Veritas Shooting Sander

[Hilton Ralphs]

For those contemplating purchasing the new Veritas Shooting Sander (and take advantage of free shipping), I worked out that if you buy the normal PSA sandpaper rolls that Lee Valley sells, the price is reduced from 50 cents per sheet to only 20 cents.

You have to cut the piece in half of course as the PSA roll is 2-1/2" wide whereas the Shooting Sander uses 1-1/4" wide x 9" long pieces.

Anyway, if you google "Veritas Shooting Sander" and click on images, Chris Griggs' avatar is on the first page.

[Chris Griggs]

Anyway, if you google "Veritas Shooting Sander" and click on images, Chris Griggs' avatar is on the first page.

That's weird, mine and Malcolm's avatars both come up. I guess people who google that also look click on our avatars.

[Frederick Skelly]

Thanks Hilton. I saw the sander in the catalog the other day.

What does the community make of it? Did anyone get to try out a prototype (Derek?)

Its LV and i REALLY like their stuff - so i want to like/desire this tool. :) But so far, i havent gotten convinced that i need this one. Ive got to be missing something.

Fred

[Roderick Gentry]

I could use this at 18", I use a level with paper for soundboard joints I don't think I have a use at 9 inches. Any word if there will be different sizes?

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Since SMC turns up so frequently in Google searches, it might just be a case of Google's algorithm looking for images related to text search terms, ending up at an SMC page, getting confused, and grabbing the only photos on the page. I think it still makes some assumptions about images based on there proximity to search terms on the pages it pulls.

[Hilton Ralphs]

Did anyone get to try out a prototype (Derek?)


He did have one in the prototype stage of development. If you do get one, he recommends building a reverse sloped shooting board to keep the veneer or thin stock pushed against the base of the shooting board plus to give more wear to the sand paper.

Seems like a convenient way of trimming thin stock to size. I'm thinking it may even be useful to smooth the edge of particle board, prior to getting a edge treatment.

[Tommy Martin]

I could use this at 18", I use a level with paper for soundboard joints I don't think I have a use at 9 inches. Any word if there will be different sizes?

I am 'tooling up' for my first guitar build. I was wondering about the shooting sander approach opposed to using a sharp LA plane with the shooting board. Is sanding a better way to go?

[Derek Cohen]

I posted a bit of information on WoodNet when this came up. Here is a copy of some of it ...

A few years ago I completed a workshop with Andrew Crawford, who is arguably the foremost boxmaker in the world. He uses a great deal of veneer in his work.

Instead of shooting the veneer with a plane, Andrew preferred shooting it with a sander. He glued sandpaper to a jointed block. To make this work, that is keep the sander running straight, Andrew had an elaborate and complicated system in which he had a long fence.

The LV sander simplifies the process insofar as it is designed to run in the same shooting board as their shooting plane.

Take the time to make a reverse slope ramped shooting board. This will spread the wear, and the reverse slop will push thin wood (such as veneer) down onto the table (where as the typical slope will push it up).

The board on the left is standard. The board on the right is reverse sloped.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Other/LN%20Perth%20Hand%20Tool%20Event%202011/Neilsboards1.jpg

The sander is shaped to work on a shooting board in the same way that a plane does. There is a raised lip/guide that will run along the side of the runway without chewing into the platform. It works best with a side fence, that is, to hold the sander against the work piece and help it run straight. Without all this added paraphernalia you would need to resort to the extra guides that Andrew Crawford uses to ensure that the veneer is jointed square. Sandpaper simply glued to wood and pushed without guides will likely put a crown or a hollow on the veneer edge.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Belair]

I could use this at 18", I use a level with paper for soundboard joints I don't think I have a use at 9 inches. Any word if there will be different sizes?

They should be able to easily make a longer one as it's just aluminum extrusion. As with instrument bodies, with veneers its often long grain that requires shooting.

[george wilson]

Frankly,I prefer to use a sharp plane. I wonder how long it takes the sander and the track it slides on,to get worn from sand paper grits falling down into them? How often are you changing sand paper? Maybe I'm wrong. I was always after one of my journeymen to stop using a sanding block (freehand) to make joints. His joints did fit nicely,though. I cringed when I saw him doing it!

[Derek Cohen]

Jim, you do not need a longer extrusion if you use it in a shooting board (as described above).

George, you are partly correct - the sandpaper will wear quickly if used repeatedly on the same area. A ramped shooting board helps spread the wear. However, this is not a sander for all ccasions. I think that this is a tool for those that use thin veneer, which is why Andrew Crawford preferred it over a handplane. He complained that even a sharp edge caused tearout when jointing the thin veneer.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Rick Markham]

Derek, I believe George was referring to how long the actual shooting board and sanding plane will stay true due to their prolonged exposure to motion and the abrasive grit

Too me it seems if you design the board the way Derek has it, where the lip of the working surface of the "shanding" board is extended would prevent premature wear from affecting the face of the plane. However the surface of the lip of the "shanding board" would wear.

Offhand anyone know the exact width of this nifty doohickey

[Mike Henderson]

I use sandpaper glued to a block of MDF to sand the edges of veneer. Most of the time I'm sanding something like the pieces for a radial match. Often, in that case, I'm sanding a stack of 16 pieces of veneer at the same time. I put the veneer at the edge of my bench, put a veneer straightedge on top of it, and close to the edge, and sand "freehand". I've never had a problem with that freehand sanding, except that the tips are weaker and will bend inward when you put pressure on them. So if you don't allow for that, when you go to fit the pieces together, the edge will not be straight.

I don't think I've ever sanded the end of veneer, as LV shows in their picture. Normally, you'd make the veneer longer than the panel and then cut it flush with the panel after you glued it down.

The difficult problem is to put long strips of veneer side by side for use on a long panel. The edges have to be straight, but the two sides have to be pretty close to parallel. If not, as you lay the veneer down side-by-side, you'll see that the lines are converging towards the top or bottom. That's one reason I try to make sure my veneer is fairly wide if I have to lay it up for a long panel - wide veneer requires fewer joints and there's less chance of noticing converging lines.

Mike

[Tony Zaffuto]

Well, I used my LV shooting sander this morning and it worked like a charm. Was used on some cock-beaded poplar slightly thicker than 1/8" that I needed to miter. With a plane, I spalled out the far end. The sander took a few licks to give the fit I wanted (180 grit).

Was used on my regular, sloped shooting board without a track. I doubt if I will build a reverse sloped board just for this tool, or even add a track, as it worked just fine with my normal board.

[Chris Fournier]

I would say not personally. The handplane works perfectly and is fast. You already own one! If you are going to spend money on a new tool why not spend this money on a tool that allows you to do something you presently can't do with a plane, say a bending iron?

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Chris

Because some woods are brittle, and when they are very thin they will simply break when planed. The sander is then a better choice.

Tony, the reverse shooting board is only for thin veneer. If you are sanding something substantial, then don't bother with it.

For interest, here is a copy of a post I made at WoodNet in response to a query about the sander:


Here are photos from the Andrew Crawford workshop I attended a while ago. Incidentally, it is entirely possible that Andrew had input into this shooter (I'm guessing) since LV are making and selling Andrew's 90 degree corner slicer for veneer. At this workshop Andrew brought it along the (then) prototype of this.

Here is Andrew:

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Shooting%20Boards/Andrew%20Crawford%20workshop/AndrewCrawford3_zps2d060cbc.jpg

That is Neil Erasmus with the camera. He is a designer/furnituremaker of the highest order. Google his name. The reverse shooting board I showed is one of his. Neil trained with his father, and said he first used one then.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Shooting%20Boards/Andrew%20Crawford%20workshop/AndrewCrawford1_zps7c66fa8c.jpg

This photo shows the two squares of MDF that sandwich the veneer.The sander shooter is at the front.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Shooting%20Boards/Andrew%20Crawford%20workshop/AndrewCrawford5_zpsc8faeb20.jpg

The sander/shooting board. The sander is a T section: sandpaper glued to its face and the rear running on anotehr length of MDF. Their is a trailing length of MDF to ensure that the (short) sander has longer registration and runs straight.

Note that the LV sander rides in a track and can be kept short.

Shooting thin interlocked and brittle veneer from woods likes Jarrah calls for a sander. Even a sharp blade in a plane will cause it to break.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Tony Zaffuto]

Actually, a pretty low cost tool, that does its job very well, when you need it!

[Chris Fournier]

I have used a lot of highly figured veneer in my shop, much of it is very old and a bit tricky - curly brazilian rosewood for instance. I do all of my jointing with a plane and have yet to come across a piece that I couldn't joint, granted sometimes I really have to sneak up on the problem area but it always works out. I wouldn't worry about a sanded glue joint in veneer but I wouldn't consider it for the joints in guitar plates.

[Roderick Gentry]

I am 'tooling up' for my first guitar build. I was wondering about the shooting sander approach opposed to using a sharp LA plane with the shooting board. Is sanding a better way to go?

I thinkit is for the final fit because you end up with a little tooth on the surface which is no disaadvantage for gueing. I made an 18" jointer with a mouth like finish plane and I shoot withthat. But any plane will work on a shooting board. My approach works fast because am only using the board to set the 90 deg and as a stop. If I was relying on it for straight It would be less efficient, same with the sander. Iglue up without clamps the plates just suck themselvee into place.