Can I make a bell?

[Leigh Betsch]

I'm not sure where to post this question but I figure here is a good place to start. After all a bell is a musical instrument isn't it?
I'd like to make a bell as a high school graduation present for my nice, she wants to be a teacher and teachers need school bells, don't they?
I'm thinking about turning one out of metal on my metal turning lathe. And then making some sort of wood structure like a bell tower. This would be relatively small, something that could set on a desk.
Is this possible? Could I get good tone or would it be too small and sound terrible?
Any of you instrument makers ever try this?

[Charles Wiggins]

I am not an instrument maker, but I did take a stab at casting bells via lost wax. The results were OK but they aren't very resonant. I didn't really have the setup to turn them but I imagine that the results would have been better if I have been able to even up the walls and control the shape better. If I were going to do it again, I would probably start with a wooden model and sand cast it, then clean it up on the lathe. If you were doing it in small enough scale I don't see any reason you couldn't start with a cylindrical billet of brass or bronze and turn the thing that way. You'd just have more waste.

Bell design is a very specialized branch of musical instrument design. Getting it "right" can be tough, but since you're talking about a single bell, and not a carillon where the notes have to be precise, as long as you get a basic bell shape it should be fine for a gift.

[Alan Caro]

Leigh Betsch,

A charming idea.

I have never made a bell, but have had a peripheral interest in it, from the standpoint of learning about casting techniques. It seems that a "bell-like" object is not extremely complicated, but there are subtleties.

Having good results that are not a dull clank cow bell seem to require specialized design knowledge and sand casting is involved and in my view heavy work handling 2300 degree material. As it's an interesting thing to learn, I would encourage consideration of doing a sand or probably better for making one or two- lost wax. The results would be more probable if you used an existing bell to make the mold.

The process with hand bells as a sand casting >

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lYEpRZjfaI

> but sand casting is a technique more geared to production and requires special materials, techniques, and a furnace- a very, very hot furnace.

Lost wax investment molding is a more realistic possibility as you could make the wax mold and the pouring and venting attachments the "sprues" and then deliver it to a foundry for pouring. The sprues are cut off and then the ball is turned inside and out to profile. However, again, the profile needs to be done with a guide that follows the exact shape or the thickness will never be correct. The architect Paolo Soleri, to support his Arizona "Arcosanti" project made and sold bells to support his ecological environment project and those were cast in Aluminum I think by a "lost styrofoam" method and used in strings as wind chimes.

To turn one from solid would be really time and tool-consuming. Whether a bell could be spun in the manner of a bowl, but that is only possible in very soft material like Aluminum or very thin stainless, and while the form might be correct it might not respond as a bell. Or it might- I've had spun metal bowls with a very good tone!

One other method would be to use an existing bell and concentrate on a custom handle, stand, and presentation box.


Alan Caro

PS> For entertainment relief after a hot day in the foundry, there is a wonderfully epic movie about bell-making, the mid-60's film by Andrei Tarkofsky, "Andrei Rublev" about a 14th Century monk and icon painter who rallies his and the spiritual community by making a vast bell.

[Leigh Betsch]

I don't know if this is a good idea. I was hoping to just turn one on my lathe but the more I think about it it would be hard to get the right shape on the inside. I'd like to take up casting but I don't really have the time to start another hobby. This maybe one of those ideas that doesn't get off the drafting board.

[Charles Wiggins]

I don't now if this is a good idea. I was hoping to just turn one on my lathe but the more I think about it it would be hard to get the right shape on the inside. I'd like to take up casting but I don't really have the time to start another hobby. This maybe one of those ideas that doesn't get off the drafting board.

Leigh,

Another approach you might take is to check and see if there is an art school near you that has a sculpture program that includes casting. When I was a sculpture student folks would sometimes contact the art department looking for a student who could do some specialty work for the on the cheap. I once replicated an iron skeleton key in brass because the owner couldn't find a locksmith who could do it.

Cheers,
Charles

[Dan Hintz]

If you have a wood lathe, I'd probably aim for that before using the metal lathe. A disc of brass could be quickly turned down / formed to a nice bell shape, and you'd have a consistent thickness throughout. You'll need a few extra turning tools, though.

[ray hampton]

I would try to spin form the brass in a lathe, making a wood mold for the form will be cheaply than turning a solid block of brass

[Leigh Betsch]

No wood lathe in my shop. I sold it, YUK!, just don't like wood turning. I still have the chisels, gouges, skews and whatever else they are called. I could make them work well enough to make a wood pattern (using my metal lathe) and then try to form a metal disk around it by heating and beating. This sounds like it might turn out to be a bit crude for what I'm visioning.

[Dan Hintz]

No wood lathe in my shop. I sold it, YUK!, just don't like wood turning. I still have the chisels, gouges, skews and whatever else they are called. I could make them work well enough to make a wood pattern (using my metal lathe) and then try to form a metal disk around it by heating and beating. This sounds like it might turn out to be a bit crude for what I'm visioning.

Leigh, what I (and Ray) were suggesting is called metal spinning. You create the form out of wood (on the lathe), then a thin metal disc is slowly pushed over the form (also while spinning on the lathe). The disc takes all of the shape of the form, and since you can use a pre-made sheet, you know the bell would be of (roughly) equal thickness throughout. That will be difficult to do on the metal lathe if you don't have a follower.

[Leigh Betsch]

Sound interesting. But no time to learn that much new stuff. I think I might give it one shot at turning it from the solid and if it doesn't look promising scratch the idea.
Thanks for the input! :)

[Charles Wiggins]

Leigh, what I (and Ray) were suggesting is called metal spinning. You create the form out of wood (on the lathe), then a thin metal disc is slowly pushed over the form (also while spinning on the lathe). The disc takes all of the shape of the form, and since you can use a pre-made sheet, you know the bell would be of (roughly) equal thickness throughout. That will be difficult to do on the metal lathe if you don't have a follower.

While interesting, I don't think one would ever get much of a bell chime out of a spun disc. I think you'd end up with more of a sound like a cymbal. In fact, that's how cymbals are made, more or less.