Resawing defect with Woodmaster B and grizzly G0514X

[David Kuzdrall]

Although I have gone through every variable that I know of and verified a correct setup (as far as I know) I wanted to post this here before I start replacing saw blades on my 19", 3HP G0514X.

below is the defect that at this point I suspect the blade of causing. I am referring to the deep waves going through this board which can be 1/32 - 1/16" or more from peak to trough. this happens regardless of board thickness (the one in the photo is around 7") and also seems to be consistent throughout the height of the work.

The roller bearings were originally set as per the manual (slight gap the thickness of a bill), then for a trail I placed them in contact with zero clearance and the defect did not improve. The upper guide is always set as close as possible to the work and I have adjusted the tension up and down with zero impact to the defect.

The blade in question is a 1" Woodmaster B with 2TPI that has been set back to the vendor once for a bad weld (the blade was not flush at the back and bounced off the rear guide).

Any thought on a cause for this before I try a new 1" resaw blade?

THX

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[Matthew Hills]

Do you get this with other blades on your saw?

any variation with feed rate?

Matt

[Richard Coers]

Blade isn't tight enough and/or too fast of feed.

[David Kuzdrall]

no (but I only have one other blade, a 3/8" no-name blade). i can get better resaw results with this blade.

I don't see any variation with feed rates other than that the frequency of that wave changes.

I cut a 4" piece of poplar just for kicks tonight at a very slow rate and saw the same issue.

[Andrew Hughes]

That's how my resaw blades start cutting when they are dulling.I have a 4t on my B20/20 that's leaving the same waves patten on anything 4inchs tall or better, unless I slowdown the feed rate.Time to send it out for sharpening.

[Josh Doran]

My saw blades do that too. I know they are sharp though (haven't seen a lot of use) and occur not just with resaw but any cut with thinner stock. Feedrate is also plenty slow. It's almost like the blade is following the set of the teeth. hmm.

[David Kuzdrall]

My saw blades do that too. I know they are sharp though (haven't seen a lot of use) and occur not just with resaw but any cut with thinner stock. Feedrate is also plenty slow. It's almost like the blade is following the set of the teeth. hmm.

You are describing the issue and one of my theories exactly. There seems to be quite a bit of set on the blade (which has very little use on it)...

[Erik Loza]

Blade isn't tight enough and/or too fast of feed.

This ^^^

"Inadequate blade tension" is how it looks to me. You are having to slow down and re-start up the feed rate because the blade keeps wandering during the cut, right?

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Jim Finn]

I re-saw a lot with a 5/8" carbide blade from Grizzly. Woodslicer blades work well but dull a lot faster than the carbide blades do. I think your problem is dull blades and not enough tension. Smaller blade will be easier to tension well. Just my experience.

[Prashun Patel]

I vote to try a different blade.

I have a G0514x2, and i use a no-name 3/8" 3tpi blade, and am not scientific about tension, guides setting or feed rate. I think there's enough forgiveness in those variables that they take a distant second seat to a sharp blade.

[Erik Loza]

Yes, getting the 1.0" blade into the correct tension range will be a lot more work than with a narrower blade. A lot of folks don't realize how much tension a blade that size wants in order to cut straight. No firsthand experience with that machine but it might make more sense to start with a 1/2" blade and go from there.

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[David Kuzdrall]

This ^^^

"Inadequate blade tension" is how it looks to me. You are having to slow down and re-start up the feed rate because the blade keeps wandering during the cut, right?

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

Erik, I am not changing the feed rate; I am just pushing slow and smooth and the result is pictured in my OP.

regarding tension, i do not have a gauge but I am almost max'd out according to the scale on this saw (it goes from 0-7 and I am 6.5)...I can almost move the saw across the floor with the amount of force required to fully engage the cam on the tension lever.

THX

[Erik Loza]

David, I still feel like it's a tension issue but you should try a different 1.0" blade and see if it does the same thing.

Just my 2-cents,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Mark Engel]

I've got the same saw, essentially, it's the X2B. I have the Woodmaster CT 1" 1.3tpi blade on it. My tension scale goes from 1 to 8 and I have the tension set to ~3.5. I haven't re-sawed anything lately, but I don't ever remember getting any grooves nearly that deep. This blade is in need of sharpening(or replacement) but it still gives a smoother cut than what I see in your picture.

My guess would be that the blade is the cause of your difficulties.

[Michael Dunn]

I used to get those same exact marks on anything I tried to cut with my Rikon 10-340. In my situation it was too high a feed rate and low blade tension. FWIW, check the drive belt tension too. Not enough drive belt tension will cause problems as well.

[Matthew Hills]

You can try to resharpen yourself:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UygEQ-079Ws

Matt

[Mark Engel]

Good video. A little long.

I'm going to try this on one of my old blades.

[Myk Rian]

Blade isn't tight enough and/or too fast of feed.
Bingo on both.

[Joe Hillmann]

You say you are nearly maxed out on blade tension but that doesn't mean much. When I used to help out on a band saw mill for one inch blades we would want from 2200- 2700 psi on the blade. We would get it tensioned up. Start the blade spinning, stop it, re tension it, make our first cut and tension it a final time. As the blade warmed up it would loose a lot of tension.

Your saw my not be capable of applying enough tension to run a 1 inch wide blade.


I should point out we also had a much faster feed rate on the mill than most vertical bandsaws would use so you may not need quite as much tension.

[glenn bradley]

The OP states that variations in tension are not changing the behavior. I agree that my first reaction is tension, feed rate, blade condition or some combination. The Lennox blades are high quality so if the blade is new I would suspect a defect. If the blade is not new you may have touched a piece of "something" and whacked the set. If the blade has had several 100 lineal feet of material run through it, steel blades are wear parts and have a finite life. Like brakes on your car, you can run them past their optimum life but, things don't go well.

I have a Grizzly 17" saw so we are in the same general camp. I run Woodslicer, Timberwolf and Ellis blades; I didn't like the Ellis. I use the flutter method to set the tension on all of them. I get good tracking and cut quality. The Woodslicer is cleaner but slower, the Timberwolf is rougher but faster, the Ellis is rough and slow. I feed "about" an inch per second on 5" - 7" hardwoods. Faster on shorter stuff and slower on taller stuff. Listen to the saw and it will tell you where your sweet spot is for a given material / blade / feed rate combination.

If you only have two blades, picking up a few more won't hurt anything and it would prove out the blade as a problem or not. Timberwolf often has a buy 3 get 1 free deal but, it seems you have to ask for it. Don't get me wrong, among lower priced blades the TW blades wear faster than others but, they cut faster and in my experience it seems to balance out as to the amount of work you will get out of a blade. The Woodslicer cuts smoother and slower as mentioned. Moving to a carbide blade will gain you smoothness and longevity but, I would solve your problem first. If it is not the blade, slapping an expensive carbide blade on your machine would at best be a disappointment and at worst, cause premature wear to the blade.

[David Kuzdrall]

It looks like perhaps everyone may have been correct with their help on this issue...

Being somewhat new to the bandsaw world and not in possesion of a tension gauge, I may have underestimated the tension requirement for a 1" bi-metal blade. Just to rule out tension I engaged the cam lever and literally put as much tension as I could apply to the screw, and once the scale went from 7 to 8 (the max) it instantly changed the way the blade sounded and deflected. I then put a test piece through it and saw most of the wave eliminated.

I was left with marks that look like they are from a tooth set too far (left board) or some other blade defect but it is no longer the deep waves from the original board on the right.

I assume that the tension was too low and that I have one (or more) teeth our of alignment, so both issues were present.

With the saw maxed out on tension, I wonder if this bi-metal blade is just too much for the 19" grizzly (perhaps the cut would smooth out even more with higher tension) or if my compression spring has lost some of force. It seems like the quick fix would be a 3/4" bi-metal blade that would allow enough head-room in the tension department.

Thank you to everyone who has provided input on this issue.
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DK

[glenn bradley]

That looks like good progress. I run the tension on a 3/4" steel blade around '4' on my 17" saw but, that is subjective as I run the blade wherever the flutter method leaves me. It may be that a bi-metal takes a bit more punch to track correctly(?). I'm not sure what the scale is on your pics so it may not be that bad but, since it was buggin' me, I just cut this cherry with a 3/4" Timberwolf 2-3 skip moving a bit less than an inch per second:

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[Jim Barstow]

I have a grizzly 514x2 with a wood slicer blade (from Highland woodworking) and tension set at about 4. It tracks absolutely straight and the cut is very smooth. If the blade supplier sent you a blade with a bad weld I wouldn't trust them. Try a different blade from a different supplier.

[David Kuzdrall]

That looks like good progress. I run the tension on a 3/4" steel blade around '4' on my 17" saw but, that is subjective as I run the blade wherever the flutter method leaves me. It may be that a bi-metal takes a bit more punch to track correctly(?). I'm not sure what the scale is on your pics so it may not be that bad but, since it was buggin' me, I just cut this cherry with a 3/4" Timberwolf 2-3 skip moving a bit less than an inch per second:

276906276907

Your marks are still much finer than mine but I can't add any more tension with this setup...I will get my hands on one of the 3/4" bi-metal Timberwolf blades and see what happens.

Thanks for the photos!

[glenn bradley]

I didn't think to mention this but, I am using a stacked featherboard to assure consistent pressure and contact with the fence. Let me see if I can find an old pic . . . darn, no luck. I position the featherboards so that they are about 60% ahead of the teeth and the rest behind.

--- UPDATE ---

I am such a dork sometimes . . . if you can't find a picture, why not just go take one? Doh!

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