it in and out with the screw/nut tightened down which kinda bugs me.

In addition to locating the bolt/nut that squeezes the kerf higher, I believe I will also replace the hexagonal nut with a square one and epoxy it into a square mortise. That way there will be no issues with it turning when I tighten down the screw, as it currently is I need to sorta squeeze the nut with my finger tips to tighten the kerf.

Finally, (and this is just me being anal), it bugs me that the bolt/knut is polished brass but the screw is steel that I put a baked linseed oil finish on. When I redo the nut/bolt/kerfed hole, I believe I will get a steel nut and bolt and bake some linseed oil onto it to make it match the screw for the cutter.

None of that NEEDS to be done, as the gauge is working fine as it...but I think I'll still do it just because it would make me happier.

[Derek Cohen]

That's funny :) I just know who to copy. For the life of me, I can't find a picture of the stanley gauge that gave me that idea, but it is a panel gauge version of the stanley 65 marking gauge. There was one hanging on a wall in fayetteville, pa at a tool shop for about $10 and I stupidly didn't buy it after thinking about why it was triangular.

Maybe 6 or 7 years ago now, walt quadrato sold me a rosewood stanley 85 gauge without markings on it for $25, so my gauge is still of the wobbly persuasion. It works fine despite that, but I'd make one triangular, too if I was going to do it again. But it would've been smarter for me to buy the one I saw.

Anyone know what number that might have been? (there are pictures of the stanley 65 marking gauge, but the 85 1/2 is the panel gauge that shows up everywhere).

Dave, I have one. It's one of the best designs around for a pin gauge (I've since converted the pin into a knife). But I totally forgot about the triangular beam!

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Marking%20and%20Measuring/Stanley65.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Chris Griggs]

Derek. One condition if you or anyone else uses my design.

You must call it the "Griggs Gauge TM"

Also, please delete that picture of the Stanley gauge. They clearly traveled forward in time and stole my idea.

:)

[David Weaver]

Thanks for posting the picture, Derek. That's exactly the gauge, i still covet one, but I'm cheap.

[David Weaver]

Derek. One condition if you or anyone else uses my design.

You must call it the "Griggs Gauge TM"

Also, please delete that picture of the Stanley gauge. They clearly traveled forward in time and stole my idea.

Any use of the beam can be made only with a moderate donation to a cat related charity and one week without eating meat or using any leather goods or cosmetics or soaps made with tallowate products or tested on animals, too.

Griggs Gauge TM thanks you in advance!

:)

I added a little to it :)

[Chris Griggs]

I added a little to it :)

We have a time travel paradox here.

You got the idea from Stanley, and suggested it to me. But Stanley got the idea from traveling into the future and copying me. But I would have never had the idea if you hadn't seen the Stanley and suggested it to me. Eek gad...which came first...there is no way to determine who gets credit for the design...the blogosphere is sure to implode on itself!!!!

(FWIW, you added a lot. That the triangle beam simply would not have occurred to me and it is KEY)

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Chris

I have deleted the picture of the Stanley gauge ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Marking%20and%20Measuring/gaugeXX_zps5a1368b6.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Chris Griggs]

Hi Chris

I have deleted the picture of the Stanley gauge ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Marking%20and%20Measuring/gaugeXX_zps5a1368b6.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

HA!!!! I love that you stayed until midnight doing THAT! I can't stop laughing!!! You just made my morning! Thanks!

[David Weaver]

We have a time travel paradox here.

You got the idea from Stanley, and suggested it to me. But Stanley got the idea from traveling into the future and copying me. But I would have never had the idea if you hadn't seen the Stanley and suggested it to me. Eek gad...which came first...there is no way to determine who gets credit for the design...the blogosphere is sure to implode on itself!!!!

(FWIW, you added a lot. That the triangle beam simply would not have occurred to me and it is KEY)

No no, I don't mean added anything to the gauge. I mean I added to your legal threat, requirement for cat-related donations and abstinence from all animal products for using the Griggs Gauge TM! :)

[Chris Griggs]

No no, I don't mean added anything to the gauge. I mean I added to your legal threat, requirement for cat-related donations and abstinence from all animal products for using the Griggs Gauge TM! :)

Ah, yes. I like your most recent additions. :) I totally missed that in the quoted text. Fantastic!

Too funny!!! It must be Friday.

(though I still like my time travel paradox)

[David Weaver]

...there is no way to determine who gets credit for the design...

Probably some poor rank and file guy at stanley whose bosses always came to him for design advice when they wanted a bonus, and then told him at the end of the year that he didn't have what it takes to move up in the company (so they could come back and harvest more ideas in the future) :)

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Chris, yours is much nicer than mine!

I swear I've seen discussion of the triangular beam elsewhere, outside of the context of that Stanley gauge. I specifically remember seeing it, because I used a similar method with my panel gauge. My beam had a sort-of-triangular-thing going on in the bottom to keep it from sliding/moving around. Not nearly as attractive, nor probably quite as functional, as Chris' gauge, however. (It does come to more of a point than the close-up shot of the end would have you think - I should have mortised before shaping. I lost a chunk at the end; it's more a five-sided shape than a six-sided one)

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I still need to fettle the wedge a little better - no matter how good it fits, I still sometimes loose my setting. I think a larger wedge like Chris' might be helpful, but mostly, I need a better fit in the arm. The original piece of wood ended up being needed for something, and the replacement doesn't fit as tightly. (Although not nearly as poorly as the photos make it look)

The only downside I've had with mine has been the time that I was tweaking the bar extension with a hammer, and the blade wedge loosened up and I lost the blade in the shavings . . . .

[Steve Voigt]

At the risk of being the guy you wanted to beat up in high school, can I just point out that the beam is trapezoidal? ;)

Chris, I'm very late here, but that's a really nice gauge. I will definitely be stealing the tri- uh, er trapezoidal beam for my next build. Thanks for the inspiration.

[Chris Griggs]

At the risk of being the guy you wanted to beat up in high school, can I just point out that the beam is trapezoidal? ;)

Chris, I'm very late here, but that's a really nice gauge. I will definitely be stealing the tri- uh, er trapezoidal beam for my next build. Thanks for the inspiration.


Dude. What's hilarious! When Dave suggested I make a "triangular beam with a flat bottom". I said the EXACT SAME THING. "Do you mean a trapazoid!"

Really its actually not a trapezoid though, because it has 6 flats...a trapazoid has 4...its and irregular hexagon I believe.

...and thanks for the praise. I look forward to seeing your "Griggs Gauge tm":)

[Steve Voigt]

Really its actually not a trapezoid though, because it has 6 flats...a trapazoid has 4...its and irregular hexagon I believe.

Damn! I was going to go with hexagon, but I thought the smallest sides were chamfers rather than actual sides!

Chris, all fun aside, I have a real question. Is the length of the bottom of the mortise smaller than the bottom of the beam? In other words, does the beam bottom out against the sides of the mortise before it can hit the bottom? Or does it contact 3 sides all at once?

[Chris Griggs]

Damn! I was going to go with hexagon, but I thought the smallest sides were chamfers rather than actual sides!

Chris, all fun aside, I have a real question. Is the length of the bottom of the mortise smaller than the bottom of the beam? In other words, does the beam bottom out against the sides of the mortise before it can hit the bottom? Or does it contact 3 sides all at once?

Make it so it locks in the sides before it bottoms out. That way when the beam shrinks or the mortise wears it still can wedge tight. Mine actually just about bottoms out..but I tried to make it so it wouldn't quite. That's fine though..because its the driest time of year right now and if anything it will only get tighter as the humidity picks up.

[Steve Voigt]

Make it so it locks in the sides before it bottoms out. That way when the beam shrinks or the mortise wears it still can wedge tight. Mine actually just about bottoms out..but I tried to make it so it wouldn't quite. That's fine though..because its the driest time of year right now and if anything it will only get tighter as the humidity picks up.

That's kind of what I thought…makes a lot of sense. An excellent design. Thanks Chris!

[Stanley Covington]

Chris:

Very nicely done. Where do you attach the dust extractor?:D

[Chris Griggs]

Chris:

Very nicely done. Where do you attach the dust extractor?:D

Thanks Stanley! It hooks in under the wedge. Top secret design so I can't explain how.