Above Table Dust Collection for the TS

[Andrew Kertesz]

Is it worth the time, money and effort to install and use above the table dust collection on my TS? Any recommendations for good, better, best price ranges?

[John TenEyck]

Mine wasn't much time, no money, and not that much effort.

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I modified an old guard I had from my Sears TS and mounted it to a cantilevered frame attached to a ceiling joist. A vacuum hose off the top of the guard connects at a Y fitting in my DC piping. It's spring loaded, or maybe I should say unloaded, so that the guard barely applies any down force. In use, it captures at least 90% of the sawdust when the board being cut seals both sides of the guard. When one side is open during the cut, the capture rate is probably less than 50%. Some of the commercial designs address this issue with brushes, etc. To me, it isn't that big a deal and I just vacuum afterwards.

John

[Doug Herzberg]

I installed the PSI Woodworking guard http://www.amazon.com/PSI-Woodworking-TSGUARD-Table-Collection/dp/B0006FKJ0U. It was a lot of work. It can be mounted to the ceiling, as I did it, or on the floor and attached to the right side of the saw. I'm from the era when the first thing you did with a new saw was remove and dispose of the blade guard. Since I'm not used to a guard, I find it cumbersome to use this one. It has a 2" hose from the guard to the 4" port which is too stiff to flex with the guard. If I can replace this, I may use the guard more often. Also, I have two table saws, back to back. One is used mostly for ripping and the other for dados and crosscuts. I should have put the guard on the rip saw, which is the one that throws the most dust in my face.

I know there are better guards out there, but this seemed to be the most cost effective to me. Since I don't use it much, I'm glad I didn't spend more.

[Brett Bobo]

Hey Andy,
Admittedly, I've always worked without the OEM blade guard on my saw but recently decided to build my own version. My primary reason was to add the above-table dust collection, followed by incorporating some additional safety by having a guard in place. While good, the commercial versions of what I was looking for were pricey, in my opinion, for setups like Excalibur, Exaktor, Biesemeyer, etc.

The blade guard is made from 1/4" polycarbonate with a 4" flanged dust port. The guard is bolted to perforated telescoping tubing, which is ultimately ceiling mounted, that has a lock pin to set the position above the table saw surface. Overall, the dust collection is very good. While not necessarily inexpensive for the parts at ~$150 all-in, it's certainly a robust setup that didn't take many build hours to complete--it took more time sourcing and planning the design.

[glenn bradley]

I ran the PSI guard for years and found it very useful for ripping or cuts in large panels. I would use it whenever it was safe to do so. Smaller / thinner pieces or using the sled of miter guage don't really work out well but, the guard easily swung out of the way. I used it on a couple of saws but, my latest saw came with one so, I sold the PSI to a forum member.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I love the Felder system, it mounts to the riving knife, and just works. Easy to take off for the few times you don't want it, and doesn't get into the way. I've wondered if anyone has a retrofit for an American style saw that uses the same idea. Of course I can't find a picture, I'll take one tonight if I remember.

[Rod Sheridan]

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This is the riving knife mounted guard Steve was mentioning.

My saw has the same guard and it works very well, the only issue is that you can't use it for non through cuts such as rebating or grooving.

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The above guard is the model I had on my cabinet saw, it could be used for non through cuts as it was mounted to an overarm support.

Eventually I will replace my riving knife mounted guard with another overarm type.

Both types substantially reduced the amount of dust ejected from the blade, and any guard that you leave on the saw is much better than one you remove.

Regards, Rod.

[Doug Herzberg]

Andrew, your thread motivated me to try the thing again. I tried flexing the 2" tube by hand and it seemed like it was becoming a little more pliable when it broke about 8" from the end. (To be fair, it sat around for a year waiting for me to drywall the ceiling and my shop is not heated, but the plastic was pretty stiff even in summer.) The other part of the tube was long enough to try it out. I did a couple of crosscuts and then took the picture. You can see it didn't get all the dust, but it did get most of it. I'll probably start to use it when I can - it doesn't claim to be a blade guard, but I'm more worried about dust these days.
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If you do the ceiling mount, you end up with a lot of unused parts. Seems like they could sell a ceiling only unit for quite a bit less.

[Andrew Kertesz]

It seems like all the commercial ones available and the home made ones give up any sort of anti-kick back protection. While I understand the gaurd is there we all know how fast a kick back takes place. If it causes the guard to raise up you've lost the safety aspect.

[William C Rogers]

I have the Excalibur overarm. Got it off CL for $100. It was not hard to set up and is mounted to the side of the saw. I beats having saw dust thrown at you. It is easy to move out of the way. I would rather have it than not as I didn't have any guard on the saw before. I even had to make my splitter. I have a set of the board buddies that I use when practical. The board buddies are a pain, but work and greatly reduce kick back.

[Rod Sheridan]

It seems like all the commercial ones available and the home made ones give up any sort of anti-kick back protection. While I understand the gaurd is there we all know how fast a kick back takes place. If it causes the guard to raise up you've lost the safety aspect.

Hi Andrew, kickback is caused by the work rotating into the rear of the blade, if you keep the riving knife on the saw when using an overhead guard, you still retain the kickback protection built into the machine.

The "anti-kickback pawls" you see on NA type guards aren't used elsewhere, a riving knife and crown guard are all that's normally used in the EU.

The other protection from kickback is the short fence, which is used for ripping solid lumber, it ends at the start of the saw blade, so the wood isn't trapped between the fence and the blade.

The overhead guard is an improvement in shop safety due to dust collection, the ability to be used for non through cuts, and of course since it's convenient to use, it actually gets used instead of being removed from the machine.......Regards, Rod.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

That's the one Rod. Thanks for posting it. BTW, I have a long and short fence for my saw, and find that I use the short a lot more. Once you get used to it, it's a good idea. The Europeans are onto a good way to eliminate kickback.

[Ole Anderson]

Here is my setup: A 3" Sharkguard with 3" flex to 4" vertical blast gate to 5" horizontal into my DC. The guard gets lots of use as it is so fast to remove if needed, and just as quick to put back on.

[Loren Woirhaye]

Totally worth it. It reduces flying junk that hits you and keeps the air cleaner. Mine is just a 2.5" hose shunted into the 4" ducting overhead. I have a piece of cord with a loop of chain at the end to keep suspended from the rafters the hose from drooping. There's enough play that I can move the saw around quite a lot. My saw has a riving knife. If you don't have a good way to mount a guard to the saw you'll need to make or buy a boom and that's the largest hassle, assuming you have an overhead duct. I got the clear hose and plastic shunt at Woodcraft. Clear hose wasn't worth the expense but that's what the store had... it's never gonna clog anyway.

[Brian W Smith]

I like the overarm style that utilizes the tubing as main(over-table) DC port.Would prefer it to have a dedicated base,bolted directly to floor vs saws table.....admittedly a personal thing.But reason for post was about under table shroud.The higher developed the blade shroud and attatched ducting,the less above table problems there are.Our big saw will shoot dust out the lower port(it has two,one connects to under-table blade shroud,other evacs the cabinet)about a foot & a half when it's disconnected from DC.

Being easily entertained......it never ceases to amaze me to watch a handfull of dust/chips being sucked down into the shrouds duct,without DC turned on.IOW's,just the blades spinning sucks it down and out.

[Sam Puhalovich]

+1 on the SharkGuard.
My set-up is almost identical to Oles' ... I wouldn't want to be without it.
Also: in that the SharkGuard is mounted to the splitter ... the top of the splitter is about 1/4" below the top of the blade, which allows for non thru cuts with the removed.

[Dick Mahany]

Using above the table dust collection has made a huge difference in my shop. The real test was cutting MDF ! I made a shopbuilt Shark style guard from plans on their site and also made an articulated OH wide guard. Both have their advantages and disadvantages but I wouldn't be with out them. I posted pics over on the Workshops forum today in response to another question if it might be of any help. My lungs are much happier now :).

[G Douglas Fowler]

Seven or eight years ago I built an overhead collector for my TS from plans I found on the internet from Wood Central. Search "Overhead Blade Guard and Dust Collector". Excellent plans and I believe the total cost was around &70 for all of the components.

The system performs extremely well and removes the major portion of the dust that is not captured by the 5" port at the base of the cabinet. One note however I am not a fan of zero throat inserts since they prevent a lot of the dust from being thrown down into the TS cavity. Between the two collection points I experience very little free dust. Dust collection is IMHO, an essential part of the woodworking experience.

Doug

[Jim Andrew]

plus 2 for the shark guard. Easy to install and use, just run a pipe over the saw and use flex hose to drop down to the guard. You can order which size hose flange you want to use. Mine grabs flexible strips of wood and sucks them right up the hose. With just a 2 hp cyclone. The shark guard comes with splitters.

[Stan Mitchell]

Others have mentioned the Excalibur overarm. That's the one I use and it does a decent job.

I use a cross-cut sled half the time and the Excalibur swings out of the way if need be.

I find that even when I'm using a sled that I keep it in position. It keeps chips, dust, and debris from finding my face.

[Jason White]

That's why I always drill 3/4"-1" holes in the top and bottom of my zero-clearance throat plates. It's a place to put my finger when removing the throat plate, but the holes also suck up some of the dust.



Seven or eight years ago I built an overhead collector for my TS from plans I found on the internet from Wood Central. Search "Overhead Blade Guard and Dust Collector". Excellent plans and I believe the total cost was around &70 for all of the components.

The system performs extremely well and removes the major portion of the dust that is not captured by the 5" port at the base of the cabinet. One note however I am not a fan of zero throat inserts since they prevent a lot of the dust from being thrown down into the TS cavity. Between the two collection points I experience very little free dust. Dust collection is IMHO, an essential part of the woodworking experience.

Doug

[Jim Dunn]

Mine is a home made parallelogram> I made the arms and plastic collector. Love it as I find more dust coming at me than going down in the saw.

[Ole Anderson]

And regarding the SharkGuard: Anti-kickback Pawls are an option with an additional cost of $10.

[Steve Wurster]

Take a look at the SawStop Blade Guard with built-in dust collection. It's only about $140 (I think I paid slightly less a couple months ago) and it comes with both a riving knife (possibly made only for the SawStop) and anti-kickback pawls. It only has a shop vacuum style hookup, but it also doesn't have a 4+ month lead time like the Shark Guard. I have a 4" line from my DC coming into my TS that I split into 2.5 inches on the right side and then down to the shop-vac style right at the guard.

I don't have a picture of my setup, but after I installed this I get basically no dust on the surface of my TS on most ripping cuts. Cross cuts or ripping cuts that only remove a little bit of material don't work as well because the entire guard gets raised up and so everything moves away from the vacuum source. This is especially true for cuts made with a miter gauge with a backup fence to reduce tearout. There is also the consequence of the way I mounted mine (I'll explain below) because when the guard gets hinged up too high the suction from the DC gets cut off.

My TS is a contractor saw (Ridgid TS3650), and so I have a splitter instead of a true riving knife. The motor hangs out the back of the saw and the splitter is connected onto that. So my splitter does not go up and down with the blade. But, my splitter had a hole onto where I was able to attach the guard, and I had to drill a second hole to complete the work. Due to the design, this has the consequence of the guard tipping down slightly. Doesn't affect the operation, but it does take less raising of the guard before the DC gets cut off. It still works fine for anything I have thrown at it; I'm not sure how thick the material has to be before it would stop working. Note that my setup means I did not hook up the height limiter thing that comes with the guard, but that's okay for me.

So if you have a true riving knife on your TS you might be able to get the full features of the guard out of the box.

[Jason White]

Hey, Steve -- I've been thinking about buying the SawStop blade guard (just for dust collection purposes) and trying to adapt it to my non-riving knife Unisaw. Did you get the mounting arm, too? A picture or two of your setup would be most enlightening and appreciated!


Take a look at the SawStop Blade Guard with built-in dust collection. It's only about $140 (I think I paid slightly less a couple months ago) and it comes with both a riving knife (possibly made only for the SawStop) and anti-kickback pawls. It only has a shop vacuum style hookup, but it also doesn't have a 4+ month lead time like the Shark Guard. I have a 4" line from my DC coming into my TS that I split into 2.5 inches on the right side and then down to the shop-vac style right at the guard.

I don't have a picture of my setup, but after I installed this I get basically no dust on the surface of my TS on most ripping cuts. Cross cuts or ripping cuts that only remove a little bit of material don't work as well because the entire guard gets raised up and so everything moves away from the vacuum source. This is especially true for cuts made with a miter gauge with a backup fence to reduce tearout. There is also the consequence of the way I mounted mine (I'll explain below) because when the guard gets hinged up too high the suction from the DC gets cut off.

My TS is a contractor saw (Ridgid TS3650), and so I have a splitter instead of a true riving knife. The motor hangs out the back of the saw and the splitter is connected onto that. So my splitter does not go up and down with the blade. But, my splitter had a hole onto where I was able to attach the guard, and I had to drill a second hole to complete the work. Due to the design, this has the consequence of the guard tipping down slightly. Doesn't affect the operation, but it does take less raising of the guard before the DC gets cut off. It still works fine for anything I have thrown at it; I'm not sure how thick the material has to be before it would stop working. Note that my setup means I did not hook up the height limiter thing that comes with the guard, but that's okay for me.

So if you have a true riving knife on your TS you might be able to get the full features of the guard out of the box.

[glenn bradley]

It seems like all the commercial ones available and the home made ones give up any sort of anti-kick back protection. While I understand the gaurd is there we all know how fast a kick back takes place. If it causes the guard to raise up you've lost the safety aspect.

Correct. Some of these items are sold as dust collection devices / blade guards. There are some guards with splitters and pawls that incorporate dust collection as well. When I ran the PSI I also used a separate splitter. I now have a Saw Stop where the overarm collector has a built in splitter with pawls. When the guard is off a riving knife without pawls is used.

[Steve Wurster]

I'll try to take some pictures of my setup tonight. In the meantime I can at least explain part of it.

I did not get the SawStop mounting arm. Instead, I found a picture on the Shark Guard website that shows a piece of PVC pipe suspended horizontally about 10" or so above the right side of the saw. It's mounted to the right side with just a block of wood or something (I used plywood). The PVC pipe ends closer to the blade and from there I have a run of 2.5" DC hose that just connects to the back of the guard (via a 2.5" to 1.5" adapter). The Shark Guard one of course is shown connecting to that guard; different location for the DC hookup. Their site appears down right now, so I cannot provide a link or tell you where to find it.

On the far right side of my saw is where I have a 4" to 4" / 2.5" DC splitter. The main 4" line comes from my DC, while the 4" output part drops down to the floor and connects into the back of my saw (my contractor saw is open on the bottom so I boxed that in). The 2.5" output is connected to a blast gate, and then from there connects to the end of that PVC pipe. I can close that blast gate when running non-through cuts. For most of those I just leave the guard connected to the hose and the splitter, disconnect the splitter from the saw, and place the whole assembly on the right side of my saw. But if the material has to go through that space I just disconnect the hose from the PVC and put the guard / splitter / hose assembly on my bench or something.

Note that since the PVC pipe is suspended above the right side of the saw, I am limited in how tall my material can be when it's over on that side. But since the PVC pipe ends a good bit away from the blade I still have plenty of room. I can still run material vertically without issue. I have yet to encounter any cut that has required me to remove the PVC pipe.

The only issue with my setup is that stretch of hose from the PVC pipe to the guard. When ripping narrow material and using a push device between the blade and the fence, the hose can theoretically get in the way. It's behind the blade, and I have it setup in an upside down "U" configuration to limit any impact, but I have to be aware that it's there. It hasn't affected anything yet however.

I've been wanting to post a picture ever since I got it working. This should hopefully be my impetus to do so!

[Jim Andrew]

Those anti kickback pawls are one of the reasons I discarded the unisaw guard. Try to back up your board once it is under those, and it is a pain. The splitter is your main anti kickback device, as it prevents your board from sliding over and letting your blade get a strong BITE of it, which is when the kickback happens. Haven't noticed any riving knives coming with anti kickback pawls. Maybe there are some out there, but I haven't seen them.

[Steve Wurster]

Here are some pictures of my setup. See my previous post for the descriptions.

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[Chris Parks]

I think Jim Schaeffer's (sp?) is the best I have seen and is somewhere on this site. Found it!.....http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?129789-Table-Saw-dust-collection-from-the-top

The brushes stop the debris escaping but allow air flow in to feed the extractor.