reamer

[Curtis Niedermier]

One of my next projects will be a shop stool. I plan to shape round legs and tenon them into an ash seat with tapered tenons. To taper the mortises, I was going to buy a tapered reamer from one of the Windsor chairmakers (not sure which one yet). Then I saw this on eBay: search item# 370786274725
There were several of these, and the descriptions said they are for machinists, plumbers, luthiers, etc. So can something like this be used for chairmaking? I didn't figure out the angle of the taper, but even if it's off a bit, the price is right. I don't have a lathe or I'd conisder making my own.

Any thoughts?

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

I use that, for well, reaming holes. The only issue with one like that, is a lot of them are small. When they get large, they get pricey. The one you show only goes up to 5/8". I have no idea how big the wholes for your legs need to be; 5/8" seems a bit on the small side. The cheapest route for larger reamers in wood seems to be the chair makers approach of a cone type thing with a scraper inset into it.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Actually - Lee Valley has some reamers that aren't too much money up front:

The large here goes up to 1 and 3/16, for under 30 bucks:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=54864&cat=1,180,42240,53317,54864

The one here is a little more adjustable, for a little under 50 bucks:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=54865&cat=1,180,42240,53317

Those might be better solutions. Another option would be to see if there's a local woodworking school or chairmaker that would let you borrow or use something.

[Steve Voigt]

Agree with everything Josh said. If you do decide to go the homemade chair reamer route, check out Jennie Alexander 's site, and blogs by Peter Galbert and Tim Manney; lots of good info on reamers.

[Bruce Haugen]

I made the one according to the model on Jennie Alexander's site and it worked very well. It was, however, a little difficult to line up with the sight lines because of the flat end. So, I made another one more in line with the one on Peter Galbert's site, with a conical end, which is also the one that Curt Buchanan uses. It is much easier to line up with the sight lines. I suspect one could be made without a lathe, especially since it's the blade that does the cutting and , I wouldn't think, require a perfectly formed wood cone. Buchanan recommends the 6° taper. That's a good enough recommendation for me. BTW, the price was right; I just used a keyhole saw blade with the teeth ground off and the edge ground at a 45° angle. It took maybe 2 hours to make.

[george wilson]

Those multi tooth reamers will make 6 sided holes in wood from inevitable chatter. The best ones for wood have just 1 cutting edge. LV sells those types.

[Curtis Niedermier]

Thanks guys. I'm going to sweet talk my uncle into turning one for me, and I'll pick it up at Christmas.

[Bruce Haugen]

George, do you have any thoughts on the degree of taper on the LV reamers? The reason I ask is that Curt Buchanan and Peter Galbert recommend 6°, but I don't know what Mike Dunbar recommends. I have reamed sockets and turned matching 6° tapers and those suckers really stick tightly. I agree about the single cutter reamers.

Thanks.

[Mark Hulette]

Not to hi-jack the thread but how do you determine the 6o taper? I've wanted to make one of these for a while but never really had a chance to research the turning technique to get an exact numerical taper.

Thanks!

[george wilson]

Sorry,I never made Windsor chairs. Well,1 back in 1964,but it wasn't a true Windsor. I don't know what angle Dunbar recommends. I am sure there must be a site dedicated to them. So many want to make them. I'm sitting on a Windsor right now. We found a small factory in Adamstown(or close to it) Pa. back in the 80's. He made nice ones unfinished for a reasonable price. Can't recall his name though.

[Bruce Haugen]

Not to hi-jack the thread but how do you determine the 6o taper? I've wanted to make one of these for a while but never really had a chance to research the turning technique to get an exact numerical taper.

Thanks!

If you take a look at Jennie Alexander's site (http://www.greenwoodworking.com/SawSteelTaperedReamerPlans), you will see that a typical keyhole saw (she calls it a compass saw, which it probably is, but my dad was a carpenter and that's what we called it) already is at the right angle (no pun intended). Simply grind off the teeth and then file or grind a 45º edge on both sides and there you have it. Anyway that's what I did and it works very well.

[Mark Hulette]

If you take a look at Jennie Alexander's site (http://www.greenwoodworking.com/SawSteelTaperedReamerPlans), you will see that a typical keyhole saw (she calls it a compass saw, which it probably is, but my dad was a carpenter and that's what we called it) already is at the right angle (no pun intended). Simply grind off the teeth and then file or grind a 45º edge on both sides and there you have it. Anyway that's what I did and it works very well.

Thanks Bruce! I looked at the site but didn't pick up that tidbit out--- duh. I bought the saw blade some months ago but never corelated that as being the proper angle!

Thanks again!

[Bob Glenn]

George, would that be Fred Emhoff? I think he's retired now, however he made nice spoon bits and a nice reamer that was a tapered cone with a cutting edge milled into the body. The angle was about 11 degrees, however, I've switched to 6 degrees now.

[george wilson]

The name seems familiar. But,I only met him once in a flea market,and another time to pick up the chairs about in 1987 or so.

[Steve Voigt]

Not to hi-jack the thread but how do you determine the 6o taper? I've wanted to make one of these for a while but never really had a chance to research the turning technique to get an exact numerical taper.

Thanks!

The advice about just following the taper on the blade is right on. But if you really want to geek out (and oh, do I), or if you are making a blade from scratch, you can use the formula length x 2tan(x/2), where x is the included angle, to find the difference in diameters on your cone. So, if you have a 10-inch blade, then 10 x 2(tan 3) = 1.048. Interestingly, these are not the numbers Jennie has in the article--she goes from 1 1/4 to 9/16, which is more like 4 degrees. Eli Bazarri's website says his reamers go from 1/14 to 5/16, which, assuming a 10-inch blade, would be about 5.4 degrees. That, or my math is wrong! :p
I corresponded with Tim Manney (on his blog) about a month ago, and he uses 1/16th thick blades for his reamers; he says the thicker blade helps a lot. They are also about 10 inches and go from 1 1/4 to 3/8.
Sorry for going all math nerd on everybody.

[Mark Hulette]

The advice about just following the taper on the blade is right on. But if you really want to geek out (and oh, do I), or if you are making a blade from scratch, you can use the formula length x 2tan(x/2), where x is the included angle, to find the difference in diameters on your cone. So, if you have a 10-inch blade, then 10 x 2(tan 3) = 1.048. Interestingly, these are not the numbers Jennie has in the article--she goes from 1 1/4 to 9/16, which is more like 4 degrees. Eli Bazarri's website says his reamers go from 1/14 to 5/16, which, assuming a 10-inch blade, would be about 5.4 degrees. That, or my math is wrong! :p
I corresponded with Tim Manney (on his blog) about a month ago, and he uses 1/16th thick blades for his reamers; he says the thicker blade helps a lot. They are also about 10 inches and go from 1 1/4 to 3/8.
Sorry for going all math nerd on everybody.

Geek away, Steve! Thanks for the info!

[Curtis Niedermier]

I'll probably use an old handsaw blade to make the blade for my reamer. So let's say I want to make a 6-degree taper. Does that mean there is a 6-degree difference from one edge to the other? Or does it mean that each side is 6 degrees from the center line? The second options looks more like the reamers I see sold on some of the chairmakers' websites.

[Sean Hughto]

I've made a few stools, and tried reaming, etc. For a shop stool, assuming you are making through tenons and wedging them, you don't need to mess with tapered mortises.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7123/7457643766_1e0e195a93_b.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8376/8547007768_2736410f83_b.jpg
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2728/4201582599_290dfaef09_o.jpg

[Chris Vandiver]

Really nice stools Sean.

[Sean Hughto]

Thanks, Chris. Just a form explained well by Mr. Dunbar in a couple articles over the years - nothing original but my own minor turning or wood choices. I wasn't trying to show off the stools so much as show Curtis that I was speaking from experience and not just asserting something "I think."

[Curtis Niedermier]

Actually, that's really helpful Sean. I'm good at overcomplicating things and am still learning when and where to apply various types of joints.

Did you taper the stretcher tenons/mortises since they aren't through/wedged?

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Love those, Sean! As beautiful as the wood is, the red lacquer look really speaks to me. Did you turn the seat scoops on those?

[Sean Hughto]

The stretchers are under compression in this layout as the shoulder to shoulder length is a bit longer than the legs would dictate when dry fit, as per Dunbar. So, no, no taper there either.

[Sean Hughto]

Thanks, Joshua. The "red lacquer" is Salem Red "Old Fashioned" milk paint sanded and coated with BLO. I like it too. That was the first one I made, and I think the splay is a bit wide - interesting enough, though, it has held up very well. The design is forgiving, I guess.

Yeah, I turned everything, the seats, legs and stretchers.

[Steve Voigt]

I'll probably use an old handsaw blade to make the blade for my reamer. So let's say I want to make a 6-degree taper. Does that mean there is a 6-degree difference from one edge to the other? Or does it mean that each side is 6 degrees from the center line? The second options looks more like the reamers I see sold on some of the chairmakers' websites.

Six degrees total. 3 degrees each side from the center line. Draw it out and you'll see. Though, as I said above, I think most of these reamers are actually more like 5 degrees. I just had another look at Jennie's article; she states that "most compass blades have a taper between 1:10 and 1:12." Now, 1:10 is 5.7 degrees, 1:12 is 4.7 degrees. So, if those are the slopes she's going for, then she definitely prefers less than 6 degrees, regardless of what it says.

[Steve Voigt]

Beautiful work, Sean. I really like the milk paint. Have you ever tried the black and red thing, where the black wears through to expose the red?
I turned a bunch of green oak chair legs this fall; they are drying now. This experience confirmed to me that I suck at turning! Your turnings look really nice, on the other hand. You must have a good sized lathe to swing those seats!