First end grain bowl struggles

[Tom Porter]

I'm new to turning, having made about 12 bowls (not including 3 or 4 failures). My skills are pretty rough. I decided to try an end grain bowl today out of green elm. I used a face plate and turned the outside with no more trouble than usual (which means a fair amount of catches and tear out as I am still very much getting the hang of things). However, when I reversed it onto my new chuck and tried to start hollowing it out, it was pretty much a disaster. It kept catching so badly the it would tear the bowl out of the chuck. I don't think it's a matter of the chuck not having enough bite on the bowl, though I just got it and thus haven't used it before. I'm using a bowl gouge and a round nose scraper. The catches are happening so quickly and violently that I am not really able figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Anyone have any tips? Is it the angle of the tool? Not sharp enough? I've been searching through the forum but there's a lot to sift through. And I realize learning through tips on forums and trial and error may not be the best approach but my schedule hasn't yet allowed me to join the local turner's club.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Tom - one of those things you learn with turning is that with Endgrain - the direction of cut is reverse of that when turning Facegrain. So, when hollowing an endgrain bowl, you hollow from the center out to the rim - the exact opposite of the direction used for a Facegrain bowl.

[Thomas Canfield]

To add to what Steve said, you can drill a center hole and work from the inside to the outside. A scraper will also cut the end grain in either direction, but I like to push toward the center when possible to avoid "pulling" the piece out of the chuck. If the wood is green, you also need to be checking the tightness of your chuck and that you have the chuck properly seated against a face and not bottomed out inside the chuck. Good luck on your learning curve - be safe.

[Tom Porter]

Thanks, guys. I've been forced to give up on this one. No matter what I did, the bowl get popping out of the chuck. I may have been working with too big a bowl for my first shot at end grain. Frankly, I suspect there are a bunch of factors contributing to my difficulty. I'll go back to face grain for a while until I start to get a little better at this stuff.

[Brian Kent]

Good learning experience. I don't do end grain bowls. Vases and cups and chalices are the widest I will try. Even at that a lot is drilled.

[George Overpeck]

One thing I've noticed about end grain work is that the wood has a different type of strength than face work - almost like you are turning a different species. It seems to want to reject the tool by absorbing shock instead of giving in to the steel. You also probably noticed you were making sawdust instead of shavings - lots and lots of cutting of individual fibres instead of ripping out huge sections. I somewhat get around this by going between centers for as long as possible, it keeps the bouncing down a bit. I'm still diving on some of my hogging cuts so that I can work around the tailstock but then coming outwards for the finishing cuts after I remove most of the bulk.

I think that end grain work is fairly miserable stuff, sometimes when I've been doing a lot I lose touch with the basic fun of turning. More difficult to sand to a great surface, more heartbreaking when you accidentally drop it. The results can be pretty nice though.

[Jamie Donaldson]

I'm willing to bet that tool presentation is your problem. Never use a bowl gouge with the flute pointing up, but angled at about 3 o'clock in the direction of the cut, or parallel with the tool rest. This is a good example of why some quality supervised instruction will radically shorten the learning curve, and lessen the danger of self-injury.

[Eric Gourieux]

Tom,

Don't be discouraged about giving up on this one. One of the mistakes we turners often make is NOT giving up on something but sticking with it to the point of frustration. There are a lot of factors that may cause your problem - chuck isn't holding well (there could be a lot of reasons for this), lathe speed (too slow or too fast), tool presentation (above posts), and many other combinations of things. I agree that finding a seasoned turner to work with you is priceless.

Mound some more side grained blanks on your lathe and start having fun again. With more experience, you will develop the muscle memory and techniques to go for the end grain again.

Where do you live? I don't see that in the info on your post. There may be a Creeker close who is willing to help.