Hunter Hercules Carbide Tool

[Glen Blanchard]

I am wondering if anyone here has experience with this tool. The primary disadvantage to most carbide tools is that they scrape and don't yield a nice finished surface. The Hunter carbides, however, don't really scrape as a result of the configuration of the carbide cutter itself. So I am wondering how much better a surface it creates when compared to a more routine carbide, ala Easy Wood Tools.

Is there anyone who uses the Hercules tool or can speak for the quality of a finished cut made with this tool?

[Roger Chandler]

I am not sure about the Hercules tool.........I have two Hunter hollowing tools.....one a straight and one swan neck........they are both carbide [round] tipped. I usually do a finish cut with the angle at about 35 degrees.........light pass and the angle will produce a fairly smooth finish cut.

[Rick Markham]

I will echo Roger's assesment, I frequently use a small round carbide cutter (nearly exclusively for hollowing now) and at a 35 degree to 45 degree angle, I can take beautiful whispy finishing cuts and get a nearly flawless inside finish. If you bite too hard you will get tear out with them.

[Michael Stafford]

The Hercules is an interesting tool. It is heavy and well suited for roughing the gnarliest of blanks particularly those with stones and embedded soil. Mike Hunter actually turned a paving block with a Hercules. It is great for roughing but can then be used to clean up tear out by riding the bevel.

The best way to use any Hercules tool is to find the bevel and ride it. The cutters all have a bevel. It is small but once you find it the curly wispy shavings that will peel off the tool are wonderful to see. It is one of my favorite tools to clean up tear out on the outside of a blank. I use the Hunters on all of my boxes particularly the hard dense woods which the Hunter tools love. Properly used you can get a finish that almost needs no sanding. Hunter tools are not scrapers and used as such will give a poor finish.

I use all the Hunter tools and I am a friend with Mike Hunter. I have no financial interest in his company although I did demo for him on the Woodturning Cruise. While on the cruise we turned birch nearly every day and with the Hunter Hercules I was able to turn bowls from rough logs to 1/8" thick bowls using nothing but the Hercules. We sold a lot of Hercules tools on that trip.

The Hunter #5 straight and #5 swan neck are the top of the line for hollowing and undercutting in all kinds of materials. I use them nearly every time I turn.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Forgive the ignorance, but I'm having a hard time imagining "riding the bevel" on the Hunter. I got one when they first come out, and all I can do (on the bevel) satisfactorily is across the bottom. I can't figure out how you could ride the bevel on the transition of the bowl bottom and sides of a bowl. Or box. And use a 35 or 45 degree angle. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

TIA

[Jim Burr]

Sorry Glen, but your assessment of scrape vs shear cut of the carbide tool is just false. They can do either...based on the skill of the user. There are three basic shapes the a few sub-shapes. The major shapes are square, radius and round. Don't forget I said sub-shapes. Skilled users can use the major shapes to create very nice shavings. It will offend many here, but I do it on pens daily. Before you bash a tool...learn how to use it. Why sand when you can shear with a carbide and go to finish?

[Michael Stafford]

Kyle, you find and ride the bevel exactly as you do with any other tool. Start with the heel of the tool rubbing lightly on the wood and gradually raise the handle until shavings appear. Works every time it is tried. I will admit it takes more practice with the Hunters as the bevel is small but once you get used to it, it is easy to do.

I don't understand what you mean by "ride the bevel on the transition of the bowl bottom and sides of a bowl"? If you have a continuous curve from the rim through the sides to the bottom it is easy to follow that curve. If you are turning "dog bowls" with straight sides and flat bottoms I can't help you there.

I use the Hunters on the inside of boxes all the time. The only thing they will not do is cut a square shoulder at the bottom and I do that with a conventional square scraper modified slightly to make it easier to do.

By the way, the new Hunter Ospreys are gouges with carbide tips and are much easier for people to use like a normal gouge, i.e. ride the bevel. They will not replace your bowl gouge but they are wonderful for cleaning up tear out. I also use them on smaller items like my birdhouses and finials, pendants etc. Not much sanding needed with these tools cutting with or against the grain.

[robert baccus]

It is confusing here because the carbide cutters come in at least 2 profiles as Glen pointed out. The cup shaped cutters really do cut like a gouge and readily produce curls. The flat topped cutters are really scrapers and can be coaxed to make curls but there is a huge difference in the speed of cutting--depending on the wood. I ordered replacement tips and found the suppliers are very fuzzy about this. Anyone for some very cheap round scrapers? And like Mikey says, they do bevel cut well.

[Glen Blanchard]

Sorry Glen, but your assessment of scrape vs shear cut of the carbide tool is just false. They can do either...based on the skill of the user. There are three basic shapes the a few sub-shapes. The major shapes are square, radius and round. Don't forget I said sub-shapes. Skilled users can use the major shapes to create very nice shavings. It will offend many here, but I do it on pens daily. Before you bash a tool...learn how to use it. Why sand when you can shear with a carbide and go to finish?

Jim - I know the Hercules can either scrape or shear dependent upon the tool presentation. Maybe the non-Hunter carbides can shear as well, but due to the orientation of the cutter it seems like it would be much more difficult to get a shear cut. Or are you referring to just rotating the cutting tip to 30* - 45*? Regardless, the Hunters are touted as being an 'apples to oranges' comparison with other carbide tools, due I assume to their distinctively different cutter architecture (they are shaped more like a cup and less like a pancake). It is said that they primarily shear rather than primarily scrape when presented properly. I am trying to get an idea of, when used to shear cut, how close the finished surface approximates one created with HSS. I presume, as Micheal has stated, that the best cut is derived when the cutter is supported by the bevel. That bevel is much smaller than on a bowl gouge, but there is indeed a bevel - unlike non-Hunter carbide cutters.

As an aside, Hunter (to my knowledge) only offers a round shaped cutter.

Let me also add that I was not bashing carbide tools. I was trying to say (albiet probably poorly) that although a non-Hunter carbide can create a very nice finished surface, it does not typically produce as fine a surface as HSS.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzrLN8SQ8ms

268473

[Michael Stafford]

Glen, I respectfully disagree with you about the surface left by a Hunter tool. I have never been able to achieve a mirror finish in end grain with a HSS tool. The more dense the wood it the better the cut when using a Hunter tool. In rosewoods and similar dense woods I can achieve a finish that does not need but a little sanding with 1200 grit. This is true, of course, only if my tool control is good that day. Not all days are the same.

And you are correct that Hunter tools only come with round nano grain carbide cutters.

[Glen Blanchard]

Glen, I respectfully disagree with you about the surface left by a Hunter tool. I have never been able to achieve a mirror finish in end grain with a HSS tool. The more dense the wood it the better the cut when using a Hunter tool. In rosewoods and similar dense woods I can achieve a finish that does not need but a little sanding with 1200 grit. This is true, of course, only if my tool control is good that day. Not all days are the same.

And you are correct that Hunter tools only come with round nano grain carbide cutters.

Michael - There is not really anything for you to disagree with as I have never used a Hunter tool, so I have no first hand knowledge. It has always been said that HSS will produce a better surface than any carbide. My premise was made based on that assumption.

Your comments really make me want to try out a Hercules.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Micheal, sorry again, but as you run the transition from bottom to side, the handle must swing away. Eventually, I hit the other side of the bowl with the handle, unless it's very wide/shallow. On a box, it happens very quickly. Am I missing the big picture? Same thing happens with the Termite.

Thanks, I appreciate the help. I do enjoy the Hunter, just that I find it very limited, and you seem to be able to turn the entire project with it and I can't figure it out. Unless its just painfully obvious that I can't see it.... Done that before......

[robert baccus]

Michael is right remembering that bowl/vase shapes vary a lot. Doing mostly vases and HF I usually use the 3/16" shaft and swivel holder with the very small Hunter bit and there is nowhere that it will not go. Especially good just below necks and bowl openings.