sawstop vs. other saws

[Tai Fu]

So to my surprise I found that sawstop is sold in Taiwan. The price is still more than what they sell for in the US but was wondering, why should I buy a sawstop contractor saw when I can buy a cabinet saw, and even a slider from other makers at the same price? Besides the safety feature are there more things about Sawstop that makes it worthwhile, like heavier construction, better motor, etc.?

[Greg Peterson]

As I understand the matter, Sawstop is manufactured in Taiwan. As for comparing a SS contractor to a cabinet or slider, well, that's a good question.

[johnny means]

I would pay extra for a Sawstop contractors saw. I wouldn't buy a contractors saw at all, if I was the market for a cabinet saw. That being said , in their respective categories, all the Sawstops are at the top heap as far as quality goes.

[Lee Reep]

You are paying for the electronics and mechanical pieces that make the saw a safe tool. But I feel that the quality is there, and they just did not slap some safety pieces on any old table saw. I do not own one, but came close this year. I bought a Festool track saw recently since I needed a high quality tool to break down sheet goods, and discovered how many people use track saws for just that. But I will own a SawStop one of these days. This summer I helped a kid that works at the local lumber house cut a sheet of maple veneer plywood in two, and the SawStop did a superb job.

Also, I did something last year that makes the SawStop a very attractive saw to add to my shop. I had a freak accident and cut off the tip of my left thumb -- about a 1/2 inch. I was lucky. It could have been all my fingers, or my entire hand. As it was I walked out of the emergency room of the hospital a few hours after arriving with a bandage on the thumb. And about $4000 poorer -- that would have bought the saw! They could not re-attach the tip of my thumb, and they also did not do any surgery. The hand specialist wanted it to heal "naturally". I have most of the feeling back after one year.

I treat my table saw with the utmost respect. I've been woodworking since the early 70s, and never thought I'd have an accident like I did. And that is why I'd buy a SawStop.

[Jim Andrew]

I just ordered a Hammer sliding table saw a few days ago, my thinking is that if I can continue to do woodworking due to the safety of a slider, it is worth changing from my unisaw. The unisaw does everything I want, but a slider is just a safer type of saw.

[Myk Rian]

Another SawStop thread? Groan.

[Rich Riddle]

I just ordered a Hammer sliding table saw a few days ago, my thinking is that if I can continue to do woodworking due to the safety of a slider, it is worth changing from my unisaw. The unisaw does everything I want, but a slider is just a safer type of saw.

I did exactly this at the beginning of the year, ordered a Hammer sliding saw. Most saws occupy military hobby shops including the Sawstop, Unisaw, Powermatic, etc. The hobby shops started going toward the Sawstop saws, so service members used them regularly. Concerning quality of a cabinet saw, they are consistent with the competition. Concerning the fence system,the Incra fence system performs much better as a retrofit. The Biesemeyer fence system with the Delta also proved more accurate.

After using a slider, it's simply a better design and makes me feel safer. It's not the cutting of fingers nearly as much as kickback that provides concerns. That's where a slider excels. But concerning finger safety, with a slider your hand will stay quite a distance from the blade.

[glenn bradley]

A lot of this is opinion but, that's what we're here for ;-) A cabinet saw or a slider would have to be a pretty poor example before I would take a contractor format saw over one. While you are comparing, be sure to option the Saw Stop with the upgraded wings and fence to make it a more apples to apples comparison price-wise with the cast iron and Biesemeyer-like items that come on many cabinet saws. The contractor saw also takes up more room but, a slider takes even more so I'm assuming space is not the deciding factor.

P.s. I forgot to mention that I have the SawStop PCS which replaced a hybrid which replaced a contractor saw.

[Jerome Stanek]

I was at my old place of employment last week when they were bringing in a new saw stop to replace a unisaw that was 25 plus years old and still in new shape. When I asked about it they said one of the guys that work there cut all his fingers off. They are replacing 2 Unisaws but had to wait for the other sawstop to come in. That was only the second time that an accident sent someone to the emergency room for major cuts that required stitches. Tha other was a router accident where the guy was trimming laminate and the router slipped out of his hand and he tried to catch it. that one required 4 stitches. every thing else was falls out side or bumps

[Ralph Butts]

Myk I totally echo your sentiments. Tai I wish you the best in your search for a new saw. Good luck, don't ignore looking at sliders as well. I am neither a SS opponent nor proponent, I don't own one either but just to keep things 100 you are paying for the lobbying costs to pressure state legislators to push legislation promoting all saw manufacturers to utilize SS technology.

[Bruce Page]

Folks, please do not turn this thread into an ethics or political debate.

Thanks

[Tai Fu]

I'd love to have a slider, but space is a huge issue in my shop.

[Alan Bienlein]

I will give you an example of why I would buy the SawStop contractor saw instead of a cabinet saw or a slider. I can just remove my current contractor saw off of it's mobile base and replace it with the SawStop contractor saw and be of and working. No fuss no muss!
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I do woodworking as a profession and have many many years of experience using cabinet saws and the larger sliders that are 10+ hp and take 16" blades. There isn't anything that a slider or a cabinet saw will do for me that I can't already do on my current setup which is the contractor saw in the picture.

I have went and physically looked at the SawStop contractor saw and that is the ONLY saw I have ever used that I can tilt the blade using only my pinky finger all the way to a 45 and back to 90. The PCS and the ISC versions are the same way. I have never ever in all my years had a saw that was that easy.

[Ralph Butts]

Tai take a look at the Hammer line. They offer several models with relative small footprints. There are several SMC members here that have smaller footprint sliders some with shapers.

...plus I think they are still having an end of year clearance sale with something like 20% off I believe.

[Craig Behnke]

I just ordered a Hammer sliding table saw a few days ago, my thinking is that if I can continue to do woodworking due to the safety of a slider, it is worth changing from my unisaw. The unisaw does everything I want, but a slider is just a safer type of saw.

Nice. I just ordered today...K3 Winner w/ 79 inch slider. I sold my sawstop earlier this week. Don't get me wrong, I liked the sawstop very much as a high quality product with a great safety feature, but I wanted slider functionality and a different way to process sheet goods (without help from my wife). We'll see how it goes after a few months of using the slider.

I thought the SS was a very nice quality saw, I had the 1.75HP cabinet saw...which was a step up from my prior saw was a Ridgid table saw. I'm just a hobby guy with a few years experience, but I thought the SS was a very compelling product.

best of luck with your search/buy decision.

-Craig

[Chris Fournier]

Folks, please do not turn this thread into an ethics or political debate.

Thanks

Bruce, if this thread were about the harvesting of South American mahogany or another endangered species or perhaps even labour practices, would you have posted the above? I ask because I don't understand why in this instance politics and ethics are not legitimate talking points, they certainly would be if the above topics were being discussed. Don't get me wrong, as others have mentioned the SS vs XXXXX topic has been bled dry, I just don't understand the rationale.

[scott spencer]

With the contractor saw you're clearly paying the premium for the safety technology, and not necessarily getting a superior saw....it's a different situation than with the PCS or ICS, which are both pretty competitive saws at their price points even without the safety feature. What the safety feature is worth is an personal choice that only you can decide. Do you want the most saw you can afford, or the safest?

[Kent A Bathurst]

Another SawStop thread? Groan.


Do like me, Myk - getcher popcorn out and watch the show. It plays about as often as Its a Wonderful Life, but more entertaining, IMO.

[Bruce Page]

Bruce, if this thread were about the harvesting of South American mahogany or another endangered species or perhaps even labour practices, would you have posted the above? I ask because I don't understand why in this instance politics and ethics are not legitimate talking points, they certainly would be if the above topics were being discussed. Don't get me wrong, as others have mentioned the SS vs XXXXX topic has been bled dry, I just don't understand the rationale.

Chris, the intent of my post was to keep this thread on-topic to the OP's question and not drift into another “bled dry” Steve Gass/Sawstop bashing thread. Nothing more.

[Chris Fournier]

Thanks Bruce, I get that. I thought perhaps that ethics and politics had become verboten!

[Richard Coers]

Nice. I just ordered today...K3 Winner w/ 79 inch slider. I sold my sawstop earlier this week. Don't get me wrong, I liked the sawstop very much as a high quality product with a great safety feature, but I wanted slider functionality and a different way to process sheet goods (without help from my wife). We'll see how it goes after a few months of using the slider.

I thought the SS was a very nice quality saw, I had the 1.75HP cabinet saw...which was a step up from my prior saw was a Ridgid table saw. I'm just a hobby guy with a few years experience, but I thought the SS was a very compelling product.

best of luck with your search/buy decision.

-Craig

I bought a Lab 30 with a sliding table about 16 years ago. Not familiar with the Hammer, but what I still miss from my old unisaw is not having miter gage slots and in your case, the European rip fence. You loose the ability to make some fixtures that straddle the rip fence and slide in the miter slots. Maybe you don't cut joinery on the table saw, so maybe no problem for you. I also hate having to remove the big fence on the slider when I want to do a traditional rip operation. I always feel like I have to put the square on a test cut after putting the slider fence back on.

[Ralph Butts]

Chris, the intent of my post was to keep this thread on-topic to the OP's question and not drift into another “bled dry” Steve Gass/Sawstop bashing thread. Nothing more.

Bruce while I fully understand your intentions I dont see any reason in any of the posts in this thread for the words of caution. Unless I missed a post no one questioned anyone's ethics and the last time I checked political lobbying is legal. Pointing out a corporations policy and /or business model/practices especially when the comments are accurate at worst, dead on truthful at best should not be construed or made out to be bashing. For those few that may not have known the facts now they know. None of the manufacturers in question within this thread have done anything illegal and IMHO nothing unethical either. Shrewed business practices are common place in capitalist societies and many an individual and corporations have posted mega fortunes as a result of those practices. (and I am a true capitalist) On the other hand I am a free market supporter and in a free market economy the consumer controls demand. I guess at the end of the day is the issue one of bashing or merely making a truthful comment considered to be critical of a manufacturer or sponsor? Knowledge should never be something to fear.

I hope the OP will find the saw that meets his needs and that he is truly happy with the purchase.

[Chris Parks]

So to my surprise I found that sawstop is sold in Taiwan. The price is still more than what they sell for in the US

SawStop could most probably explain? I doubt that they would though as this often happens with a lot of tools. I doubt they sell at a loss so someone is getting ripped off.

[Keith Weber]

I wanted something safer than my Grizzly cabinet saw since it lacked a riving knife. Although the Sawstop technology is nice, I decided that for me, the real safety upgrade was in going directly to a slider with a beefy overhead blade guard. Added bonuses are straight-line ripping, crosscutting of full sheets, a scoring blade, and the ability to slide the rip fence back to the front of the blade. Plus, I don't do Chiwanese anymore if there's any other option (but that's a personal thing).

[Rich Riddle]

I still miss from my old Unisaw is not having miter gauge slots and in your case, the European rip fence. You loose the ability to make some fixtures that straddle the rip fence and slide in the miter slots. Maybe you don't cut joinery on the table saw, so maybe no problem for you. I also hate having to remove the big fence on the slider when I want to do a traditional rip operation. I always feel like I have to put the square on a test cut after putting the slider fence back on.
What type of joinery do you mean? With the K3 winner there is no need for many of the jigs because the slider combined with the crosscut fence (you called it the slider fence) eliminate the need for many gigs. Hammer's crosscut fence stays spot on with factory stops when reattached.

Helped a friend cut down a door a couple of weeks ago with a Unisaw (my old Unisaw). After that experience, there is no consideration of going back to a traditional cabinet saw; but each woodworker has to make his/her own decision. If a cabinet saw was in consideration, the Sawstop would be one worth considering.

[Jim Bowers]

I can not explain SawStop cost in your location. However, I own 2 cabinet saws. Both are 3 hp. One is the ICS SawStop. This is my go to saw for most of my work. I have found this saw to be above average in all that I do. My other saw is a Shop Fox which I now use for dados. I have used sliders in the past. I found them very useful for sheet goods. Ripping and crosscutting I found them to be lacking even with the slider fence. Yes I have used an Altendorf. For the small shop I find a cabinet saw to meet all my needs. Yes I sometime have to ask for help breaking sheet goods down. I find the smaller footprint to be helpful. My purchase of the SawStop was based on my using the saw when others were not around. Yes I know there can be a failure but I choose to use safety items that do not require minutes of prep time or hundreds of dollars in jig that take up space. I have used my SawStop for over two years with no problems. I found the quality to be above most of the cabinet saws being produced today. I used my Shop Fox for 10 years as my only saw. I made sure someone was around when I used it. This would limit my time I could be cutting. Because I was involved in production work for over 20 years I have seen enough accidents involving people I considered to be very safety aware. My opinion for what it is worth.

[Tai Fu]

A lot of items produced in Taiwan are more expensive here than abroad, I have no idea why. There's not a lot of nationalism here for sure. As for sliders according to the seller of one slider, you need a 5 meter by 5 meter (not kidding) space to use them... none of the rooms in my shop is that big! In hindsight a drum sander is far more useful for me than a tablesaw, but I can't find anyone selling them and I wouldn't be sure where to put it.

[Richard Coers]

What type of joinery do you mean? With the K3 winner there is no need for many of the jigs because the slider combined with the crosscut fence (you called it the slider fence) eliminate the need for many gigs. Hammer's crosscut fence stays spot on with factory stops when reattached.

Helped a friend cut down a door a couple of weeks ago with a Unisaw (my old Unisaw). After that experience, there is no consideration of going back to a traditional cabinet saw; but each woodworker has to make his/her own decision. If a cabinet saw was in consideration, the Sawstop would be one worth considering.

Here's a short list; finger joints, feather cutting on mitered boxes, tenon jig, picture frame miter jig with complimentary side fences, segmented bowl angle cutting fixture........ Some of these can be done with a router, and maybe shaper cutters, but miss the way I used to do it.

[Tai Fu]

I can't buy hammer or whatever if they aren't made in Taiwan. Outside of Taiwanese machines, the only option is to import, and I'm not sure whats the cost... there doesn't seem to be any economical ways to send anything out of the US

[Ralph Butts]

Tai that sounds like a 8 foot slider which do require a lot more footprint area. There are sliders with a much smaller footprint. I am not familiar with the Taiwanese import/export rules so I cannot be of any help on that issue. Grizzly has two smaller sliders and I believe they are manufactured in Taiwan. Nothing to say about the quality as this thread is already touching on hot topics. Best of luck in your quest.

[Keith Hankins]

Nice. I just ordered today...K3 Winner w/ 79 inch slider. I sold my sawstop earlier this week. Don't get me wrong, I liked the sawstop very much as a high quality product with a great safety feature, but I wanted slider functionality and a different way to process sheet goods (without help from my wife). We'll see how it goes after a few months of using the slider.

I thought the SS was a very nice quality saw, I had the 1.75HP cabinet saw...which was a step up from my prior saw was a Ridgid table saw. I'm just a hobby guy with a few years experience, but I thought the SS was a very compelling product.

best of luck with your search/buy decision.

-Craig

I don't mean to hijack at all. I posted about looking for a used sawstop ICS, and someone else suggested a slider siting its safer design. I can see the design being safer from a crosscut perspective and the riving knife, but now a lot of traditional saws now even have that. For ripping boards, which I do a lot, I don't see them any safer than a cabinet saw. Now if you buy the biggest hammer or fielder with the longest sliding table, you don't get the full advantage. Am I missing something. I even went to youtube to look for videos to see if I was just missing something? (my question is only releated to the statement that slidders are more safe by design). While I can do the ICS, the slidder questions has peaked my interest. (again did not mean to hijack thread)

[Kent A Bathurst]

Another SawStop thread? Groan.

Myk - Gotcher popcorn out yet?

munch. munch. munch...................

[Craig Behnke]

For ripping boards, which I do a lot, I don't see them any safer than a cabinet saw. Now if you buy the biggest hammer or fielder with the longest sliding table, you don't get the full advantage. Am I missing something.

to clarify. i agree, and wrote it, the sawstop has a great safety feature and i don't claim a slider is safer (i have no idea if it is or not).

as for thin rips on a slider, I have seen jigs and methods that seem very simple, effective, accurate, repeatable, and intuitive. see this video on youtube, it's in German, but you'll easily see what they are doing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqzVglze9Nk

I do quite a bit of thin (1/16th to 1/4) and long (up to 3 feet) rips in hardwood and the slider method in that above linked video just made sense to me. I don't know though, I may use the slider for 6 months and think it's the same, worse, or better for what i do compared to my old sawstop. If I think it's materially worse than my old sawstop you'll see the slider in the sawmill creek classifieds. time will tell.

hope that helps.

[Keith Hankins]

Cool vid. Thanks.

[Tai Fu]

I wish Grizzly had a Taiwan version, but they seem to have an embargo on Taiwan, plus they absolutely will not reveal who made them like it's some trade secret or something. That alone makes me question the quality of the stuff... it limits accountability on the part of the manufacturer. I only seen that slider offered for sale but I do not know if there are other sliders with smaller footprint. There's not a lot of support for smaller scale woodworking here simply because people don't do that as hobbies here, so the only choices are massive industrial machines or tiny toy-like machines that are only for occasional use.

[Mike Heidrick]

I wish Grizzly had a Taiwan version, but they seem to have an embargo on Taiwan, plus they absolutely will not reveal who made them like it's some trade secret or something. That alone makes me question the quality of the stuff... it limits accountability on the part of the manufacturer. I only seen that slider offered for sale but I do not know if there are other sliders with smaller footprint. There's not a lot of support for smaller scale woodworking here simply because people don't do that as hobbies here, so the only choices are massive industrial machines or tiny toy-like machines that are only for occasional use.

Geetech
Chiu Ting Machinery Co Ltd , 78, Yuang Feng Rd, Taiping, Dist. Taichung, Taiwan 41161. TEL:886-4-22700258 FAX:886-4-22701096.

Every slider saw Grizzly has listed other than g0674 (germany), under the other specification, lists country of origin at Taiwan.

Those include G0699, G0493, G0623x, G0501, G0588, G0493x3, G0700

Geetech also makes the Sawstop.

[scott spencer]

Geetech
Chiu Ting Machinery Co Ltd , 78, Yuang Feng Rd, Taiping, Dist. Taichung, Taiwan 41161. TEL:886-4-22700258 FAX:886-4-22701096.

Every slider saw Grizzly has listed other than g0674 (germany), under the other specification, lists country of origin at Taiwan.

Those include G0699, G0493, G0623x, G0501, G0588, G0493x3, G0700

Geetech also makes the Sawstop.

Good info Mike. The G1023RL is also made in Taiwan AFAIK, but it's not a slider format in it's stock configuration.

[Tai Fu]

I found a cabinet saw, with specs similar to Sawstop cabinet saw (but without the safety feature) for far less than the Sawstop contractor saw. I think I will get that one if I get a tablesaw...

[Frank Trinkle]

Well..... I've had my 3HP PCS since it was a prototype. (I was one of the original testers). I can't imagine having been as satisfied with any other saw. Safety features aside, the design, fit, finish, and ease of use are unparalleled in my opinion. The only better saw for me is coming later this year when I replace my PCS with a Sawstop Industrial Cabinet Saw (ICS) with 5HP single phase motor.

I dressed up my PCS for these pictures. Sawstop and Incra rails, fence and router extension.... unbeatable combo!

278721278722278723278724

As a professional helicopter pilot, I MUST have my fingers, so the safety feature is paramount...beyond that the saw is just a perfect as can be!:)

[Ralph Butts]

I found a cabinet saw, with specs similar to Sawstop cabinet saw (but without the safety feature) for far less than the Sawstop contractor saw. I think I will get that one if I get a tablesaw...

Tai congratulations on your selection and I hope that you will be very happy with your choice should you decide to actually pull the trigger.

[Tai Fu]

You know after reading the sawstop manual, it's too much trouble for such an expensive saw. You have to cut wet wood in bypass mode but the problem is, you can't always tell if the wood is wet... particularly if you cut home depot woods... I heard that if the brake activates it can actually trash the saw because it places such a huge strain on the saw. Might be great for companies looking to limit liabilities though.

[Mike Heidrick]

You have Home Depot in Taiwan? Cool.

Guessing you have never seen a sawstop in person or been to a demo where the sawstop brake was demoed. Id do that before you state untruths or rumors about the sawstop again.

If in doubt if a wet wood would set off a brake, holding it against the blade while the saw is in green light ready mode will tell you if it would fire. I have cut green looking treated lumber with mine and it did not fire my brake. One touch of the blade tooth while armed just after the cut showed my finger would have set off the brake.

[Dave Kirby]

I would never buy a "contractor" saw if I could get a cabinet saw or slider at the same price. I guess unless I did all my woodwork at different jobsite locations every day or something. Then maybe I'd consider it.

[johnny means]

You know after reading the sawstop manual, it's too much trouble for such an expensive saw. You have to cut wet wood in bypass mode but the problem is, you can't always tell if the wood is wet... particularly if you cut home depot woods... I heard that if the brake activates it can actually trash the saw because it places such a huge strain on the saw. Might be great for companies looking to limit liabilities though.

No, the brake will not ruin the saw, no more than a panic stop will destroy my truck. You do have to the brake cartridge and, usually, the blade. Wood with a high moisture content, 2x4s and such won't trigger the brake. Wood that would set off the brake is literally wet, soaking, dropping wet, probably shouldn't be milled at all.

[Tai Fu]

Another thing is using small diameter blades for slotting fretboards, Sawstop won't even start with that one, but I've seen people loop a wire around the arbor to use moulding heads in the sawstop. It just seems like a lot of trouble when I could buy similar saw for 1/3 of the price.

[johnny means]

Wonder if this guy thinks that's a lot of trouble?

278836

Really, aren't all these concerns, non issues? If you think the extra insurance against this

278837
is worth the extra scratch, go for it. If not, save the extra cheese for some other cool toys. The fact is that a riving knife, a utilized guard, knowledge, and good habits will go a long way towards safety. The brake on the SS is just one link in the chain.

[Tai Fu]

There are many other tools in the shop, from bandsaw to jointer and even drill press that will do that to your hand. None of them have Sawstop technology (yet). The principle danger from tablesaw is kickback, and riving knife, guard, etc. prevents some of that. I had a kickback on a tablesaw a long time ago, from being stupid and crosscutting on the fence (because my shop teacher back then did that so I assumed it was ok). The guard caught it and I was only scared. Sawstop won't prevent a kickback, and in some cases it can't stop injuries if you touched the blade while moving too quickly. It's great for companies looking to reduce liability but I just think it's really overpriced...

[Frank Trinkle]

The Sawstop DOES have both a riving knife and guard in addition to the brake system. There are also a large number of stories of long-time safety-conscious professionals who in a moment of distraction, have sliced off fingers. It can happen to anyone.

Sawstop used to publish the pictures of their saves, but don't anymore. Not a single one ever needed anything more than a bandaid and an aspirin. There are also statistics in the USA that indicate more than 10,000 tablesaw accidents per year. Yes...10,000! The Tablesaw is THE single most dangerous machine in the shop...the statistics bear that out.

I realize that this is going to make the detractors unhappy, but I'll say it anyway.... The Sawstop technology is the most effective technical solution for preventing traumatic amputations on the tablesaw. If they made their technology available to other manufacturers without licensing costs, you can almost guarantee that Delta, Felder, MM, Laguna, Grizzly, Bosch, and most others would be incorporating it, but you can't blame Sawstop for protecting their patent and requiring royalties from any company wanting to use it.

Finally Tai, what is overpriced about the SS? The price isn't just about the brake. It's the overall design, fit and finish, technology, quality, superb dust collection, and exceptional customer service that all figure into the price...and in my opinion, much better than most other TS's, at a very, very reasonable cost.

Call me a Sawstop fanboy if you like, but I'd wear that like a badge of honor. There ain't many cases of buyer remorse from Sawstop owners, if any at all.

[Tai Fu]

Not sure about Taiwan, I find customer services tend to suck in Taiwan so I don't know if I'd pay extra for some manufacturer with a better customer service. I doubt Sawstop will do customer services for their Taiwan products, but instead it falls on the authorized dealer/distributor and they tend to suck big time. I'd like to see a review of Sawstop's overall quality vs. similar saws at 1/3 of the price. I have even seen someone sell Laguna products in Taiwan (just the vortex dust collection bucket) but I seriously doubt Laguna will provide any support for it, but instead will tell me to talk to their dealer. Thing about customer services here is unlike US customer services, they tend to be anal, be slow to respond to warranty claims, and absolutely will not accept returns unless there's a really good reason (most American companies would accept returns for stuff like buyer's remorse). Only very few companies in Taiwan have the same level of customer service as most American companies, and they're the exception rather than the rule. Like when I had problems with my bandsaw and told the dealer about it, they totally forgot about me.

So when I buy tools in Taiwan, I consider the sale to be on a as-is basis because very few would even bother to address warranty claims or provide any post-sale support. So I actually need to be really good at solving problems and have machine shops on speed dial in case I need replacement parts. I don't mean commonly used tools but stuff like bandsaws, tablesaws, etc.

You know any real tablesaw is a step up from this accident waiting to happen:

278846278847

It's a commercially sold "table saw" fixture made out of cheap plywood. You bolt a hand held circular saw (they even have purpose-made saws made for this application, heavier than most hand held "skilsaw") or router upside down, and use it as a tablesaw. Riving knife, guard, anti-kickback prawl? Forget about it! These contraptions are so common in Taiwan that it's all tool stores and hardware stores sell. When I say "Do you have a tablesaw?" They point to that. There is absolutely no way I will use this contraption because there's nothing to stop kick backs, plus I hate universal motors. Therefore any real cabinet or even jobsite saw is safer than this thing.

By the way if Sawstop is different in that they'll address warranty claims and even replace a bad machine for whatever reason (shipping damage, etc. like Grizzly would), without telling me to go talk to the distributor, them I'm sold on it.

[johnny means]

I actually think that knockdown tablesaw is pretty cool. Granted it is limited and probably would need some user made additiions, but paired with a TS 75, I could see it as a nice jobsite or small shop alternative.

[Chris Parks]

I actually think that knockdown tablesaw is pretty cool. Granted it is limited and probably would need some user made additiions, but paired with a TS 75, I could see it as a nice jobsite or small shop alternative.

There are thousands of these in Australia. They were more popular before TS's became available at affordable prices. They knock down completely to a box full of parts for transport or storage.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbGG1jbbqUA

[Ralph Butts]

[QUOTE= If they made their technology available to other manufacturers without licensing costs, you can almost guarantee that Delta, Felder, MM, Laguna, Grizzly, Bosch, and most others would be incorporating it, but you can't blame Sawstop for protecting their patent and requiring royalties from any company wanting to use it.
[/QUOTE]

I would love to take that bet though we will never have to worry about that happening.

[Andrew Joiner]

There are thousands of these in Australia. They were more popular before TS's became available at affordable prices. They knock down completely to a box full of parts for transport or storage.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbGG1jbbqUA

Great video. I like the miter gauge/featherboard device.

[Tai Fu]

That's different, it has a guard and riving knife which makes it safer. The product I mentioned has neither of these. Also I see the person in the video crosscutting with a fence which is very dangerous.

[Andrew Joiner]

That's different, it has a guard and riving knife which makes it safer. The product I mentioned has neither of these. Also I see the person in the video crosscutting with a fence which is very dangerous.
Yes Tai, I cringed when he did that. The saws fence looks like it can skewed away from the blade. If the sawyer did that it would be safer.

[Chris Parks]

Yes Tai, I cringed when he did that. The saws fence looks like it can skewed away from the blade. If the sawyer did that it would be safer.

It can be to a quite a large degree and used as a angled fence which is handy. If I was doing a lot of site work I think I would have one.

[Henry Kramer]

I really don't think that the Saw Stop is that expensive. I don't own one but I have looked them over at the store and they look as well made as any of the other Asian saws. I'm not sure how it compares in quality to the US made Unisaw because I have not seen a Unisaw in person in either in a Woodcraft or Rockler store for some reason. I wish that my PM66 could be retrofitted with the Saw Stop safety technology or even a riving knife. As far as other machines being dangerous, I would put the shaper right up there as a tool that can mangle you up pretty bad if you are not careful. It would be hard to make it much safer and still be able to use it. Lastly, as far as that Triton table saw video goes, I didn't like the crosscutting with the miter gauge and the fence at the same time. That looks like an accident waiting to happen to me.