Columbia Forest Products - 3/4" 4'x8' PureBond Red Oak Plywood with Okoume Back Grade

[Paul Glover]

I'm considering using 3/4" PureBond Red Oak with Okoume Back Grade Plywood for making cabinets in my garage. These are 4'X8' plywood sheet. The red oak face grade is B. The Okoume back grade is C. The core is KayCore. Any experiences or thoughts with this product? What is the normal cost per sheet?

[Paul Glover]

Please respond.. I am trying to purchase the product tomorrow...

[Art Mann]

If you are asking whether the material would serve the purpose, I would say definitely. I'm afraid you will have to be the judge of whether the appearance is acceptable.

[Paul Glover]

Any idea on the price per sheet?

[Phil Thien]

Around here (Milwaukee) we'd pay $40-$45 for 3/4 Oak plywood with rotary cut veneer, and about $65 to $75 with plain sliced veneer. I won't use rotary cut, I cannot stand the unnatural look of that stuff.

[Paul Glover]

Around here (Milwaukee) we'd pay $40-$45 for 3/4 Oak plywood with rotary cut veneer, and about $65 to $75 with plain sliced veneer. I won't use rotary cut, I cannot stand the unnatural look of that stuff.

You would not use rotary cut veneer even in the garage? Someone locally is selling 15 sheets of this product for $200. I saw the product in person and it looks pretty good. It is the rotary cut and not plain sliced veneer..

[Phil Thien]

You would not use rotary cut veneer even in the garage? Someone locally is selling 15 sheets of this product for $200. I saw the product in person and it looks pretty good. It is the rotary cut and not plain sliced veneer..

Well examine it carefully. As long as it is flat and the edges look uniform with few voids, I'd give it a shot.

I suppose even I would use rotary cut in the garage at that price.

[Paul Glover]

Well examine it carefully. As long as it is flat and the edges look uniform with few voids, I'd give it a shot.

I suppose even I would use rotary cut in the garage at that price.

Yes... The plywood is flat.. The edges has some voids....

[Paul Glover]

Anyone has any good plans for garage cabinets? This is my first time making cabinets. I am trying to make some large wall cabinets as well as 8 foot tall floor cabinets...

[John A langley]

You going to do face frame or euro

[Paul Glover]

You going to do face frame or euro

For a beginner, I would think face frame is the easiest? Is that true? Please advise.

[Peter Quinn]

At $13/sheet, thats cheaper than 1/2" CDX around here. And yes, thats more than acceptable IMO for cabinetry in a garage. But then again so is CDX IMO. All this is based on condition. You can wreck any grade of plywood by storing it poorly or in a wet environment, leaning it against a wall allowing it to bow, etc. If its dry and flat, relatively flat anyway, I call it a score. How do you know if its dry? Moisture meter is a good tool, otherwise you have to look at where its been stored. Its no fun cutting a pile of cabinet parts only to have them warp like crazy within hours or days due to acclimation issues.

It looks like the "kaycore" is considered a bit of an upgrade from colombia, meant to be more consistent in thickness tolerance for large manufacturers? They claim the HPVC (Hardwood plywood veneer something or other) standards allows .047" variation in core thickness for average grade plywood? Try doing regular dado construction when your plywood varies by almost 1/16" sheet to sheet, or center to edge. And much of it is actually that bad. So if this plywood is half decent it may be a pleasure to work with versus some of the options available.

Aesthetically, you have to make that choice for your self. Depends on your construction methods and goals. You can build boxes such that you can't ever see the back veneer, and with many cabinets once occupied, you can't even see the interior veneers much, so it makes little difference. For a large highly visible built in to be clear coated, with open shelving or glass doors, I'd go for a better product. For utility cabs in my garage? I just built a new garage and I'll be making mine from the dumpster at work. I work in a millwork shop so there are some decent options there, but still, you get the idea.

Frameless or FF? I guess as a beginner, it probably makes little difference, both styles will have their challenges. Face frame cabinetry can hide a lot of mistakes in box construction, but all the sins come back to you when its time to hang drawer slides. As long as the door openings are square your ok there. Frameless suggest euro cup hinges, which are far easier to install and more forgiving/flexible than say butt hinges, cheaper too versus good ones, but a really wracked euro box will still be no joy to hang doors on. I can tell you I find face frame easier because thats what I was trained on, I'm doing a frameless job presently and its got its challenges, all that edge banding, how to get large plywood panels glued and screwed together square with minimal locaters, etc. Of course with FF cabs you have mill and joint a decent volume of square stock rather precisely and then attach it to your boxes, there are lots of tricks to learn for doing this, its not rocket science but its not always obvious how to proceed either.

Plans? Never seen stock cabinet plans around, maybe others know of a source, but if you don't find any don't be surprised. Best bet, draw them yourself. That will for you to learn just how to make them, really gets the details in your head. Get a program, sketch up would do it and its free, work through the process. Thats at least as valuable a learning experience as cutting a pile of plywood IMO. For me I "design" and build on paper or on the computer, when I get into the shop, I'm already deeply understanding of the work I'm about to do. When I get somebody else's plans, especially 2-D line drawings with no isometrics, I have to study the plans considerably longer to understand all the transitions, and thats assuming you have all the "sections" you need to understand the work. When I draw something 3-D I've already turned ever corner in my mind, less stumbling blocks. You can also do the whole layout with a couple of story poles and some basic line drawings, but thats not my preference. I don't ride a horse to work anymore either.:rolleyes:

[Paul Glover]

At $13/sheet, thats cheaper than 1/2" CDX around here. And yes, thats more than acceptable IMO for cabinetry in a garage. But then again so is CDX IMO. All this is based on condition. You can wreck any grade of plywood by storing it poorly or in a wet environment, leaning it against a wall allowing it to bow, etc. If its dry and flat, relatively flat anyway, I call it a score. How do you know if its dry? Moisture meter is a good tool, otherwise you have to look at where its been stored. Its no fun cutting a pile of cabinet parts only to have them warp like crazy within hours or days due to acclimation issues.

It looks like the "kaycore" is considered a bit of an upgrade from colombia, meant to be more consistent in thickness tolerance for large manufacturers? They claim the HPVC (Hardwood plywood veneer something or other) standards allows .047" variation in core thickness for average grade plywood? Try doing regular dado construction when your plywood varies by almost 1/16" sheet to sheet, or center to edge. And much of it is actually that bad. So if this plywood is half decent it may be a pleasure to work with versus some of the options available.

Aesthetically, you have to make that choice for your self. Depends on your construction methods and goals. You can build boxes such that you can't ever see the back veneer, and with many cabinets once occupied, you can't even see the interior veneers much, so it makes little difference. For a large highly visible built in to be clear coated, with open shelving or glass doors, I'd go for a better product. For utility cabs in my garage? I just built a new garage and I'll be making mine from the dumpster at work. I work in a millwork shop so there are some decent options there, but still, you get the idea.

Frameless or FF? I guess as a beginner, it probably makes little difference, both styles will have their challenges. Face frame cabinetry can hide a lot of mistakes in box construction, but all the sins come back to you when its time to hang drawer slides. As long as the door openings are square your ok there. Frameless suggest euro cup hinges, which are far easier to install and more forgiving/flexible than say butt hinges, cheaper too versus good ones, but a really wracked euro box will still be no joy to hang doors on. I can tell you I find face frame easier because thats what I was trained on, I'm doing a frameless job presently and its got its challenges, all that edge banding, how to get large plywood panels glued and screwed together square with minimal locaters, etc. Of course with FF cabs you have mill and joint a decent volume of square stock rather precisely and then attach it to your boxes, there are lots of tricks to learn for doing this, its not rocket science but its not always obvious how to proceed either.

Plans? Never seen stock cabinet plans around, maybe others know of a source, but if you don't find any don't be surprised. Best bet, draw them yourself. That will for you to learn just how to make them, really gets the details in your head. Get a program, sketch up would do it and its free, work through the process. Thats at least as valuable a learning experience as cutting a pile of plywood IMO. For me I "design" and build on paper or on the computer, when I get into the shop, I'm already deeply understanding of the work I'm about to do. When I get somebody else's plans, especially 2-D line drawings with no isometrics, I have to study the plans considerably longer to understand all the transitions, and thats assuming you have all the "sections" you need to understand the work. When I draw something 3-D I've already turned ever corner in my mind, less stumbling blocks. You can also do the whole layout with a couple of story poles and some basic line drawings, but thats not my preference. I don't ride a horse to work anymore either.:rolleyes:

Thanks for your feedback... As a beginner I am excited but scared at the same time...

[Justin Ludwig]

Peter is right. As long as they're not in poor condition, that is a great price. Those sheets cost $45-50 in my neck of the woods.

I'd go FF for a first time build. You'll spend a lot of time edgebanding with an iron if you choose frameless. I'm not sure about programs available for the DIY crowds. I use Cabinet Vision and can't imagine hand drawing anymore. I think there are some threads in the Creek about free programs available or trials that could be used for your application.

Good luck!

[John TenEyck]

For a beginner, I would think face frame is the easiest? Is that true? Please advise.

Not to me, but they will be stronger if that's a concern.

John

[Paul Glover]

Peter is right. As long as they're not in poor condition, that is a great price. Those sheets cost $45-50 in my neck of the woods.

I'd go FF for a first time build. You'll spend a lot of time edgebanding with an iron if you choose frameless. I'm not sure about programs available for the DIY crowds. I use Cabinet Vision and can't imagine hand drawing anymore. I think there are some threads in the Creek about free programs available or trials that could be used for your application.

Good luck!

So it looks like this is a great deal on the wood...

[Phil Thien]

So it looks like this is a great deal on the wood...

Oh yeah, there is really no doubt about that.

If you have never built cabinets before, I'd consider going to your local library (hope you have a decent one, we've got a good system here in Milwaukee) and look for books on building cabinets. I'd get several and page through them and see if a method appeals to you, find something with which you're comfortable.

Edit to add: Kreg has some plans for making some cabinets/shelves using (obviously) their tools. But they may give you an idea on how stuff can be assembled quickly. You have to subscribe to their site to download the plans, but it may be worth it.