LV & LN plane blade interchangeability

[Ben Wheeler]

Hi All.

I'll preface this by saying I've searched in vain for an answer - if this is an old and boring question, feel free to point me in the right direction!

I currently own one decent plane - a Veritas low angle jack, which I'm pretty happy with. I intend to buy a jointer soon, and a block plane shortly thereafter.

I'd like to know if there are any charts or other sources of information showing blade compatibility of various planes? I'll probably be buying all low angle / bevel up planes, and I like the idea of having multiple tools that can share irons sharpened to different angles.

I'm pretty much just looking at Veritas / Lee Valley and Lie Nielsen.

Thanks in advance for your help!

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

With bevel up planes, I think you'll only be able to share blades between planes of the same manufacturer, and only some. I know, for instance, that some of the Lee Valley bevel-up planes can use the same width blades. I think there may be some overlap with the Lie Nielsen planes, but I'm not certain.

What I do know, is that I don't believe you'll be able to swap back and forth bevel-up blades between the two manufacturers - Lie Nielsen uses a simle slotted blade with a depth adjuster, Lee Valley uses a Norris-style adjuster. Perhaps if you could put the little slotted notch for a Lie Nielsen adjuster in the end of a Lee Valley blade, but that's probably a difficult task to do easily.

The hole through the blade, to allow the cap to screw through and down also needs to be in the right place, although that's probably a little more forgiving.

[glenn bradley]

The LV jointer, low angle jack and BU smoother irons are interchangeable. I bought each one with a different iron and so now have a 25*, 35* and 50* iron for any of them.

[Ben Wheeler]

Sorry, Joshua - I must have been a bit unclear. I was referring to swapping blades between planes of the same brand, so I'd have all Veritas or all Lie Nielsen.

Glenn - thank-you. Interesting that the BU smoother (rather than LA smoother) works with the others. That's counter-intuitive, based on names in any case! Regardless, that's good news since the BU smoother appeals to me.

I think that's me sold then, if I can get the smoother and jointer and use the couple of blades I already own with the LA jack.

Cheers!

[Winton Applegate]

I use these blades with the LV BU smoother (the larger smoother, I think there is a narrower smoother so be careful there) and the #7 LV BU jointer.
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0959.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0959.jpg.html)

My two cents :
I would get the small block plane before the jointer. Second from top in the group photo. Note the optional handles that basically make it into a really nice and PRECISE little #3 size finish plane (about the same size as the coffin smoother). I am not a big fan of monster jointers (or monster finish planes for that matter) though I have a BU and a BD #7. A long straight edge and your smoother or your low angle jack can get you quite far.

For another perspective . . .
Ian Kirby swore by the bedrock Bevel Down #4-1/2 and the LN Bevel Down # 7.
See photos of pages from the article.

He liked those because the blades interchanged and his article on those got me thinking about my own set up.
He said he could do about all he needed to do with those two planes.
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2476_zps0f1674b5.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2476_zps0f1674b5.jpg.html)

http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2477_zps3d0ebeb3.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2477_zps3d0ebeb3.jpg.html)

Personally, now that I have a bunch of use with the wide finish plane, and keeping his #4-1/2 in mind . . .
and if money is no object
yah right
I would recommend, especially for harder wood or the difficult to plane woods, . . .
the narrower finish planes #4 (rather than 4-1/2) or even narrower than a #4 is a good way to go.

That #4-1/2 with an uncambered blade can take some horse power to use on larger surfaces and is kind of too honkin' for smaller work. The some what narrower LV BU smoother and jointer are a bit easier but still . . . in some projects can be serious work.

An example is my coffin smoother which Larry , and the old dudes of yore, have chosen as an ideal finish plane. Top plane in the group photo. Note the narrower blade and I agree.

This guy, that I made, takes the big blade that the #7 and #4-1/2 (if I had that plane) would use. Yep, you need some junk in the trunk to push it. I tend to be in the light weight category.
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_0812_zps06dc6fc3.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_0812_zps06dc6fc3.jpg.html)


Here are some comparitive photos (sorry I got kind of lazy with these).
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2479_zps51498341.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2479_zps51498341.jpg.html)


Group to the left to compare lengths
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2480_zps50d5513b.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2480_zps50d5513b.jpg.html)


Group to the right
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2481_zps29bf364d.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2481_zps29bf364d.jpg.html)


http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2482_zps0ad25f65.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2482_zps0ad25f65.jpg.html)


Blades in same order just stacked (five blades)
http://i801.photobucket.com/albums/yy298/noydb1/IMG_2483_zpsd897b515.jpg (http://s801.photobucket.com/user/noydb1/media/IMG_2483_zpsd897b515.jpg.html)

PS: I tried the LN #4 smoother blade in the LN #7 jointer and it would not work. It was not long enough between the adjuster dog slot and the throat opening. The adjuster on the #7 came unscrewed off the threaded spindle before the edge reached the sole / work.

[Jim Koepke]

There are a few problems with blade interchangeability. For common bench planes using the Stanley/Bailey style depth adjuster many blades with the same size are interchangeable. Problems arise when different cap irons are used on different maker's planes. The distance between the adjustment notch and the leading edge of the chip breaker are different between some makers.

Another consideration is the slots on some blades are narrower than others (I have had Union blades not able to fit over a Bailey lateral adjuster) and finally comes the problem of many modern blades are thicker than some of their ancestors. This can cause a problem between the notch in the chip breaker and the adjustment pawl.

With BU planes Veritas is the only maker to my knowledge that offers a selection of different planes marketed as specifically being able to use the same blades.

The Lie-Nielsen Low Angle Bench Planes either have different blade sizes or in the case of the smoother have a different style of adjuster.

Of course on the old Stanley/Bailey planes as long as the blades were the same width they could be swapped from plane to plane. Not much reason for that in the world of bevel down.

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

Hi All.

I'll preface this by saying I've searched in vain for an answer - if this is an old and boring question, feel free to point me in the right direction!

I currently own one decent plane - a Veritas low angle jack, which I'm pretty happy with. I intend to buy a jointer soon, and a block plane shortly thereafter.

I'd like to know if there are any charts or other sources of information showing blade compatibility of various planes? I'll probably be buying all low angle / bevel up planes, and I like the idea of having multiple tools that can share irons sharpened to different angles.

I'm pretty much just looking at Veritas / Lee Valley and Lie Nielsen.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Hi Ben

I think that you are wandering down the wrong path. Forget about interchangeability of blades. This is a mirage.

You could have two planes with the same width blade, such as a #7 and a #4 1/2, or a BU Jointer and BU Smoother, and yet you will not be able to interchange the blades. Why? Because it is not simply the blade weight, thickness and where the mounting/adjustment holes are located. Importantly, it is how you camber the blade and how much angle you hone on the bevel.

A smoother (such as a BUS) should have a very fine camber, just enough to avoid track lines. I could use this on a LA Jack, but then I do not use a LA Jack for smoothing. I might use a LA Jack as a shooting plane, which is best with a 25 degree straight blade. The BUS would be prepared with a 50 degree bevel. I also want a moderately curved, 25 degree blade for the LA Jack for traversing when preparing boards. I could use this on a BU Jointer as well. Jointer? If you want to match plane, then you need a straight blade. If you do not, you may need a slight curve, a little more than the smoother. What angle? I use 40 degrees.

So you see, it is possible for one to have as many blades as Winton (and not as shiny - but he has a queenbunnymisstressoftheuniverse cracking the whip! :D ... good grief, Winton ... tell us how you achieved that level of shine. I cannot look for long for fear I will go blind!).

Just get the planes you want, for the reasons you want them, rather than because they match. The smoother does not need to be the BUS (it can be if you desire one - fantastic plane). Or you could go to the other end of the scale and get the Small BUS. I love this plane - ask Chris what he thinks of his. Or get a LN #3 or #4 to go with your LV LA Jack. You can you know.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Chris Griggs]

I love this plane - ask Chris what he thinks of his.

:):):) IMHO best BU plane ever made! Love it!

[J. Greg Jones]

Or you could go to the other end of the scale and get the Small BUS. I love this plane...
Same here-just a terrific plane that is a pleasure to use. My BUS doesn't get nearly as much use as it once did since I got the small BU Smoother with a couple of PM-V11 blades. Additionally, the small BU Smoother with an second blade is only about $5 more than the BUS with one blade.

[Winton Applegate]

good grief, Winton ... tell us how you achieved that level of shine. I cannot look for long for fear I will go blind!).
Oh
oh that

I merely have Jeeves polish them when he is doing the silver.
I tried doing it myself once but I got my fingers all black and dirty.
Sorry about the huge photo, left over from other forums where it shows up much smaller. The small photos here are new and I set to smallest setting.

Sure are some nicely divergent modus operandi here for the OP.
Poor guy's head is probably spinning.
Wishes we would just go away and leave him alone.

Well look on the bright side Ben . . .

At least you have excuses aplenty to buy lots of tools and perhaps one or two spare blades, (don't tell Derek).

Just call it "Critical research and Development" if SWMBO starts to ask questions.
Just say :
If this isn't carried out, with out delay mind you, and with TOTAL concentration serious and irrrrrrrrrreversable physical AND mental deterioration could result."

So honey I won't be taking any calls for oh, I don't know . . . the foreseeable future and is there any brain solvent, I mean beer, in the fridge ?

[Winton Applegate]

queenbunnymisstressoftheuniverse
OH ! ! !
That was close. Good thing she didn't see THAT !
She just cruzed through.
If she had there would have been lightening bolts descending on Australia; round abouts your place.
She is a wonderful person and I can't sing her praises long enough or loud enough but when I made up that moniker she made me add the "baby" attached to the "bunny" so no body would get any wrong ideas. (she really has taught wild baby/young rabbits to stop laying in the middle of your street.)

You don't know how close you came.
I suppose Australians are more used to confronting life threatening encounters than we softies in the US but you don't know how close you came.

[Ben Wheeler]

Wow! What a fantastic bunch of responses. Thanks all for the effort.

Winton - those images are very informative. I'm pretty sold on the bevel-up bench planes, just because having used the LAJ for a while, the mechanism makes more sense to me than messing around with a chipbreaker. Plus the versatility of course. And yes, my head is spinning! Mainly because this is a somewhat expensive hobby, and I want to avoid too many false moves when purchasing.

Derek, I was just reading your article this morning about sharpening bevel-up blades, and managed to do so without drawing the conclusion that blade interchange was not so desirable. (It was very early this morning, in my defence.) Lucky you're here in person to pick up the slack! I suppose you could still swap blades around more freely when they're uncambered..

There are both advantages and disadvantages to my current situation - after having done a carpentry apprenticeship, I'm now starting into woodwork with a reasonable budget and little experience, so I won't know the pain of struggling with crappy tools, but it's hard to anticipate which tools are going to be the most useful! At the moment I'm building a workbench which will then be used for making some basic tables, so I'm focusing on that.

Having slight OCD, I find the concept of owning handplanes all by one manufacturer to be very appealing, especially when envisaging them in a beautiful tool case! But I'll try to make each purchase on its merits :-)

Thanks again..