new router for D4

[bill walton]

I'm fixing to purchase a new router to set up in a dedicated manner for blind dt joints with my D4. My other handheld is a 690 which is a good dependable unit but I was wondering if there was a better alternative for the intended purpose. TIA

[Brent Smith]

Bill,
I've used a couple of routers on the jig and have found the 690 to be the most comfortable for me.I have 2 of them dedicated to making thru dovetails in 3/4 stock.On both I replaced the base with a clear one,just to make things easier to see.
Brent

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

I have a small PC dedicated to the few dovetails I do. Not sure which model it is. Similar to the DeWalt 610, I believe. What I don't like about either of these is the no soft-start. Too easy to 'jerk' into a template. DAMHIKT. :-(

[Jim Becker]

KC brings up a good point...if you can swing it, go for the VS/soft start version. It almost doesn't matter what brand as your comfort is more important. Until I got the Festool OF 1010, I used my DeWalt DW618 with my D4 with great success and it also took the Leigh dust hood nicely, too.

[Dev Emch]

Hi Bill...

The 690 has been around for many many years. Unless someone ever gets around to installing a micrometer barrel adjuster on a router, I see no reason to change. Even so, a plunge router base is available for the 690 and this would be the best candidate for putting on the barrel adjuster. But I also wonder how useful such an adjuster would be above and beyond what we all do these days to configure the routers for use with the D4.

The sad truth is that the 690 is overpowered for the D4. But to go down in size would mean using the 7/8 HP router. I forget the exact model number here. But PC made a heritage version of this router a year or two back when they made the heritage series of tools. I love these tools. They were made with polished bodies like they once were back in the 1950s. But in looking at using this router on the D4, I found that it has a 1/4 inch chuck and no way to swap out the collet for say an 8 mm or 1/2 inch collet. PC actually makes a 690 collet which supports the 8 mm shank so you dont need to monkey with converter collets from Liegh. The extra material you get with the 8 mm shank is welcome and its a nice compromise between 1/4 in and 1/2 in shanks.

In looking at many newer routers, I have to say I am not happy. They are certainly nice but the feature list begins to grow. Items you pay for and not always use. The soft start is novel but in no way improves your work. If the lack of a soft start is damaging templates or your work, your not doing your work correctly! How many generations of woodworkers learned on the PC 690? Three, four, five? Yup, its a fixture for sure! The one thing you need to know about this unit is this.... ALWAYS CHECK THAT THE SWITCH IS IN THE OFF POSITION PRIOR TO PLUGGING IT IN. I have two of these and they both have the old toggle switch. So once you get used to positioning and then turning on the router, you will be O.K. Matter of fact, you should do this as well even if your using a soft start router. A soft start router can still chew up things on a badly positioned start if your careless here.

My words of caution about some of the newer routers is this. At the end of the day, you need a universal motor and two bearings. Everything else is gravy. If you loose a soft start module, there will be no repair of this unit. Your going to have to buy one from parts and PC parts is not the nicest group to deal with esp. after the B&D buy out. And these types of parts are all murphy-certified. So as soon as PC clears all the parts out of inventory and announces they will no longer service your model of router, then that is when your module goes on the fritz. So I personally try to avoid consumer grade microelectronics in the wood shop. Its gimmicktry that will cost money and let you down sooner or later.

Also note that every time a new router jig comes out, it usually designed to support the 690 style base. The first adapters available have always been for the 690 base and these often prove to be the easiest and most simple as well. Complex conversion adapters are often on the quickest lost item list. On a 690 used for doing tails on the D4, all I need are the two brass template bushings used by the D4.

So all things being equal, I think your idea of using a 690 for this purpose is valid. In fact, I would also prefer to find older 690 routers because the newer onces appear to have a speed control on them which is not needed. Its pointless to do the throttle-up dance when cutting dovetails.

Hope this helps....

[bill walton]

Fortunately, the 690 I have is the soft start variable speed model. Guess I'll use it and perhaps spring for another for other work. I would like to get the 690 set up for Dts in 3/4 material like some of you. Brent, did you purchase the clear bases or make them? Jim, it seems like the 1010 only has an 8mm collet. Most of my bits are 1/2 with a few 1/4. I like my other ftools but that seems like an issue?
Thanks again

[Steve Rowe]

I must disagree with the blanket statement that soft start is novel and unneccessary. While it may not directly improve your work, it does improve safety which allows you to continue to work. I have a Hitachi TR-12 router without softstart that will wrench right out of your hands if you are not careful and that is with any size bit. This router is now dedicated to the router table. I believe that the statement is probably true for most low power routers including the 690 router which I have without soft start. I have 3 other routers with variable speed and I must confess, I never change speed settings.

Steve

[Mike Stanton]

What is the d4 not sure Mike :confused:

[Hikmet C. Sakman]

Hi Kirk,

Haven't you smashed one of those on a concrete floor??? ;-) perhaps it was a crapsman model... i can't recall...

Long time no hear Kirk... How are you keeping?

Chico...

Anyway, My suggestion would be the Bosch 1617EVS combo base.

[Hikmet C. Sakman]

Dev, I am sorry... don't get me started on 690! I'll just say... Model T has been around for a long time too.... OK drop the sarcasm, just of it is that there are much better choices out there. Just because something around for a long time does not mean it is the most suitable for the job. Bosch has the most useful depth adj. system and which is why I prefer 1617EVS. It really suits the DT jig work.

Chico...

[Dev Emch]

Hickmet...
I am not comparing the 690 to a model T ford. Using your car analogy, it would be more like comparing it to the chevy small block V-8. That was first introduced in the 1950s and is now still powering the newest corvettes with 400 plus inches and 500 HP. It is also used thoughout the GM lineup.

What makes this engine so venerable is that you will never be at a loss to find new after market parts. Show me a model T ford engine and finding parts becomes difficult. Even more difficult if I need to hunt down pistons for a packard engine block.

My first router was a black and decker with an orange top. Got it during the late 1970s. Boy was I glad to unload that thing on ebay! Everytime I needed to use it, I had issues. Everytime a new jig came out, my adapters were never available. The ones for the PC 690 were always available and usually the first available. As you migrate away from the PC standard, the adapters become more expensive and more complex. Its a real pain. I finally machined a PC 690 plastic base plate to fit the black and decker to partially resolve this. The final straw was that the height adjustment never stayed put. It was always moving downwards very slowly making constant depth of cut impossible.

What i like about the 690 is its serviceability and versatility. Its as much at home in a router table or multirouter as it is in a standalone application like cutting dovetails on a D4. It can even be used in light weight CNC routers. And it can be serviced quickly and with ease. Bearings are a snap to change. Collets are available from many sources and often same day. Power cords and switches are changed out with ease and often with a trip to the borgs or radio shack for minor parts.

But if I had my choice, I would prefer to abandon the uni motor completely. The amish use routers all the time and these appear to be air driven. In fact, I saw a photograph in which an amish shop had a 690 modifed to run on air!!!! I know about the badger router but I am looking for that air powered 690 style router. I find air powered hand tools to be much nicer than the electron burning counterparts. If you have ever used an IR 3/8 inch air drill, you would know what I am talking about.

But please bear in mind that my ramblings are my experience. You may have different experiences and as such, I would not try to sell you on vintage 690 technology. At the end of the day you will use what you bought and hopefully you will be happy. I personally am quite satisfied with the 690 and freely admit that many of the concerns mentioned about it here are actually true and valid.

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

Hi Kirk,

Haven't you smashed one of those on a concrete floor??? ;-) perhaps it was a crapsman model... i can't recall...



Hey Chico.

Not Craftsman...it was a Makita. Just as bad in my book. :(

I finally picked that up off the floor and threw it out a month or so ago.

KC

[Jim Becker]

What is the d4 not sure Mike

Mike, the 'D4' referenced is the Leigh Industries D4 Dovetail Jig.

[Hikmet C. Sakman]

Now it doesn't have the same effect, but then, especially the way you were explaining,,, it was just toooo funny! Those were the days!

Nice to see you around again. Last I know, you quit that mesquite production shop, right?

Take Care,

Chico...

[Hikmet C. Sakman]

Hi Dev,

Long story short, I wouldn't even begin to compare 690 with 1617, which is way above and beyond 690. I've got 7 routers, I had three 690's and I gave away 2 and sold one of them. I also got rid of two 7518's. Anyway, I really don't care about servicability of hand power tools. They are disposible to me. If they work 3 to 4 years, that's great and anything beyond that is a bonus. I am after the tools does the job with least vibration, aggrevation (to the user=ME) and feature to make my life easier. That's where I am coming from.

1617 is widely used in CNC machines by the way.

Chico...

[Dev Emch]

Hickmet and everyone else for that matter....

I was a porter cable supporter but you can read from my posts that I am not happy with the direction in which they are going. Period. End of Paragraph. Any of you corporate exec types who wish to argue the business case of what PC is up to can spare us the details.

The void at the top created by this PC situation appears to have been filled by the german company Festool and one other I am looking into right now. Their name is Mafell. Also a german company. But the product line overlap is not perfect so you may wind up with a Festool router and a Mafell chain mortiser. The Mafell chain mortiser is used in heavy duty timber framing operations which is why is has to be portable.

I would like to find a really cool and well made air powered router. If any of you guys know of this item, let us know. I would email the amish about this but for obvious reasons, I dont think I will get a reply.

[Hikmet C. Sakman]

Hi Dew,

I don't have any axe to grind with PC. My only problem is that they've been almost refusing to improve their routers. There are much better ones out there and when I see people recommend these outdated, almost ancient PC routers such as 690 and even 7518; especially on the grounds of "popularity" then I feel compelled to chime in. In my mind, I am doing a favor to some who's in the marker for router(s) and I don't want them to go thorough the same mistake I did. That's all really.

Chico... (aka Hikmet C. Sakman)

[Dev Emch]

I agree which is why I now support Festool in the electron burning category. You cannot go wrong with the green and black!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!