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View Full Version : Epilog Releases Mac Driver for Fusion Laser System



Keith Outten
01-06-2014, 5:54 PM
http://www.epiloglaser.com/epilog-mac-driver.htm

Dee Gallo
01-06-2014, 10:29 PM
I hope this is the forerunner of a Mac driver for all Epilogs, not just the Fusion.

Keith Outten
01-07-2014, 12:27 AM
Dee,

I expect this is the first hole in the dam. Once the model is broken all of the laser manufacturers will offer driver support for Apple products, it might take some time but they will fear the loss of machine sales. This year will be the first time that tablets will outsell personal computers and Apple enjoyed about 65% of all tablet sales last year. The sales of macbooks, and iPhones will reinforce their position because people are now expecting all of their computers to be integrated which has been a major part of Apples manufacturing plan.

Its not the technical people who govern the direction computer companies are moving anymore, its the average Joe/Jane who is in the drivers seat now. They outnumber us ten thousand to one so they are the target for future sales IMO.

The Times They Are a Changin :)
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Glen Monaghan
01-07-2014, 9:50 AM
I hope this is the forerunner of a Mac driver for all Epilogs, not just the Fusion.

I don't think they (like most manufacturers) have a great track record with going back and creating new drivers for old designs. They have new hardware and want to drive sales to the new stuff. Very little money to be made updating the old gear so it's not an easy business decision to do it.

Keith Outten
01-07-2014, 10:05 AM
Glen,

I think your right about Epilog but that may not be the case with other manufacturers, I expect it depends on how many machine models their drivers support. I had an Epilog Legend 24 and the company stopped providing driver upgrades for my machine just because it was getting old.

I'm sure the development cost to produce a new driver to support Apple products will not be cheap but when you spread the cost over a lot of machines it can't be that much of a financial investment when you consider that not supporting non-MS machines might be a very bad business decision in the long run. I'm not a programer but I expect the cost to support two operating system concurrently might be a serious issue that will have to be addressed either by increasing the cost of machines or having the customer pay for new software updates.

No matter how this shakes out IMO there will be some changes in the status quo driven by consumer choices in operating systems.
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Glen Monaghan
01-07-2014, 12:09 PM
There may be a few companies who are exceptions, but who are they? When you have new models out, or coming out soon, it makes sense to add new capability (such as support for 2nd most common OS or improved UI), but there is very little financial incentive to retrofitting those features to older machines, especially if you don't impose a significant charge for them. Doesn't matter how many older models their driver supports, if you don't/can't charge enough per expected copy distributed, you are going to lose money doing it. Also, retrofitting features to older machines cuts into sales of newer machines. Much easier and cheaper to tell people, "Hey, you want Mac support, new UI with job control features, chuck based rotary, etc., etc., then buy our latest and greatest model. You'll get these great new features, new mechanicals, upgraded this and that, and we'll make money rather than losing it to give an uncertain number of current users access to those features on machines we sold you years ago."

Keith Outten
01-07-2014, 1:06 PM
Glen,

Your right again. Companies have to make money and they have to make every effort to drive sales towards their new machines. After all they don't make a penny when a used machine is sold from one customer to another. I really don't expect to see any company offer an alternate OS driver at this point in time unless it is a very cost effective option.

On the other hand I expect that a large number of laser engraver purchases are first time owners these days. When a Mac user asks you on the phone if your laser engraver supports his/her machine and you say "No" all you will hear is click as they hang up. You lost the sale and didn't even get the chance to explain or offer to help them setup Windows on their Mac. They will RUN to Epliog's web site and call them on the phone to purchase a machine that fits their operating system. They are a very loyal bunch, at least that is what I have experienced on my end.

For the record I was a PC fan from 1984 until two years ago when I purchased the iMac I am using to type this message :)

Keith Outten
01-07-2014, 1:25 PM
I receive phone calls from people almost every day who want to ask me questions about my Trotec Laser. Its no secret that I am a big fan of Trotec based on my posts here so people ask me lots of questions about my machine. Lately more and more people are asking me if Trotec has a Mac driver and my response is "Not that I know of". Although I expect Trotec doesn't have a Mac driver I can't say that because they may very well be working on one or have one in beta testing. I have absolutely no inside information to share, I'm just a very satisfied customer.

Would I like to have a Mac driver for my Speedy 300......you bet I would and I already purchased a Mac Pro notebook for the day when a driver is available :)
I also want Corel Draw for my Mac and Aspire along with the software to run my CNC Router. Realistically I know it will be awhile but I am confident the day will come.

I also know that every major manufacturer of laser engravers has a representative that reads this forum every day. They are listening!
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Scott Shepherd
01-07-2014, 1:32 PM
Keith, I think you nailed the biggest problem. People with Mac's also aren't using CorelDraw, since it's stopped being available for the Mac a decade ago. Most people, if they were using a mac would be using Illustrator or something along those lines. Being that the vast majority of people are using CorelDraw, I'm not sure it's going to have the giant rush of people to the Mac driver as one would think. On the surface, it looks great, but in the real world, that would mean getting away from CorelDraw and I don't see a lot of people doing that in the laser world right now.

We use Illustrator (on a Mac) as well as CorelDraw (on PC's), but I doubt people will be anxious to migrate to Illustrator. It's not exactly the easiest program in the world to use.

I hope they all start supporting Mac's. It's been a LONG time coming. I've been asking for them for years now.

Jason Hilton
01-07-2014, 1:41 PM
I'd be happy to design Mac drivers/software for any manufacturer who is reading this *wink*

It's inevitable that manufacturers provide support for the Mac platform. These days it's not any harder to develop for a Mac. Many software developers that limit themselves to windows platforms do so because of projected market. Despite the gains of Apple, Windows machines still have a significantly larger market share. That said, that reasoning doesn't really work for Laser manufacturers. How many laser owners purchase a computer to go with their machine? How many potential purchasers own macs? It's likely answers to both of those questions are "a lot". I got my introduction to laser engraving at a local makerspace, and in all the time I spent there I saw exactly 2 PCs in the building, and those were the machines hooked up to the laser and CNC. We've discussed before that digital artists generally prefer macs.

In terms of available software, it is still a problem because machine control has been primarily developed on windows machines. But that's changing. Coral somehow became the defacto design tool for laser engraving (I don't know how, probably price and marketing that eventually became ingrained in the culture), but illustrator is a lot more powerful and in my opinion easier to learn and use. I'm different in that I learned illustrator long ago, and only recently used coral because it was on the shop machine, but my first thought was "why does it do it that way? stupid". I've had that thought many times since. It's a shift to be sure, especially if you've spent your entire career using coral. But I would submit that the majority of users, current and future, who want mac drivers already have macs and use illustrator already.

My last though: I had previously decided to buy a trotec, but an epilog is looking mighty enticing right about now...

Dan Hintz
01-07-2014, 4:42 PM
The whole driver issue is certainly an interesting topic... like the wind, you're never sure which way it's going to blow. If you look at a lot of the major software companies, most offered Mac versions at one time or another... and on the same token, those versions eventually died out due to lack of customer base. AutoCAD started, then stopped... no idea if they started again. WordPerfect did, before Corel purchased them, then stopped. Seemed like a fad in the late-90s(?) that quickly died out, and the reason given was always "the market share was in Windows". Even Linux was given a try (with it's close ties to Apple's OS, this made sense). As you said, Keith, supporting more than one OS is a financial drain, so it will be interesting to see if the market share is finally high enough to make it worthwhile.

Mike Chance in Iowa
01-07-2014, 7:06 PM
Microsoft tried it in the early 90's. Depending upon which building I was in, I had to switch between working on Word for DOS, Word for Windows and Word for Macintosh.

Jason Hilton
01-07-2014, 8:39 PM
Autocad is alive and thriving on macos, as well as most of autodesks range.

Doug Griffith
01-08-2014, 10:24 AM
Most programmers are smart and build their code in libraries, modules, routines, or whatever the language calls it. I'd bet that 95% of the work is done towards developing a Mac driver for their entire current product line (Epilog's machines that support their latest driver). Machine specific idiosyncrasies are the last 5%.

I, personally, would invest in supporting the Mac. Sure, it won't immediately sell new machines but it will help secure a larger user base of devoted users. Think Apple.

John Calhoun
01-08-2014, 2:35 PM
Specifically, I would love to see an open-source initiative for a Mac driver for Shenhui lasers.

Generally, any open-source driver for any laser platform would be welcome.

Doug Griffith
01-08-2014, 2:59 PM
Generally, any open-source driver for any laser platform would be welcome.

Try Googling any combination of "grbl emc2 mach3 laser arduino"

Jason Hilton
01-08-2014, 4:03 PM
The open source Lasersaur utilizes a built in web server to drive printing, so it's OS agnostic. You can print from pretty much anywhere. The Buildlog 2.x Laser is also open source and can be driven by CNC controls on Mac and Windows.

Chris J Anderson
01-08-2014, 6:58 PM
I hope Corel are reading this thread :)